aris Posted October 21, 2014 Report Share Posted October 21, 2014 Interesting article: http://www.theregister.co.uk/2014/10/20/acpo_claims_nearly_double_number_stolen_firearms_truth/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aris Posted October 21, 2014 Author Report Share Posted October 21, 2014 What gets me is that shooting organisations are mum about these discrepancies (did they even notice - you would think the would be on top of this) - and it takes an IT industry publication to come up with this stuff. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
loriusgarrulus Posted October 21, 2014 Report Share Posted October 21, 2014 Very interesting article. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scutt Posted October 21, 2014 Report Share Posted October 21, 2014 shows how you can tell the truth but not the hole truth Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beardo Posted October 21, 2014 Report Share Posted October 21, 2014 So the justification behind the new unannounced home visits was over inflated.... Analysis The Association of Chief Police Officers (ACPO) has claimed that more legally owned firearms were lost or stolen over the last few years than appears to be the case, according to an exclusive analysis by The Register. The discrepancy casts doubt on a new initiative pillorying gun owners for being careless about gun security. Last week ACPO released a set of statistics to accompany a new initiative highlighting the number of legally held firearms lost or stolen over the last five years. However, The Register has cross-referenced ACPO's figures - which it says are taken directly from the National Firearms Licensing Management System, the police database of all privately owned rifles and shotguns in the UK - with data obtained by BBC Radio 4's World at One show* under the Freedom of Information Act. When compared, the figures appear to show that ACPO is over-reporting the number of losses and thefts of lethal barrelled weapons by an average of 10 per cent. If shotguns are removed from the data, ACPO's statistics seem to record double the number of firearms stolen than is actually the case according to the detailed Home Office stats. full story http://www.theregister.co.uk/2014/10/20/acpo_claims_nearly_double_number_stolen_firearms_truth/ looks like they've included parts and guns lost or stolen by the police / cadets etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wymberley Posted October 21, 2014 Report Share Posted October 21, 2014 Thanks for that - it's good to know precisely why we're not surprised. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scully Posted October 21, 2014 Report Share Posted October 21, 2014 (edited) Thankyou; have been trying to make people aware of the truth behind these figures for years. Good find. It isn't, and never has been in the interest of Government bodies and Governemnt funded bodies with agendas to break down figures to reveal a 'true' picture if it is to the detriment of said agenda, whether it concerns firearms, employment, unemployment, education or whatever. Edited October 21, 2014 by Scully Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Mighty Prawn Posted October 21, 2014 Report Share Posted October 21, 2014 Brilliant, but who is going to be on Newsnight asking the tricky question to ACPO about how these figures were arrived at and the cost to the public of this new, and apparently completely uncalled for scheme? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bostonmick Posted October 21, 2014 Report Share Posted October 21, 2014 I would say the figures are probably about right.the mis leading part is it gives no real details of where they were stolen or lost from.on the face of it all the blame is towards the general shooting public.also how do you lose a shotgun.yes lose your wallet or keys but a gun? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dunkield Posted October 21, 2014 Report Share Posted October 21, 2014 Two similar threads merged Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clakk Posted October 21, 2014 Report Share Posted October 21, 2014 next thing the police will be accusing ministers of calling them PLEBS and then be caught lying on tape Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scully Posted October 21, 2014 Report Share Posted October 21, 2014 I would say the figures are probably about right.the mis leading part is it gives no real details of where they were stolen or lost from.on the face of it all the blame is towards the general shooting public.also how do you lose a shotgun.yes lose your wallet or keys but a gun? The figures aren't 'about right' according to the link, but like you I also find it hard to fathom how anyone 'loses' a shotgun, or any other firearm for that matter. I can understand the military 'losing' them on active service, but according to one report in the last 3 years the MOD has 'lost' 165 pistols, rifles and machine guns, plus 27,000 rounds of ammo. No doubt the headline belies the truth, but isn't that always the case and very relevant given the topic of this thread? But let's not lose track of the fact the police have and do 'lose' firearms also. I also believe that following the handgun ban at least one copper was discovered 'selling on' confiscated handguns and another was discovered providing firearms to some of the miscreants involved in the Brinks-Mat heist. However, it would be churlish and unfair to tar them all with the same brush wouldn't it? It's not like it happens to us is it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
STOTTO Posted October 21, 2014 Report Share Posted October 21, 2014 “There are lies damn lies” and it would appear ACPO statistics! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
littlerob Posted October 21, 2014 Report Share Posted October 21, 2014 I havw heard story's of people lost a gun most involve boats and the pursuit of wildfowl I.e gun whent over bored when wave turn over boat and know a farmer local to me had his rifles and shotguns stolen from his house and police didnt bother following up a witness seeing a van near his early hours and told them where the van came from and who owns the van the main suspects with this info the police never even pull them in for questioning and there know local thieves and drug users Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
littlerob Posted October 21, 2014 Report Share Posted October 21, 2014 And 250 cartridge's went missing from wisbech police station that belonged to me I have a few letters of me asking where they are / went and at lest 4 different people inovled in these letters including cheif of police for cambs have not ones mentioned them in a reply to me Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
malkiserow Posted October 21, 2014 Report Share Posted October 21, 2014 And 250 cartridge's went missing from wisbech police station that belonged to me I have a few letters of me asking where they are / went and at lest 4 different people inovled in these letters including cheif of police for cambs have not ones mentioned them in a reply to me Why did you keep them there? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
malkiserow Posted October 21, 2014 Report Share Posted October 21, 2014 Amalgamating private and MOD/police/cadet figures makes a nonsense of it all. el Reg - very interesting read Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drut Posted October 21, 2014 Report Share Posted October 21, 2014 ACPO seem responsible/accountable to no one as well as unelected. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
littlerob Posted October 21, 2014 Report Share Posted October 21, 2014 Why did you keep them there? after they seized my shotguns and ammo due to a incident that happen in result of getting my head filed in with brick the person responsible made a load of lies and basically said he done it attacked me because I threant to shoot and shot at him and his family in results police end up revoking my sgc had to take them to court wich I won my case september 2013 and was reunited with the sport I hold dear and are passionate about Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
malkiserow Posted October 21, 2014 Report Share Posted October 21, 2014 after they seized my shotguns and ammo due to a incident that happen in result of getting my head filed in with brick the person responsible made a load of lies and basically said he done it attacked me because I threant to shoot and shot at him and his family in results police end up revoking my sgc had to take them to court wich I won my case september 2013 and was reunited with the sport I hold dear and are passionate about Blimey, sorry to hear that..... what a nightmare. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dunkield Posted October 21, 2014 Report Share Posted October 21, 2014 So the justification behind the new unannounced home visits was over inflated.... Analysis The Association of Chief Police Officers (ACPO) has claimed that more legally owned firearms were lost or stolen over the last few years than appears to be the case, according to an exclusive analysis by The Register. The discrepancy casts doubt on a new initiative pillorying gun owners for being careless about gun security. Last week ACPO released a set of statistics to accompany a new initiative highlighting the number of legally held firearms lost or stolen over the last five years. However, The Register has cross-referenced ACPO's figures - which it says are taken directly from the National Firearms Licensing Management System, the police database of all privately owned rifles and shotguns in the UK - with data obtained by BBC Radio 4's World at One show* under the Freedom of Information Act. When compared, the figures appear to show that ACPO is over-reporting the number of losses and thefts of lethal barrelled weapons by an average of 10 per cent. If shotguns are removed from the data, ACPO's statistics seem to record double the number of firearms stolen than is actually the case according to the detailed Home Office stats. full story http://www.theregister.co.uk/2014/10/20/acpo_claims_nearly_double_number_stolen_firearms_truth/ looks like they've included parts and guns lost or stolen by the police / cadets etc. Those figures are so skewed they should sent to More or Less or Radio 4 to pick apart Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
norfolk dumpling Posted October 22, 2014 Report Share Posted October 22, 2014 There are afew in the shooting world who do no credit to us: a farmer who granted me a permission asked me to keep an eye out for a .22 rifle he had 'lost' (turned out he left it leaning up on a fence and forgot where it was - it never turned up!!) and on another small shoot I got involved with one guy was waiting to hear what the FLO was going to do about a gun he left against his car before he drove off (gun not there when he got back!). I can't imagine leaving guns laying about but if I know of 2 cases then there must be many, many more. Therefore it is vital we are very very careful with our guns and if we see anything of concern we must do our utmost to ensure we are above reproach. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
STOTTO Posted October 22, 2014 Report Share Posted October 22, 2014 There are afew in the shooting world who do no credit to us: a farmer who granted me a permission asked me to keep an eye out for a .22 rifle he had 'lost' (turned out he left it leaning up on a fence and forgot where it was - it never turned up!!) and on another small shoot I got involved with one guy was waiting to hear what the FLO was going to do about a gun he left against his car before he drove off (gun not there when he got back!). I can't imagine leaving guns laying about but if I know of 2 cases then there must be many, many more. Therefore it is vital we are very very careful with our guns and if we see anything of concern we must do our utmost to ensure we are above reproach. I believe that this sort of thing is quite common with the military and also with coppers, it appears we are all fallible and have therefore all been included in the figures as misrepresented by ACPO! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scully Posted October 22, 2014 Report Share Posted October 22, 2014 There are afew in the shooting world who do no credit to us: a farmer who granted me a permission asked me to keep an eye out for a .22 rifle he had 'lost' (turned out he left it leaning up on a fence and forgot where it was - it never turned up!!) and on another small shoot I got involved with one guy was waiting to hear what the FLO was going to do about a gun he left against his car before he drove off (gun not there when he got back!). I can't imagine leaving guns laying about but if I know of 2 cases then there must be many, many more. Therefore it is vital we are very very careful with our guns and if we see anything of concern we must do our utmost to ensure we are above reproach. Was Mick from Boston with you? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Breastman Posted October 22, 2014 Report Share Posted October 22, 2014 There are afew in the shooting world who do no credit to us: a farmer who granted me a permission asked me to keep an eye out for a .22 rifle he had 'lost' (turned out he left it leaning up on a fence and forgot where it was - it never turned up!!) and on another small shoot I got involved with one guy was waiting to hear what the FLO was going to do about a gun he left against his car before he drove off (gun not there when he got back!). I can't imagine leaving guns laying about but if I know of 2 cases then there must be many, many more. Therefore it is vital we are very very careful with our guns and if we see anything of concern we must do our utmost to ensure we are above reproach. Similar incident was what lead to the discovery that Durham FEO's had been trading guns, only that guy faked a burgalry to try to cover the loss up The gun lost turned out to be one he'd bought from one of the FEO's Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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