darren_mc Posted June 28, 2014 Report Share Posted June 28, 2014 hi did anyone who was beating last season tax code change this year or did you get a tax bill in april. just interested for the new season Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CharlieT Posted June 28, 2014 Report Share Posted June 28, 2014 Why would your code change ? You just declare beating income on your tax return every year and pay what's due. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darren_mc Posted June 29, 2014 Author Report Share Posted June 29, 2014 Why would your code change ? You just declare beating income on your tax return every year and pay what's due. sorry never had anything to do with tax returns my employer sorts all that out. Just heard that 2nd jobs have a higher rate of tax Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moors Man Posted June 29, 2014 Report Share Posted June 29, 2014 Second jobs are no different in tax to main jobs. You will pay tax on everything you earn though however, assuming your main job pays more that £10,000 pa. The shoots my son went beating on last year deducted tax at source. Its all a bit of a pain though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ColinF Posted June 29, 2014 Report Share Posted June 29, 2014 Why would your code change ? You just declare beating income on your tax return every year and pay what's due. HMRC can collect underpaid tax from earlier years by adjusting the PAYE code in your main job. If you have to do a tax return, you can elect to have tax liabilities of up to £2,000 collected via PAYE. If you don't have to complete tax returns, HMRC can still collect unpaid tax via PAYE. If the shoot that you beat for is making RTI submissions, HMRC will calculate the underpayment and collect the tax in the following years PAYE code. They will also try to collect tax for the current tax year. So if you had £1,000 of untaxed beating income in 2013/14, they will assume that you will have the same amount in 2014/15 and collect the tax due on that via you PAYE code. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
norfolk dumpling Posted July 2, 2014 Report Share Posted July 2, 2014 I'm having to register on HMRC site soon to declare last seasons beaters wage. Accountant buddy says register now, get log-in code then declare earnings. The tax will be taken next year by adjusting next years code. You will also be asked for estimate of earnings for subsequent years. Another friend, who does p/t work for a parking firm, has already declared his earnings for the first time (wrong I know but we were talking about £100pa plus a few benefits) has decided not worth the trouble. The parking firm have struggled to recruit so it's not just shoots that are suffering. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
norfolk dumpling Posted July 2, 2014 Report Share Posted July 2, 2014 Forgot to add (& this was the purpose of previous post - old age??) will be doing it on-line as I'm told this is far quicker and if you have half a brain, far easier and HMRC like it too. Exciting eh? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Piebob Posted July 2, 2014 Report Share Posted July 2, 2014 I did it online for the first time last year. I don't recall it being very difficult but you just need to make sure you have all the relevant figures to hand. Easy enough, but if you need to factor in other things like different sources of income, shares, benefits, dividends, rental income, etc etc then it becomes more tricky. But you'd need all that info anyway. As your buddy says register now, as I seem to recall they send out your username and/or passwords via snail mail so no instant access. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
malantone Posted July 4, 2014 Report Share Posted July 4, 2014 (edited) When you are declaring beater income, can you at the same time claim expenses for equipment, :- Leggings, coats, waterproofs etc, fuel to get to the shoot, price of dog, kennel, dog food and vets bills. Edited July 4, 2014 by malantone Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
norfolk dumpling Posted July 5, 2014 Report Share Posted July 5, 2014 Careful with expenses claimed (I'm sure ColinF will support this) as I'm told unless the expenses are specific to beating HMRC will not permit ie fuel to get there not allowed (you can't claim this back to get to the day job) but if you are a picker-up where 4x4 essential to get about shoot you can. Even waterproofs doubtful - you need these for any outside activity when it's wet. Items like thorn-proof leggings are ok but even dogs may be out unless shoot unless specified by Keeper. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ColinF Posted July 5, 2014 Report Share Posted July 5, 2014 Careful with expenses claimed (I'm sure ColinF will support this) as I'm told unless the expenses are specific to beating HMRC will not permit ie fuel to get there not allowed (you can't claim this back to get to the day job) but if you are a picker-up where 4x4 essential to get about shoot you can. Even waterproofs doubtful - you need these for any outside activity when it's wet. Items like thorn-proof leggings are ok but even dogs may be out unless shoot unless specified by Keeper. Unfortunately, I don't think that beaters can claim any expenses against their income. This is a page from HMRC's internal manuals, which shows their view on clothing: http://www.hmrc.gov.uk/manuals/eimanual/EIM32455.htm HMRC have said that beaters will generally be treated as employees, but picker-ups are generally self employed, which is why the rules on expenses are more relaxed for pickers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chesterse Posted July 5, 2014 Report Share Posted July 5, 2014 If beaters are treated as employees then surely they should be entitled to the minimum wage? I do mean being paid from a start time in the morning to a finish time late afternoon, not this rubbish of only being paid while actually beating! Yes we don't do it for the pay but we don't want the urine extracted from us either! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ColinF Posted July 5, 2014 Report Share Posted July 5, 2014 If beaters are treated as employees then surely they should be entitled to the minimum wage? I do mean being paid from a start time in the morning to a finish time late afternoon, not this rubbish of only being paid while actually beating! Yes we don't do it for the pay but we don't want the urine extracted from us either! Beaters are entitled to the minimum wage, but I believe the rules for the minimum wage exclude periods when no work is being done when working out how many hours have been worked. From what I have heard and read, most commercial shoots have increased the amount paid to beaters to comply with the minimum wage, and to cover the extra tax that they deduct. From a beaters point of view, there are other things to consider, like beaters day, shoot day food & drink, other shooting opportunities etc etc, as you say, very few people go beating for the money.... I guess it comes down to personal choice, a beater who is not happy with the overall package won't stay for long, and good beaters are always in demand Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chesterse Posted July 5, 2014 Report Share Posted July 5, 2014 Beaters are entitled to the minimum wage, but I believe the rules for the minimum wage exclude periods when no work is being done when working out how many hours have been worked. From what I have heard and read, most commercial shoots have increased the amount paid to beaters to comply with the minimum wage, and to cover the extra tax that they deduct. From a beaters point of view, there are other things to consider, like beaters day, shoot day food & drink, other shooting opportunities etc etc, as you say, very few people go beating for the money.... I guess it comes down to personal choice, a beater who is not happy with the overall package won't stay for long, and good beaters are always in demand It begs the question are beaters being singled out re "wage exclude periods when no work is being done". If this applied generally to most employees then there would be large periods when they would not get paid, if you look at the standing around going on.The whole thing still seems a bit of a mess, the three shoots I know, two of them commercial just carried on as usual last year. Pay was the same and names and addresses were hard to come by! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ColinF Posted July 5, 2014 Report Share Posted July 5, 2014 It begs the question are beaters being singled out re "wage exclude periods when no work is being done". If this applied generally to most employees then there would be large periods when they would not get paid, if you look at the standing around going on. The whole thing still seems a bit of a mess, the three shoots I know, two of them commercial just carried on as usual last year. Pay was the same and names and addresses were hard to come by! I've no idea if beaters are singled out, I just know that some shoots use that method to comply with the minimum wage rules. At the end of the day, shoots are not trying to exploit workers, as I said earlier there are other rewards received by beaters, which don't count towards the minimum wage calculation. Any shoots, especially the commercial ones, that are not reporting payments to beaters are asking for trouble. As businesses, commercial shoots are required to give HMRC details of their income and expenditure. If you roughly work out the shoots annual bill for beaters, it will be a significant number. It would be very difficult to get this expense through the books without alerting HMRC that they haven't reported it properly Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
norfolk dumpling Posted July 6, 2014 Report Share Posted July 6, 2014 Beaters are not being singled out for special treatment - there are many areas of the economy where tax not being paid and in these straightened times HMRC are simply trying to ensure any extra earnings are taxed where appropriate. As I mentioned previously a national car parking organisation who provide p/t staff for outside events used to pay cash, no questions asked. Now they, like many Shoots are taking full details (dob, NI no, address) and passing to HMRC with the warning to the p/t employee they must declare. They struggled to get staff this year. I'm involved with 3/4 shoots and they are all doing it differently: 1) paying £30 gross, taking full details but telling HMRC only 4.75 hours worked!! 2) paying £37.86 gross, taking full details but wage is as you clever ones will have noticed, 6hrs at min wage 3) as 2) but paying net of 20% tax leaving beater to reclaim tax if a low earner or to pay extra if 40% tax payer 4) this one told us no way will they get involved with HMRC stuff, paying £25. We were told to keep it quiet! Only problem with No4 was one of the beaters is an HMRC/Benefits snooper who told me he would be declaring everything. I'm not working on that shoot now. Looking forward to new season where I'm beating on another big estate shoot where they have yet to declare there MO! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chesterse Posted July 6, 2014 Report Share Posted July 6, 2014 When I referred to beaters being singled out I was making the point about only being paid while actually beating ,rather than being paid for the time you report for duty until you finish in the afternoon. It's like a shop assistant only being paid while serving customers! I appears in some part of the country shoots seem to have this whole issue sorted out but as mentioned in our area it's the same £25 no questions asked. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
norfolk dumpling Posted July 6, 2014 Report Share Posted July 6, 2014 I think this will be the case for the traditional farm shoot where no days (or very few) are sold. We have several here and these are cash only no questions asked which applies to all aspects of shoot. Commercial shoots cannot hide now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
norfolk dumpling Posted August 12, 2014 Report Share Posted August 12, 2014 Just sorted mIne out for last season. Very easy once you get through to the correct area at HMRC!! Asked me for: 1) additional earnings from tax yr 13/14 ie beaters wages and any expenses 2) estimate of earnings from private pension and my p/t (PAYE) job 3) estimate of additional earnings for 14/15 (beaters wages) What was interesting iro 2) above was that they were x-checking against figures already obtained from pension provider and employer. They did say no issues and my tax bill for 1) above would be deducted from my other earnings through a reduced tax allowance ie code would reduce for 15/16. Basically I owe circa £90 which will be paid in monthly instalments via tax code over peri tax year 2015-2016 For anyone worried about beaters wages, where you have provided NI no, name and address etc to shoot, this couldn't have been easier. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluesj Posted August 12, 2014 Report Share Posted August 12, 2014 You'd better off if payed a sum to help cover expenses Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
norfolk dumpling Posted August 14, 2014 Report Share Posted August 14, 2014 Agreed but on a big estate with payroll system you have to go with the flow. Working on another estate the season and they are going down the full disclosure of details for the first time. Will be interesting to see how they organise. Also how tight-***** the aristocratic owner is going to be. On the other one we were paid for 4.75 hours to satisfy minimum wages law - will we get another 19p a hour or will he say we worked 14 minutes less??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cockerman59 Posted August 14, 2014 Report Share Posted August 14, 2014 Yes, I stop beating on 2 big estates last year because of the tax. Pay £25, Tax £10 therefore pay £15, Fuel to get there £20 + lunch, Did not mind breaking even before But not going to bother messing about with tax for a loss of £10 Use to like going as well Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ColinF Posted August 14, 2014 Report Share Posted August 14, 2014 You'd better off if payed a sum to help cover expenses It doesn't matter what you call it, it's all taxable income in the eyes of HMRC. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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