mrmints Posted July 15, 2014 Report Share Posted July 15, 2014 Well Lucy is doing very nicely now. After the training session with my instructor and his dog a couple of months back, she is a "keen" retriever. I've started to work on a bit of steadiness in the last week or so which is going well. I am now working on sending her left right and back over small distances (I don't think she quite gets it yet unless she can see the dummy). I've also been working on getting her to hunt much closer to me which is going well. However, after about 30s to a min of absolutely all out hunting, she slows right down and starts munching grass as she trots along. She is still sniffing about and will still bring me things if I have hidden them (she will only do this once or twice though after which she ignores them until I touch them) but eating eating eating! Is this something I should be stopping? Thanks in advance for any suggestions. Chris Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bazooka Posted July 15, 2014 Report Share Posted July 15, 2014 (edited) You bored the tats off the dog regarding retrieving and it now looks like you are some way towards boring it's breasts off regarding hunting. If it gets no reward or too much of something with little or no reward, this is what you end up with. By the way, if she is snatching at grass you are scrambling/boiling her brain. Edited July 15, 2014 by Bazooka Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrmints Posted July 15, 2014 Author Report Share Posted July 15, 2014 I love your responses Bazooka! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
loriusgarrulus Posted July 15, 2014 Report Share Posted July 15, 2014 OH had a problem with his Springer constantly grazing. Grass, Dandelions, Daisies he constantly ate them all. We started giving him Vetzymes as we thought it might be a diet problem and he has stopped most of the vegetation grazing now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WGD Posted July 16, 2014 Report Share Posted July 16, 2014 Most dogs eat grass at this time of year so I wouldn't worry about that, it's probably the best thing to do as far as the dog is concerned. It sounds like your dog is pottering either because it is under pressure and not happy with the way you have tightened up its pattern or, as is more likely and as Bazooka alluded too, there is nothing worth hunting for so it's fed up. Some dogs will hunt scent less ground just for fun, or ground that is new to them, but they do so having been worked on game and therefore have confidence that they have been cast of to hunt for something and they have expectation of a find. If you work a young dog too often on baron ground with no reward for its hunting most will dry up, which it sound like yours is doing. Time to change the training ground and find some rabbits. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bazooka Posted July 16, 2014 Report Share Posted July 16, 2014 Most dogs eat grass at this time of year so I wouldn't worry about that, it's probably the best thing to do as far as the dog is concerned. It sounds like your dog is pottering either because it is under pressure and not happy with the way you have tightened up its pattern or, as is more likely and as Bazooka alluded too, there is nothing worth hunting for so it's fed up. Some dogs will hunt scent less ground just for fun, or ground that is new to them, but they do so having been worked on game and therefore have confidence that they have been cast of to hunt for something and they have expectation of a find. If you work a young dog too often on baron ground with no reward for its hunting most will dry up, which it sound like yours is doing. Time to change the training ground and find some rabbits. I agree on both counts. The difference here is he has cast the dog to hunt and it begins to slow down and eat grass. Grazing in the garden or whilst standing is normal and some say the dog does it to supplement it's diet but after 30 seconds of being cast off gives the impression to me that it's either A, confused as to what it's being asked to do and the reasons behind it or B, under too much pressure. From the description it's hard to be sure but I've never had a dog graze on grass for food after being cast off, it sounds like the OP is confusing eating for food with the snatching you see when dogs are under pressure, worried or unsure of the task being asked. If it's stopping for a bit of grub then it's lacking in motivation regarding hunting and agree, gamey scented ground and an odd chase might well help to get it's enthusiasm back for hunting but it sounds under pressure to me and probably unmotivated and bored. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrmints Posted July 16, 2014 Author Report Share Posted July 16, 2014 It's a minefield this dog training business! I'm finding it a difficult balance, keeping the dog stimulated/interested and in control. No doubt due to my complete inexperience. I was in Oxford recently and went to see Graham Watkins (as he has a rabbit pen, which my instructor does not) and it is he who suggested I really tighten up her pattern and get her focusing more on me. I'll take her up to one of my permissions tonight and see if we can flush some rabbits and get her excited. Thanks for the comments. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bazooka Posted July 16, 2014 Report Share Posted July 16, 2014 (edited) It's a minefield this dog training business! I'm finding it a difficult balance, keeping the dog stimulated/interested and in control. No doubt due to my complete inexperience. I was in Oxford recently and went to see Graham Watkins (as he has a rabbit pen, which my instructor does not) and it is he who suggested I really tighten up her pattern and get her focusing more on me. I'll take her up to one of my permissions tonight and see if we can flush some rabbits and get her excited. Thanks for the comments. And he is very likely to be right. The problem comes when you over do things. Boredom, uncertainty, confusion can set in with too much of the same thing, over and over again. Only you will know if the dog looks to be snatching and grabbing at grass as it quarters in front of you. If it's been allowed to quarter at X distance away from you and you are now attempting to get it quartering -X in front of you, it will be confused as to why all of a sudden the goalposts have been moved. Every now and again drop a tennis ball in front of you as the dog passes, then peep it back into you and guide it to the ball. Not too much of it though you don't want to let the dog build up a habit of turning back in towards you for a find, especially quartering into a wind. Buy some new tennis balls or fur dummies or whatever the dog is keen on retrieving and use them occasionally. Don't allow the dog to see you dropping them. If it snatches at grass, put the leader on and try again two or three days later on different ground. And don't be afraid to ask your trainer the reasons he's asking you to do certain things. You can't just paint by numbers with dog training, you have to fully understand the reason you are carrying out a certain piece of training, if you don't understand it's highly likely the dog will struggle as well. Edited July 16, 2014 by Bazooka Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrmints Posted July 16, 2014 Author Report Share Posted July 16, 2014 Bazooka, this is where I get confused and I apologise if this is glaringly obvious to those in the know. Say I walk the dog over to the fields on the lead, find a suitable spot and cast her off. After a few mins drop a ball and guide her into it. Not wanting to over do this, is that her hunting done for the week? Or every other day? If so, what do I do with her the rest of the time, let her do what she wants? Get her to do a couple of retrieves (again this is something that I try and do only once or twice a week). Or is she just going to spend 99% of her time out with me either walking to heel or on the lead? I'm not asking in a sarcastic manner, I'm really not sure what to do. I've reduced our sessions out on walks down to 20mins twice a day (on the advice of Graham). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bazooka Posted July 16, 2014 Report Share Posted July 16, 2014 Depends on the dog but at the end of the day it's immaterial how long you do it for so long as it doesn't start boring the dog. Just a few mins each day is ample for getting the required results then build it up until she's really wired in to hunting for you. You have to judge the dogs mood. Judge it's reactions to everything you ask of it and if it starts to indicate it's interest is diminishing, put the lead on. The trick is to cut short any training while you still have the dogs enthusiasm, waiting until it is showing signs of 'going off the boil' , means you have overdone it's training. Just do a min or two each day to begin with and leave it wanting more. Mix things up a bit. A min of quartering. A min or two of retrieving. Retrieves from grass, water, woods...plenty variety and excitement but always try to keep each session short enough to hold the dogs interest 100%. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrmints Posted July 16, 2014 Author Report Share Posted July 16, 2014 Thanks for that! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wj939 Posted July 16, 2014 Report Share Posted July 16, 2014 Have you tried laying a trail or scent line for her to hunt? Drag a dead bunny in a pattern in the grass and into some cover use a rope to mask any foot scent. Then cast her hunting, if she's stimulated with something new she should take the line and find the retrieve. Agree with the other comments- sounds like she's bored, possibly with the dummies your using, possibly with the scent or the ground you're on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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