Westley Posted April 14, 2015 Report Share Posted April 14, 2015 I agree with all of the above, but ONE lesson with a good Instructor would, hopefully take care of master eye, gunfit and stance issues, then and only then can you carry on with the practice. Going back to that car thing, you would not expect to drive it without the seat being correctly adjusted.................or would you ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flycoy Posted April 14, 2015 Report Share Posted April 14, 2015 Hi all, good tips from the guys and an offer worth taking up from Tightchoke, if you need a lesson and some range judging tips I coach at Kibworth, so can fit you in sometime for a lesson, a few stands simulate pigeon so will get you hitting them and check your master eye, gunfit etc. PM me if you need more help. Regards All Flycoy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeffjjack Posted April 15, 2015 Report Share Posted April 15, 2015 Without wanting to offend you 17 from 177 shots shows why people should start shooting and become reasonably competent on clays before moving onto live quarry , though it is different the fundimental basics are the same. I agree, but I know several people who can hit 9 out of 10 birds but fail to hit 4 out of 10 clays. Others can hit 9 out of 10 clays but are not that proficient at the flighted bird Others are lucky in that they can hit everything I have many hours on the clay ground and although clays does not "float my boat" I felt it necessary to gain the practice and I will generally hit 75% of clays. I'm sure we will all agree that flighted birds (especially the agile pigeon) are a whole different ball game. That day in particular was one of my first days out and to my surprise (and admittedly my inexperience) the pigeons were coming from every where, every angle and all at different speeds. No offence taken but you have to shoot pigeon to get better at shooting pigeon. Clays don't take you by surprise, jink or fly at different speeds out of the same trap. I have the utmost respect for all my prey and try to dispatch everything cleanly and quickly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fenboy Posted April 15, 2015 Report Share Posted April 15, 2015 While I agree you will get better shooting pigeon the more you do it ( I mentioned this above) there must still have been something fundamentally wrong with your technique to miss so many birds , what that was / is I cannot say unless I was with you , possibly range estimation , not reading the target . If you are shooting a decent score on clays it should transfer to a certain extent , but if you go down the same clay ground each week shooting the same targets each week you should soon be getting a decent score , but could you do that if you were shooting a different target at a different ground ? the challenge of clays is being good on a variety of targets at different grounds, that will get you reading speeds and angles better and improve your pigeon shooting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeffjjack Posted April 15, 2015 Report Share Posted April 15, 2015 Some of us are lucky to have spare days or afternoons in the week to practice and travel to different grounds Some of us are professionals and do this day in, day out Some have the spare cash and time to have lessons, shoot thousands of clays and buy fitted guns. Some have good people around them to sit in the hide and tell them where they are going wrong. I feel that I am doing the best that I can with the money, time and resources that I have... I am improving but I admit I am not improving as quickly as I could be if I had all of the above. Maybe because of the heightened mood when in the hide, the expectation etc. Clays just don't have that for me... maybe this is why I struggle. I am solely using the advise on here to improve my field craft skills and taking every it of advise on board. I am learning to range birds better, I'm learning my gun pattern and chokes, I practice my gun mount and I try to stay calm and relaxed in the hide etc. It all comes with experience... This forum can be a great source of knowledge and experience On the down side it can kick you right in the *****cks before you get started Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scully Posted April 15, 2015 Report Share Posted April 15, 2015 Some of us are lucky to have spare days or afternoons in the week to practice and travel to different grounds Some of us are professionals and do this day in, day out Some have the spare cash and time to have lessons, shoot thousands of clays and buy fitted guns. Some have good people around them to sit in the hide and tell them where they are going wrong. I feel that I am doing the best that I can with the money, time and resources that I have... I am improving but I admit I am not improving as quickly as I could be if I had all of the above. Maybe because of the heightened mood when in the hide, the expectation etc. Clays just don't have that for me... maybe this is why I struggle. I am solely using the advise on here to improve my field craft skills and taking every it of advise on board. I am learning to range birds better, I'm learning my gun pattern and chokes, I practice my gun mount and I try to stay calm and relaxed in the hide etc. It all comes with experience... This forum can be a great source of knowledge and experience On the down side it can kick you right in the *****cks before you get started Yep. Practise that mount in front of a mirror on a daily basis for a couple of minutes each day and it will pay dividends in the field. Without that consistent, correct mount each and every time the rest is irrelevant. Practise, practise, practise until it becomes something you don't even have to think about. TAKE YOUR TIME. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fenboy Posted April 15, 2015 Report Share Posted April 15, 2015 Some of us are lucky to have spare days or afternoons in the week to practice and travel to different grounds Some of us are professionals and do this day in, day out Some have the spare cash and time to have lessons, shoot thousands of clays and buy fitted guns. Some have good people around them to sit in the hide and tell them where they are going wrong. I feel that I am doing the best that I can with the money, time and resources that I have... I am improving but I admit I am not improving as quickly as I could be if I had all of the above. Maybe because of the heightened mood when in the hide, the expectation etc. Clays just don't have that for me... maybe this is why I struggle. I am solely using the advise on here to improve my field craft skills and taking every it of advise on board. I am learning to range birds better, I'm learning my gun pattern and chokes, I practice my gun mount and I try to stay calm and relaxed in the hide etc. It all comes with experience... This forum can be a great source of knowledge and experience On the down side it can kick you right in the *****cks before you get started Of course much is down to budget , that I can understand. What I was trying to say is that where as I say clay's can teach you much , they do not teach you much at all if you are just shooting the same ones over and over again , as you know pigeon vary such a great deal you need a huge range of different targets to even start to cover some of the possibilities. Expectation / excitement in the hide can certainly be hard to keep under control when there are lots of birds about , a few years back I used to shoot with a guy who on a slow day would hardly miss a bird yet when a big day was on the cards his shooting nearly always went to pot. I must admit despite the advice I have given I have never shot a huge amount of clays and the only lessons I have had were when I was a lad and my grandfather taught me to shoot , fortunately for me I was a natural shot and it came fairly easily to me , but who knows how much better I would have been if I had started with proper lessons. You mention not having anyone good to share a hide with , I am sure there is someone on here who is fairly local and can help you out . If not you are welcome to join me sometime over the next few months if enough pigeon are showing for you to make the trip , and I can perhaps give you a few pointers first hand. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Penelope Posted April 15, 2015 Report Share Posted April 15, 2015 A generous offer fenboy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bakerboy Posted April 15, 2015 Report Share Posted April 15, 2015 If you can get down to the A1 shooting ground at Borehamwood during the week (Wednesday to Friday) I will spend as much time as is necessary to help get you on the right path, just pay for clays and cartridges, the Coaching is free. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeffjjack Posted April 15, 2015 Report Share Posted April 15, 2015 Thank for all the offers, very kind of ya. Unfortunately bakerboy work gets in the way of all my fun! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pothunter Posted April 15, 2015 Report Share Posted April 15, 2015 the only lessons I have had were when I was a lad and my grandfather taught me to shoot , fortunately for me I was a natural shot and it came fairly easily to me Really, every body should learn to shoot as a child. Kids learn so easy and naturally. They don't try and over think and over complicate, they just point and shoot, which is actually what you're supposed to do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fenboy Posted April 15, 2015 Report Share Posted April 15, 2015 Really, every body should learn to shoot as a child. Kids learn so easy and naturally. They don't try and over think and over complicate, they just point and shoot, which is actually what you're supposed to do. Yes my lessons of which there were about two or three consisted of him chucking old beer bottles in the air for me to shoot at Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pothunter Posted April 15, 2015 Report Share Posted April 15, 2015 Yes my lessons of which there were about two or three consisted of him chucking old beer bottles in the air for me to shoot at Lol. Mine did the same. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest stevo Posted April 15, 2015 Report Share Posted April 15, 2015 (edited) Really, every body should learn to shoot as a child. Kids learn so easy and naturally. They don't try and over think and over complicate, they just point and shoot, which is actually what you're supposed to do.I got my first shotgun ( Norica. 410 Bolt action) For my seventh birthday . I was out in the fields with my dad that very afternoon. Shot my first pigeon about two weeks later. It's one of my fondest memories . . I'm now 48 in August . And I'm just getting the hang of it. To the OP if I may give you a bit of advice on top of all the other great advice given. At the end of the day you need to get lead in the air. Get out as much as your private life will allow. Always be willing to take advice even if you don't like it. Just try. Never be afraid to ask anyone . Everyone loves to be asked for there advice. It's one of the biggest complimentary things you can do. If your at a clay ground this works a treat. just watch who can shoot. And ask him/her if they have the time. Would they just watch you shoot one stand. And tell you where they think your going wrong. In the past I have ended up with sooooo many free lessons and tips. Haha they love it. But most of all enjoy yourself . And always remember .... None of us are as good as we think we are. Atb Stevo Edited April 15, 2015 by stevo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daz Harrison Posted April 15, 2015 Author Report Share Posted April 15, 2015 (edited) Edited April 15, 2015 by Daz Harrison Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fenboy Posted April 15, 2015 Report Share Posted April 15, 2015 I got my first shotgun ( Norica. 410 Bolt action) For my seventh birthday . I was out in the fields with my dad that very afternoon. Shot my first pigeon about two weeks later. It's one of my fondest memories . . I'm now 48 in August . And I'm just getting the hang of it. To the OP if I may give you a bit of advice on top of all the other great advice given. At the end of the day you need to get lead in the air. Get out as much as your private life will allow. Always be willing to take advice even if you don't like it. Just try. Never be afraid to ask anyone . Everyone loves to be asked for there advice. It's one of the biggest complimentary things you can do. If your at a clay ground this works a treat. just watch who can shoot. And ask him/her if they have the time. Would they just watch you shoot one stand. And tell you where they think your going wrong. In the past I have ended up with sooooo many free lessons and tips. Haha they love it. But most of all enjoy yourself . And always remember .... None of us are as good as we think we are. Atb Stevo Quite right , I used to think I was a decent shot until I started watching your bleeding videos I have recently sold a Norica 410 , you should have brought it for a trip down memory lane ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest stevo Posted April 15, 2015 Report Share Posted April 15, 2015 Quite right , I used to think I was a decent shot until I started watching your bleeding videos I have recently sold a Norica 410 , you should have brought it for a trip down memory lane ! Haha stop it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oliver90owner Posted April 15, 2015 Report Share Posted April 15, 2015 Jay_Russell , or whoever said it first, is right. Chase through the target and, dependent on distance, speed and angle, your pulling the muzzle through, and past, the target will inevitably (if you get it right) spread the lead pattern in front of the target and strike it with sufficient pellets for a clean kill as it passes through the pattern. Any lead behind the target is simply useless! RAB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motty Posted April 15, 2015 Report Share Posted April 15, 2015 Jay_Russell , or whoever said it first, is right. Chase through the target and, dependent on distance, speed and angle, your pulling the muzzle through, and past, the target will inevitably (if you get it right) spread the lead pattern in front of the target and strike it with sufficient pellets for a clean kill as it passes through the pattern. Any lead behind the target is simply useless! RAB While I think this is correct, I feel this is a bit simplistic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yickdaz Posted April 15, 2015 Report Share Posted April 15, 2015 While I think this is correct, I feel this is a bit simplistic I think motty is really george bigweed in reality I mean digweed Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daveyp Posted July 5, 2015 Report Share Posted July 5, 2015 Daz like a few people have said it might be worth having a lesson or 2 i was having the same problem and got in touch with one of the BASC shooting coaches Alan Hawkins, met up had a lesson he picked up on a couple of things were i was going wrong. With them now corrected my shooting is better. Good luck Davey Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steveshoots Posted July 5, 2015 Report Share Posted July 5, 2015 how far in front of the bird do you pull the trigger ? i keep missing and its starting to P**** me off with all the wasted shots, im new to shooting and willing to learn. Daz Hard question to answer but I teach my kids on this basis. pickup the bird at the back at the tail feathers when its crossing in front of you sideways on. run the gun through at the same speed and pull the trigger when you pass the beak but you have to keep the gun moving if you stop the gun you will be well behind it tnis will get you killing birds. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
subsonicnat Posted July 5, 2015 Report Share Posted July 5, 2015 You need to know first,,, if you are constantly mounting the gun in the SAME PLACE.. It may have nothing to do with LEAD if you are not being accurate with gun mount.. Get someone who can SEE The air move,,!. Some claim to see shot, ever looked at the tarmac air shimmering, its the same effect.. But,,, Your FIRST call of Port, is a PATTERN PLATE.. It Tells you a LOT... time to target, yes there is a slight delay at different ranges.. It will also tell you if you shooting OFF... Team up with a mate, shooting into empty space is demoralising and makes you worse. Good luck anyway, Too many variables to talk JUST about LEAD i'm afraid.. Take note of above, Before you get into a rut with not knowing where the shot is. Best of Luck Mate.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Squinting shot Posted July 5, 2015 Report Share Posted July 5, 2015 Go clay pigeon shooting that will get you into swing and lead that you can use in the field. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Squinting shot Posted July 5, 2015 Report Share Posted July 5, 2015 Lead is funny to work out I was shooting crossers at the clay ground and had 2" of lead at the gun the chap who was shooting me couldn't hit them with 2" lead at the gun. Plus watch the bird not the bead stick a easy hit sight on the end it works for me Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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