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Please read with an open mind...


danielsonson
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This is merely and opinion gathering post So please read with an open mind...

 

My business partner has a wonderful Wire Haired Vizsla who I have watched grow into a lovely, biddable and steady dog. He is going to put him to his first bitch in the not too distant future and this, once found, will be a suitably well bred WHV; however, he has offered me the opportunity to cover another bitch of my choosing in order to get a pup for myself. Now the obvious choice is to have one of his pups which may be the route I take. Or... I could take the German approach and throw the breed standard to the wind and deliberate cross breed.

 

I know the purists are screaming but having had working HPRs in the past I have seen the up and down side of close lines. I have also seen the remarkable results of careful (not accidental) cross breeding mostly on the continent.

 

So first question: does anyone know of any Visla crosses? What have they been trained for and how do they fair? I intend to use the dog on deer mainly.

 

Second: what breed could compliment the viewable if a little sensitive nature of the WHV? Lab...Hano...Bav...

 

Third: Is there anyone out there with a bitch who might like to assist in this little experiment?

 

Ok..so unleash the backlash ;-)

Pls excuse typo

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The german approach??

 

Not sure wot approach u know off but generally the german approach i know off is very very strict when it comes to breeding and breed standards. All dogs have to meet the breed stanard and must have passed any working and health tests relevent to the breed, it is then only allowed to be bred with dogs/bitches chosen by the local breed master. Even top sires are usually very restricted how many pups they're allowed to sire, so shouldn't really get close lines in a proper 'german' system

So complete oppisate of wot happens in this country where every tom richard and harry is breeding every rubbish bitch to FTCH sire's

 

 

There is plenty of dogs about now and imports that with careful breeding u really shouldnae have too close a lines now even with minority breeds

 

 

If ur talking about creaing new breeds by deliberite crossing? Do they not also drown/pts any dog that does not make the stanard for the new breed. Not really much apetite for that nowadays.

 

Crossing a WHV air scenting dog with a hound breed ground scenting dog, u will never know wot ur going to get as with all mongrels, could get a fantastic dog or something with all the bad habitis of both breeds, and all pups could be completely different.

Breeding dogs of same breed is a bit of a lottery/best guess at the best of times without trying to breed mongrels and predict wot u'll end up with

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Richard, your are factually correct on all points, the Germans are ruthlessly efficient with breed standards but outside of those attempting breed integrity, they are also ruthlessly practical.

 

I take your point re: "the breeding lottery" but if it's a gamble both ways then why not go down the mongrel route? Afterall that's how most breeds were established. Don't get me wrong, I have no trumped up ideas of breeding a super dog... Far from it. But a. Air scenting dog with the ability to ground scent and stand steady could be amazing. Conversely a dog which has the stubbornness of a hound and the sensitive of a HPR could be painful. Like I say just a discussioN point.

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I have had in the past a springer/lab who was an excellent dog. We have at present a pug/cavalier who has mainly the be best of both. So we are not adverse to the idea. Some of the Sprockers owned on here seem to be excellent and the principal of breeding Lurchers involves some of what you are hoping for. The main snag as already said is that you could end up with the worst of both. Also what are you planning for the rest of the litter as you presumably will only want to keep one puppy.

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But a whv with th right training WILL do all u need anyway as will many other breeds of dog. The training is the most important fact. So why take the chance?

 

U can blood track with HPR's so they can and will ground scent when trained for it. Qute possible to get hpr's to follow 24hr old deer hoof tracks with no blood, do u need any more than that?

U have already highlighted how headstrong hounds are, that would not be a good trait to encourage in an hpr, but changes are some if not all will become more stubborn

 

When people started new breeds they had very very clear ideas on wot the dogs should look like, temperment and wot other abilities they should have, any that fell short where PTS there and then

 

 

Slightly different with ur sprockers as where all the same breed a few hundreds years earlier, even a springerdor the 2 original breeds are not that far apart and do relatively similar roles and both are pretty biddable/trainable.

 

Some of the gropuse boys like GWP/labs but all u end up with is a rangey lab that often doesn't hold a point, ideal for wot they want on the grouse, wild beating line dogs but completrly useless for anything else. Althou i'm sure with training they could be better for other things but then again a lab already does that or even a pointer with the right training.

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