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well all said and done im taking mine back in tomorrow as I got a cronos on Saturday and it was hitting about 8lb looked a gauge it was low so thought fill it up straight after that it was only making about 3lb so put it away got it out this morning no leaks cronos on and it averaged 12.3 lbs so the panic is on to get it sent back to bsa before the cops get me


well all said and done im taking mine back in tomorrow as I got a cronos on Saturday and it was hitting about 8lb looked a gauge it was low so thought fill it up straight after that it was only making about 3lb so put it away got it out this morning no leaks cronos on and it averaged 12.3 lbs so the panic is on to get it sent back to bsa before the cops get me

its only 2 month old as well and had about 800 pellets through it

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Muddy funkers post has likely been misunderstood by many, simply by not reading it in toatal.

 

That word 'random' makes a great deal of difference. People would find it more understandable if the term 'targetted' had been used.

 

Targetted is important. Only needs one complaint from some 'anti' or disagreeable or unfriendly person. Believe me, there are plenty of them about. You may be termed as targetted if there is any complaint registered against your name - make no mistake about that.

 

If you exceed the speed limit, you might get a couple miles per hour where you might get away with the offence, but if they have your item (such as your gun) for test the 'leeway' can be reduced to very close to zero by repeated testing in order to remove any testing error. Mathematically, the average of 12.1 and 11.9 is 12, but that is ignored, just as driving one way at 40mph and then in the opposite direction at 20mph (an average speed of 30mph) on a restricted stretch of road. Even if only 0.1 over the limit, you then have a criminal record!

 

It is just plain common sense to allow a sensible margin on power, just as it is while driving close to the speed li it.

 

RAB

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''Using a figure of mathematical calculations squared is flawed!''

 

Eh?

 

Safe speed limits are calculated on 1/2 mv^2, for evaluating the kinetic energy possibly imparted between people and vehicles.

 

The difference in energy involved, between 20 and 30mph means the impact forces are potentially more than doubled (proportional to 400 and 900) between these two speeds. No difference with bullets, pellets or whatever.

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Did you put this over a F1 Chrono? I had one of those Crombo things which you attach to the end of the barrel with elastic bands and it once told me a BSA Meteor was over the limit :lol: .

 

Look Guys, I had this conversation with John Knibbs some time ago and I agree with him all the way: Use a lighter pellet to get the velocity, but it retains much less energy so the Ft Lbs energy drops. Use a heavier pellet, and although the energy is retained, it takes more oomph to get the pellet moving so it travels slower therefore, the speed is reduced.

 

We can't simply test one pellet and apply the same formula to another pellet without the velocity test.

 

At the risk of repeating this: Pellet weight x Velocity x Velocity ÷ 450240

Edited by hyflier
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well the heavier pellet put mine over so in it went to the gun shop he put it through his cronos didn't say which pellets but has put on my receipt when he sends it to bsa it was reading 12.51lbs so 11.59_12.01lbs no margin on mine as all ten shots were over 12lbs can only thank Robert for selling his cronos to me as mister big would probably be having his wicked way with me inside (PICK THE SOAP UP BOY) no no no

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''Using a figure of mathematical calculations squared is flawed!''

 

Eh?

 

Safe speed limits are calculated on 1/2 mv^2, for evaluating the kinetic energy possibly imparted between people and vehicles.

 

The difference in energy involved, between 20 and 30mph means the impact forces are potentially more than doubled (proportional to 400 and 900) between these two speeds. No difference with bullets, pellets or whatever.

Exactly!

So a pellet only has to be to quick by a small amount and the squared result jumps dramatically but where is the actual crime? There is none. Ft/lbs is best kept for turning and lifting calculations not kinetic energy.

Why? Because moving things rarely impart all those lbs of force. Some are lost or converted elsewhere. Eg, a pellet calculated to impart 10ft/lbs will not move a 1lb weight 10'!

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The rifle is the driving force, not the ammunition, in the case of the airgun. Who quotes the energy of a bullet? The velocity is the usual comparison between similar projectiles, but that is only part of the story. Mass is an important factor which is generally ignored by most rifle users (excepting those that reload?).

 

As for the ballistics of the pellet not being transferred at 100%, think simple - all projectiles lose all their kinetic energy in a short time. It is the damage that the projectile can impart, when discharged by some clown, or worse, which needs to be controlled within reasonable limits.

 

It is the dissipation of that energy and the resultant shock and damage to the tissues of the recipient that requires limiting. A high powered rifle is reqired to move a heavy, solid target by that distance, but the usual result would be disintegration or deflection. Remember, it requires energy to deform metal - think crush zones on modern motor vehicles, perhaps? One might wonder how you would set a safe limit - calibre, velocity, mass of projectile, or ?. Be sensible - there has to be some limit! Generally sub-lethal to humans is a good starting point.

 

Thinking about it, working in SI units is far better. Joules are far better units than these antiquated Imperial units.

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The rifle is the driving force, not the ammunition, in the case of the airgun. Who quotes the energy of a bullet? The velocity is the usual comparison between similar projectiles, but that is only part of the story. Mass is an important factor which is generally ignored by most rifle users (excepting those that reload?).

 

As for the ballistics of the pellet not being transferred at 100%, think simple - all projectiles lose all their kinetic energy in a short time. It is the damage that the projectile can impart, when discharged by some clown, or worse, which needs to be controlled within reasonable limits.

 

It is the dissipation of that energy and the resultant shock and damage to the tissues of the recipient that requires limiting. A high powered rifle is reqired to move a heavy, solid target by that distance, but the usual result would be disintegration or deflection. Remember, it requires energy to deform metal - think crush zones on modern motor vehicles, perhaps? One might wonder how you would set a safe limit - calibre, velocity, mass of projectile, or ?. Be sensible - there has to be some limit! Generally sub-lethal to humans is a good starting point.

 

Thinking about it, working in SI units is far better. Joules are far better units than these antiquated Imperial units.[/quote/]

 

I already HAD thought about it!

 

By the way, 12ft/lbs is not sub lethal to humans.

 

You have assumed and also gone all around the mulberry bush and then thought about it to finally agree other units would be better!

 

Dear Lord, a miracle.

Edited by Underdog
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...By the way, 12ft/lbs is not sub lethal to humans.

 

You have assumed and also gone all around the mulberry bush and then thought about it to finally agree other units would be better!

You have added precisely nothing new. I never said air guns were not lethal. I used the word 'generally' very carefully. The case of accidents is rather different than them being used as a weapon of malice.

 

Your physics is a bit lacking if you think I have changed my mind about units. FYI Joules are the SI unit of energy, calculated just the same way but in more sensible units. It still involves squaring of the velocity in the calculation.

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