jgguinness Posted July 5, 2014 Report Share Posted July 5, 2014 (edited) Hi all Well my latest purchase, my first English SBS and a local gunmaker purchase arrived yesterday at my RFD, so an early flyer at work to collect and she's now in my hands. I will pop a few pictures up. My intention is to restore her to a nice condition. Since it's my first proper restoration there will be many many questions, so the knowledgeable chaps on here, I apologise in advance, but there will be lots of probably daft questions. It feels like it needs a good clean and degrease, barrels have pitting so will need to think about that. Here are a few pics, uncleaned and as I collected her. So first questions. I know the stock marks can be brought out, for the most part with a damp cloth and an iron, but as far as general cleaning the grime etc what's best for that? Also the barrels will get reblued, but as far as pitting is concerned, can the bores be honed/polished out, how bad can they be for this to be an option, or is it generally a resleave job? The trigger guard etc, will this have been blued originally? Kind regards Jonathan Edited July 5, 2014 by jgguinness Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wraivi Posted July 5, 2014 Report Share Posted July 5, 2014 Brake and clutch cleaner, in a plastic tub with a small paintbrush and an old toothbrush will clear all that grime. Without being patronising, get some proper parallel sided gunsmiths turnscrews or make your own, before you have at any of those screws, or you risk really damaging them. Clean out the slots with a dental pick beforehand. Barrel honing is an option, but you're going to have to 'mike' (as in micrometer) the bores to see what you have to play with. Get a good gunsmith to check it over if you're not sure, and then enjoy the process, keep patient and reap the rewards of a job well done. Theres plenty of very switched on chaps here, so Good luck with your project. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
demonwolf444 Posted July 6, 2014 Report Share Posted July 6, 2014 As said above, get the bore micrometered to see how much is left in the barrels, you may be able to reduce or remove the pitting by having the bored lapped out. If you remove to much you will have to reproof, which could spell the end. Almost all of the colour case has gone off it, so you probably won't be detracting any value by putting the wire wheel in the dremel and cleaning up the receiver. This is soft on the metal and the engraving but tough on the grime, others may advise against it but in my experience it works well without leaving it looking over polished. you can oil blue some of the screws to clean them up a bit for a little contrast, you could try and reblue the barrels but in my knowledge i have not yet seen a decent example done at home that can compete with professional jobs. A home blueing job, in my view, would never do such a pretty gun justice. Remember too that you will be reducing the wall thickness when the barrels are re blued. Other small parts like the top lever could be oiled blued with ease. The stock *looks* tight and decent, look and feel for any play in the wood to metal fit, when disassembling look for ovaled screw holes, or any developing cracks of any loose bits of wood which might drop out. This could mean that the gun will soon need restocking. Though with some good glue you could postpone this with some damage control Guns are usually cheap because the wall thicknesses nearing the end of their life, and will soon need reproofing or that there is a problem or developing problem that will be more expensive to repair professionally than the value of the gun. Check the stock and forend, ring the barrels and inspect components. From the wood work i would be inclined to say that this is a gun that has not been messed about with. If you look at the wood it still has its crisp lines and the wood is still proud of the metal work so it can't have been refinished much if at all. In its own way its quite a nice thing, enjoy it and share it and your progress with us, I'm such more practiced professionals will be along shortly! On the outside the wood has a very pleasant character as does the engraving, well worth saving, dents can be lifted and the stock can be refinished though the chequering looks good ( lets hope that is a good indication of light use and a mechanically sound condition ) the gun is 100 years old, so it will never look new, but it does not stop it from looking very nice indeed. Certainly has something about it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welshwarrior Posted July 6, 2014 Report Share Posted July 6, 2014 As James has said above. Stock looks good simple refinish jobs a fish. Barrels cold blue is not up to the standard of an average rust black but a good rust black is unbeatable. Honing the barrel is an easy job with the right kit and will remove all or as much pitting as you want, the BUT if you remove to much the barrel will go out of proof and have to be re proofed they may not survive, this is not a DIY job see a professional. Trigger guard etc would have been blacked not blued and are simple to do with the right kit. Oil blue an look nice as well, pin heads would have been blued. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ditchman Posted July 6, 2014 Report Share Posted July 6, 2014 often the pitting looks worse than it is (in the bores)....if the bores havnt been skimmed or honed there may be quite a lot of meat to play with....definatly a job for the smith...not an expensive job...and it will return the barrells to new.........thats what you need to start with...once that is done you know the rest will be fine and it wont end up as a wallhanger i have a friend who "saves" old sidexside hammer guns...he is not as compatant as the boys on here he gets the smith to do most of the work....i have seen the guns when he buys or gets given them and they look like "sheds" the barrels are pitted very badly...(or they look bad) once the meat is honed out to speck they are pristine.... it is really great that people like you are bothered to put the time in and save these guns.......look forward to an update Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Geordie Posted July 6, 2014 Report Share Posted July 6, 2014 That stock looks a bit TOO good to be true! I have a sneaky feeling the stripi.g is not ALL real. I may be wrong of course! But I would be a little cautious with the stock refurb! I had one in for a refinish, And the stripes were added to the wood to enhance the look apparently! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ditchman Posted July 6, 2014 Report Share Posted July 6, 2014 That stock looks a bit TOO good to be true! I have a sneaky feeling the stripi.g is not ALL real. I may be wrong of course! But I would be a little cautious with the stock refurb! I had one in for a refinish, And the stripes were added to the wood to enhance the look apparently! yeah....see what you mean....looks like someone has wrapped burning string around it.....little too uniform for tiger stripeing......still if the stock was stripped and a dark stain -oil used it might come up a treat Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wymberley Posted July 6, 2014 Report Share Posted July 6, 2014 That stock looks a bit TOO good to be true! I have a sneaky feeling the stripi.g is not ALL real. I may be wrong of course! But I would be a little cautious with the stock refurb! I had one in for a refinish, And the stripes were added to the wood to enhance the look apparently! Can't see too well but the checkering on the stock seems to have been done by a different hand to that of the fore end with a finer LPI. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
demonwolf444 Posted July 6, 2014 Report Share Posted July 6, 2014 In my experience i have noted a courser grade on the forend to the wrist in regards to chequering. Natural tiger striping has a translucent quality which makes it shimmer on the light as you twist and move the stock. It is possible to make mock tiger striping, with a small torch or burning string but it usually lacks this same translucent quality; even if yours has been added, its been tastefully done and definately adds character and is an example of the gunmakers art in its own way. I have heard of belgian guns that go in for refinishing with amazing grain, however when the guy refinishing starts stripping back he discovers that all the grain has been skill fully hand painted on, then finished over the top. Over the years when such guns darken and get a bit grimy with age, they are indistinguishable from the real thing until someone starts to clean them up. Often underneath is a very plain straight grained bit of walnut. While there are still many people out there who can stock a gun, i would imagine there are very few who could paint to such a degree of skill a convincing grain. ( I know of one man who practices such an art, ) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ditchman Posted July 6, 2014 Report Share Posted July 6, 2014 In my experience i have noted a courser grade on the forend to the wrist in regards to chequering. Natural tiger striping has a translucent quality which makes it shimmer on the light as you twist and move the stock. It is possible to make mock tiger striping, with a small torch or burning string but it usually lacks this same translucent quality; even if yours has been added, its been tastefully done and definately adds character and is an example of the gunmakers art in its own way. I have heard of belgian guns that go in for refinishing with amazing grain, however when the guy refinishing starts stripping back he discovers that all the grain has been skill fully hand painted on, then finished over the top. Over the years when such guns darken and get a bit grimy with age, they are indistinguishable from the real thing until someone starts to clean them up. Often underneath is a very plain straight grained bit of walnut. While there are still many people out there who can stock a gun, i would imagine there are very few who could paint to such a degree of skill a convincing grain. ( I know of one man who practices such an art, ) i saw a programme many years ago on american gunmakers building up plainsmens rifles........they used to enhace the grain in the stock by dripping alchol on it and setting fire to it briefly...putting it out then doing it again, and again....it didnt add to the wood pattern but brought out what was already there........ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
demonwolf444 Posted July 6, 2014 Report Share Posted July 6, 2014 That's pretty interesting, cheers for the new subject to read around! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ditchman Posted July 6, 2014 Report Share Posted July 6, 2014 That's pretty interesting, cheers for the new subject to read around! if you have a trashed stock.....sand it down and do a few tests and before after photos after using meths or alcohol...........dont over do it as it will destroy the resin in the wood... let us know what comes out Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wymberley Posted July 6, 2014 Report Share Posted July 6, 2014 In my experience i have noted a courser grade on the forend to the wrist in regards to chequering. You live and learn. Must admit that that's news to me. I would have thought that it would only occur if a damaged piece was replaced by one already made which proved possible to be adapted to fit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welshwarrior Posted July 6, 2014 Report Share Posted July 6, 2014 i saw a programme many years ago on american gunmakers building up plainsmens rifles........they used to enhace the grain in the stock by dripping alchol on it and setting fire to it briefly...putting it out then doing it again, and again....it didnt add to the wood pattern but brought out what was already there........ Not hear that onetime for google research! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ditchman Posted July 6, 2014 Report Share Posted July 6, 2014 Not hear that onetime for google research! Not hear that onetime for google research! In english please ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
demonwolf444 Posted July 6, 2014 Report Share Posted July 6, 2014 I'll try it with the cracked stock off that side lock i am restocking. Its a pretty dull piece of wood though to be honest. With the kind of walnut that has stupidly open grain. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ditchman Posted July 6, 2014 Report Share Posted July 6, 2014 unlike flame burnishing using a blow torch ! but........using meths or alcohol...the idea i think if i remember is to get it hot enough to bring the resin to the surface and enough heat to disscolour the resin not to burn it off..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welshwarrior Posted July 6, 2014 Report Share Posted July 6, 2014 In english please ! Sorry not heard that one before had a few beers at BBQ lunch! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ditchman Posted July 6, 2014 Report Share Posted July 6, 2014 Sorry not heard that one before had a few beers at BBQ lunch! ouch................tomorrow Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jgguinness Posted July 6, 2014 Author Report Share Posted July 6, 2014 (edited) Well I have started the strip down. Trigger guard off, but the screw under the top leaver is very tight and didn't want to risk damage so will leave it for another night. Started to steam some of the marks out of the stock. Most have come out, wiped it over with meths to remove grime, and used a tooth brush to clean the chequering a little. The striping is still there, so fingers crossed! I see what people mean regarding their comments, I will keep you up to date with progress. Barrel wise I need to find someone who can advise on the pitting, possible polishing/honing or alternative routes. I have found this fella when doing a search online, anyone know of them? I think he may be a member on here but not sure, I have had a conversation with someone regarding barrel work before, but cannot remember who.http://www.shotgunblackingbrowningandblueing.co.uk/index.html Or any other companies would people recommend? Kind regards Jonathan Edited July 6, 2014 by jgguinness Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welshwarrior Posted July 6, 2014 Report Share Posted July 6, 2014 Paul work is excellent IMHO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
demonwolf444 Posted July 7, 2014 Report Share Posted July 7, 2014 When i did the Linsley brothers i took the gun to the gunsmiths down the road to get them to loosen all of the screws off for me so i could remove the old cracked stock. Will save the screw heads! The breech face on that gun is horrid. You can tidy it up by doing this. Its very simple and looks very nice. IMO the easiest way to get the lines uniform and straight is to make yourself a tool that will polish the vertical lines. This can be done by cutting 2-3mm thick pieces of 600 or 100 grit sand paper and sticking them length ways evenly spaced along the length of a ruler. When you come to striping the face using the ruler like a file you will get nice neat even lines across the breach face. James. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.