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Air gun novice in need of advice!


Longchalk
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Hi all. Have just jumped the fence from the shotgun paddock for a moment to get some decent airgun advice. Apologies if this is a longish post, I want to cover a few things at once.

 

Right .... Back in the Spring I got a couple of new permissions that had quite a lot of rabbits on. Rather that banging away at dusk with the shotgun, a mate loaned me his .22 BSA Lightning. It was around 10-15 years old, but hardly ever used, with a cheap old scope on it. Without any previous experience with air guns I nonetheless found it a doddle to zero, and a joy to shoot. After a few practice sessions, from prone I could consistently put 4 out of 5 shots under a 50p at 25 yards, and I shot rabbits with it quite happily all summer. My mate has now moved away so I had to give him his gun back. Fair do's.

 

Having enjoyed myself, I decided to get a similar one of my own, and bought a 'nearly new', very lightly used, BSA Lightening XL carbine, this time in .177, thinking it would help me with the whole hold over/under thing........ But I can't hit the proverbial cows backside with it !!!

 

The problem is that after five or six practice sessions, I still cannot get any kind of grouping, so can't really zero it. They are quite literally all over the shop, and all round the clock.

 

I'm shooting prone over 28 yards, with a Richter Optik 3-9x50 scope. I'm using a bean bag, and trying to be as consistent with gun position, hold and breathing etc. as I can... But nothing seems to tame it, and I'm going round in circles trying different things.

 

My observations are:

 

1. The strength of the recoil is off-the-scale compared to how I remember the .22. It jumps a lot, seems twangy, and after firing, the cross-hairs hardly ever come rest in the same place twice..... How much of this is the gun, and how much is me, not holding it right?.... Is it something a professional tuning might help?

 

2. Summer evenings with the .22 were naturally quite a bit stiller than the weather at this time of year. I've been trying to practice with it on as still a day as possible but there is always some degree of breeze. Would the difference in pellet weight between calibres contribute to the kind of inconsistency I'm seeing?

 

3. When standing, in the artillery hold, the scope is mounted in what I feel is the perfect position, nice and clear at a comfortable distance from my eye. When lying down however, this dynamic obviously changes, and the scope is further away, and the stock not tucked into the shoulder. Do I re-position the scope, or is there a 'best practice' hold, I need to adopt in this position?

 

I know full well all the BSA knockers will be queuing up to tell me to just bin it and buy a Weirauch, but the economics of the matter are that this is the gun I have, and I need to try and make it work for me..... I never had any trouble at all with the previous one, and can't believe a modern BSA can really be that completely unusable.

 

Any constructive advice would be gratefully received guys, thanks.

Edited by Longchalk
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It is a well known fact that some spring air guns shoot more sweetly in .22, throw in the misfortune of getting a particularly poor example of a .177 and the difference is magnified. It all of course depends on whether you have tried enough pellets too because even good guns can perform poorly with apparently well made and well known brands of some pellets.

 

To use a spring air gun effectivley for hunting it MUST be accurate so your choice is to either have it tuned and find a suitable pellet or just accept there are better guns out there. I am a fan of the Lightning as it happens but it is what it is: a light, jumpy little number that talks straighter than it shoots.

 

Ultimately I fear the cheapest option is to trade it in for a HW95 in .22 and be done.

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Thanks Hamster, that's good advice. I've only used the one type of pellet so far - Diablo Exact 0.547g / 8,44gr - as this was advised to me in the shop as a good hunting pellet. I wasn't aware this could have such a significant effect on accuracy. I'll try some others.

 

I must admit, one of the reasons I liked the Lightning in the store, was for its lightness to carry and hold, compared to some of the others I looked at. I guess this is not necessarily an advantage in .177 then !

 

If it comes to PX-ing it for something else, I will ultimately do that, but just want to be sure I am understanding the variables & corrective actions properly, and that it is not just down to my inexperience.

 

Regards.

Edited by Longchalk
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Bin it a buy and weihrauch :lol:

Seriously , the older lightnings were decent little birmingham made guns and not too bad.

The newer ones are horrible twangy things made abroad that are hold sensitive and generally group like a shotgun.

 

Try some different pellets as the only " good hunting pellet " is one that suits your particular gun , a good starting point is RWS superdomes , also try airarms diablo field and H&N field and target trophy.

 

The best thing to do to be honest is to send your gun off to sandwell field sports who will transform it for about £70

Edited by fenboy
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Thanks Hamster, that's good advice. I've only used the one type of pellet so far - Diablo Exact 0.547g / 8,44gr - as this was advised to me in the shop as a good hunting pellet. I wasn't aware this could have such a significant effect on accuracy. I'll try some others.

 

I must admit, one of the reasons I liked the Lightning in the store, was for its lightness to carry and hold, compared to some of the others I looked at. I guess this is not necessarily an advantage in .177 then !

 

If it comes to PX-ing it for something else, I will ultimately do that, but just want to be sure I am understanding the variables & corrective actions properly, and that it is not just down to my inexperience.

 

Regards.

 

 

I've owned around 20 spring air guns and shot at least as many others and believe me some just aren't very accurate, even off a rest. Some of this is to do with inherent build and design but pellets can be a real eye opener.

 

Just recently I got a new HW95 in .22 and fresh out of the box it was grouping Accupels well inside a 5p piece at 28.5 measured yards off a rest, it did the same with JSB Exacts and AirArms pellets. I have always found RWS Superdomes to be excellent in most guns but a new box was throwing 2 fliers out of every 5 shots and the main group was golf ball size so useless even without the fliers !

 

My AA 510 FAC did the same and oddly enough both printed low / right as well; inspection of the pellets up close reveals nothing as they look better made than the other pellet types but the heads feel a tight fit in both guns. Now, had I stumbled across the Superdomes straight off I may not quite think how awesome the HW95 really is. :)

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First thing I would do is isolate the problem-get someone else to try the gun with new pellets (have you researched which pellet is recommended?). If someone else can shoot well with the gun then you need more practice-simples. If, however, the problem still exists then you need to work out where the fault lies. Ideas-try another scope/mount combo/check that your stock screws are tight/is the breach tight?/does the gun just need running in? If all else fails then you may just have a pup-if you bought it new then take it back and get a replacement. If I were you and had new land and Rabbits in abundance then I would (and I know you're not going to like this) bite the bullet and get something more up to the job-a used TX200 in .177 will last you a lifetime and despite a cost to buy it you will get the majority of your money back if you look after her and sell her on :good:

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.

 

The best thing to do to be honest is to send your gun off to sandwell field sports who will transform it for about £70

 

Cheers Fenboy, I don't live million miles from the their store, and might drive up there on weekend for some advice. I don't mind spending £70 if it will make a significant improvement, but don't want to throw good money after bad if I'm just polishing a ****, and could better put it towards something else. All depends on what I'd get offered for it as a PX I guess.

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Have you tryed a different scope? Does the rifle have a moderator?

Not yet, just the Richter. I have plenty of clay shooting and pigeon bashing mates, but no-one else into air rifles, so chopping & changing kit is a bit tricky.

 

It has the standard BSA muzzle break silencer, which seems to do a decent enough job in that respect, but as to whether it affects accuracy I don't know. Need to take it off and try without, and with different pellets.

 

Thanks for the pointers.

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I've owned around 20 spring air guns and shot at least as many others and believe me some just aren't very accurate, even off a rest. Some of this is to do with inherent build and design but pellets can be a real eye opener.

 

Just recently I got a new HW95 in .22 and fresh out of the box it was grouping Accupels well inside a 5p piece at 28.5 measured yards off a rest, it did the same with JSB Exacts and AirArms pellets. I have always found RWS Superdomes to be excellent in most guns but a new box was throwing 2 fliers out of every 5 shots and the main group was golf ball size so useless even without the fliers !

 

My AA 510 FAC did the same and oddly enough both printed low / right as well; inspection of the pellets up close reveals nothing as they look better made than the other pellet types but the heads feel a tight fit in both guns. Now, had I stumbled across the Superdomes straight off I may not quite think how awesome the HW95 really is. :)

 

I'm not closed off to the idea that second hand PCP from a reputable supplier might be a better option, but funds are very tight. I actually considered an Air Arms S410 at the time, but once I'd bought a tank as well it was going to be around £200 over my budget, so I stuck with a springer I thought I would get similar performance with to the one I'd used before.

 

If I did look for a budget, second hand PCP, just for rabbiting, what would folks advise?

 

 

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If considering a PCP, I'd suggest either an Air arms S410 (or the older version, the S310), or the Weihrauch HW100. Both are top notch, and can be picked up for reasonable sums of money.

One thing you do find is that a lot of air rifles are sold if they are inaccurate/inconsistent. Quite often, a set of new seals will make a world of difference, whether it's a springer or PCP

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Cheers Fenboy, I don't live million miles from the their store, and might drive up there on weekend for some advice. I don't mind spending £70 if it will make a significant improvement, but don't want to throw good money after bad if I'm just polishing a ****, and could better put it towards something else. All depends on what I'd get offered for it as a PX I guess.

 

It will certainly be worth the trip and the money.

Dismiss the idea of PCP they are for girls and gay people , a real man shoots a springer :whistling:

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longchalk, don't waste your hard earned cash on a tune up bud,,i totally agree with Bruno22rf,,,,, trade it in mate for a pcp and put the £70 towards a decent pcp, why make things hard for yourself,

 

a decent pcp will walk all over a springer 7 days a week for accuracy, but then again there are the expert springer boys on here who can shoot off a nats knacker at 60 yrds with their ultra accurate tuned springers,,

 

a pcp makes hunting effortless and is certainly better for the rabbits in question as you shot to kill ratio will be much higher with the pcp, a second hand s410 is the way to go mate accurate as hell and without doubt less wounded rabbits running about,,

 

I,m like Bruno a GAY GIRL for me,,always knew I was born a lesbian :lol::lol: :lol: :lol::lol:

 

atb Evo

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longchalk, don't waste your hard earned cash on a tune up bud,,i totally agree with Bruno22rf,,,,, trade it in mate for a pcp and put the £70 towards a decent pcp,

 

a pcp makes hunting effortless and is certainly better for the rabbits in question as you shot to kill ratio will be much higher with the pcp, a second hand s410 is the way to go mate accurate as hell and without doubt less wounded rabbits running about,,

 

I,m like Bruno a GAY GIRL for me,,always knew I was born a lesbian :lol::lol: :lol: :lol::lol:

 

atb Evo

evo! welcome back sir!

I have missed your words of wisdom. PCP all the way for me :)

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First thing I would do is isolate the problem-get someone else to try the gun with new pellets (have you researched which pellet is recommended?). If someone else can shoot well with the gun then you need more practice-simples. If, however, the problem still exists then you need to work out where the fault lies. Ideas-try another scope/mount combo/check that your stock screws are tight/is the breach tight?/does the gun just need running in? If all else fails then you may just have a pup-if you bought it new then take it back and get a replacement. If I were you and had new land and Rabbits in abundance then I would (and I know you're not going to like this) bite the bullet and get something more up to the job-a used TX200 in .177 will last you a lifetime and despite a cost to buy it you will get the majority of your money back if you look after her and sell her on :good:

 

Now, it just so happens that I have one of them for sale !

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One final plus point for PCP : Near silence. I do a lot of rabbiting with a red torch mounted above the scope. If you've got a few rabbits close to each other, the largest noise is the pellet strike. The other rabbits don't scarper, just hunker down for a few seconds. Then you take the next shot

Edited by robbiep
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If considering a PCP, I'd suggest either an Air arms S410 (or the older version, the S310), or the Weihrauch HW100. Both are top notch, and can be picked up for reasonable sums of money.

One thing you do find is that a lot of air rifles are sold if they are inaccurate/inconsistent. Quite often, a set of new seals will make a world of difference, whether it's a springer or PCP

 

Your old Lightning still going strong ..... Thanks Robbie.

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