MUDDYONE Posted April 29, 2015 Report Share Posted April 29, 2015 Are pintail in decline?I was away for the weekend in Wiltshire and had a conversation that got me thinking about changes in the species that end up in the bag. The chap I was talking to is a game shooter and deer stalker and I was trying to convert him to the glory that is proper wildfowling (i.e. out on the mud). I had, as they say “partaken of ale” and was being somewhat dismissive of flight pond mallard compared to my favourite duck, high fast pintail over the saltings, when another chap who had been listening into our conversation joined in. He said that where he goes bird watching (apparently he is not a shooting man, but then I suppose no one is perfect) he had hardly seen any pintail. The interesting thing is that he was talking about the Medway estuary and the RSPB reserve on the Isle of Sheppey, an area I know quite well. From the mid-seventies to the mid-eighties I used to shoot there virtually every other day, sometimes going out in the punt and spending two or three days at a time on one of the islands. Although the main duck species that ended up in the bag were teal, widgeon and mallard I certainly remember having quite a number of pintail as well.Due to ill health and advancing old age I have not been on the marsh much in the last 3 or 4 seasons so I am a bit out of touch, things may have changed or maybe I am looking back with rose tinted glasses. I will ask some of the chaps that still shoot the area regularly if they have seen the numbers fall, but just out of curiosity I thought I would throw the question out to others as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FatFreddysCat Posted April 29, 2015 Report Share Posted April 29, 2015 I shoot out there regularly. Definitely fewer pintail now than there were in the 80's and 90's. Also, they seem to arrive later in the season. Mallard have also declined but more greylags around now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anser2 Posted April 29, 2015 Report Share Posted April 29, 2015 Across Europe pintail are declining and more so in the UK due to short stopping as we have much milder winters these days. Pintail are rather local with some marshes holding good numbers while others never see them. Back in the 1980s when I used to shoot a lot on the Wash they were common at the end of the season and you could see 5-6,000 on a stormy high tide ( I once shot 11 drakes in a flight ). These days they just number in the hundreds. I now shoot mainly on the N Norfolk coast and the Broads and its 3 seasons since I shot one! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reabrook Posted April 29, 2015 Report Share Posted April 29, 2015 I'm led to believe they are in decline and as Anser says the UK population is subject to short stopping. However in the last five to ten years I've seen more and more in areas I've never encountered them before some of which I'd never associate with them. For example some of the small flashes that I shoot along the Wiltshire Avon. Numbers of late season Pintail on the Severn Estuary also seem on the increase. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
islandgun Posted April 29, 2015 Report Share Posted April 29, 2015 Across Europe pintail are declining and more so in the UK due to short stopping as we have much milder winters these days. Pintail are rather local with some marshes holding good numbers while others never see them. Back in the 1980s when I used to shoot a lot on the Wash they were common at the end of the season and you could see 5-6,000 on a stormy high tide ( I once shot 11 drakes in a flight ). These days they just number in the hundreds. I now shoot mainly on the N Norfolk coast and the Broads and its 3 seasons since I shot one! were are they short stopping from and it is due to our milder winters or milder winters in scandinavia (where ever) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marsh man Posted April 29, 2015 Report Share Posted April 29, 2015 I have noticed a sharp decline in numbers in the last 10 years, and apart from the odd year when numbers are slightly higher than previous years the overall trend is they are now one of the rarest duck we shoot , with numbers often under 100. I did put the numbers on here last year that the B T O done on the estuary a couple of years ago when they counted 15,000 Widgeon and only 90 odd Pintail ,and now shooting is all but finished on the estuary it is not down to shooting pressure why there in short supply , and it will be a sad day when or if they are no longer around as to me the drake is the supreme champion of the duck that come and visit us in the winter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fal Posted April 30, 2015 Report Share Posted April 30, 2015 I have only ever seen one down around this neck of the woods, South Wales, it was a dake which I managed to bag. One of the best looking birds I have ever manager to get my hands on I haven't seen one since, in all my visits to the shore and that was five years ago!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TIDES EDGE Posted April 30, 2015 Report Share Posted April 30, 2015 I shoot out there regularly. Definitely fewer pintail now than there were in the 80's and 90's. Also, they seem to arrive later in the season. Mallard have also declined but more greylags around now. I have shot this area for the last 40 years and still do and would agree with what FatFreddy postedI only saw 2 pintail all season also the wigeon clear off very early on in the season probably to the RSPB reserve on Sheppey. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
misser Posted April 30, 2015 Report Share Posted April 30, 2015 am seeing fewer each season...pity... as in my humble opinion a beautiful bird Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motty Posted April 30, 2015 Report Share Posted April 30, 2015 I don't see many that often, but when the conditions are right I can see quite a few during a flight. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MUDDYONE Posted April 30, 2015 Author Report Share Posted April 30, 2015 Thanks to all who responded. It looks like my birdwatching acquaintance was right and there are not the numbers that there used to be, well at least in my neck of the woods. I suppose that with my visits to the marsh not as numerous as they used to be I shall just have to accept that I have probably shot my last one. I agree with Marsh Man, Fal and Misser, the drake is a magnificent bird. I remember shooting my first one out on the front of Tudor marsh. When my old dog brought it back covered in mud I took it down to the tides edge and washed the mud off and spent the rest of the flight admiring it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marsh man Posted April 30, 2015 Report Share Posted April 30, 2015 What I did notice with Pintail was they were less weary than most of the duck we went after . When we were learning to push on to fowl in a gunning punt we could make the odd mistake with the boat being blown sideways a bit ,or our arm coming up to high with the pole the PIntail wouldn't pay to much attention , making it possible to get within 35 to 40yds for a shot with your shoulder gun. Another time when I had some decoys on a splash of water Pintail were coming in while my dog was splashing about picking up the ones I had just shot without showing to much alarm. So have any fowlers who have been lucky enough to have shot a few in the past noticed the same ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motty Posted April 30, 2015 Report Share Posted April 30, 2015 What I did notice with Pintail was they were less weary than most of the duck we went after . When we were learning to push on to fowl in a gunning punt we could make the odd mistake with the boat being blown sideways a bit ,or our arm coming up to high with the pole the PIntail wouldn't pay to much attention , making it possible to get within 35 to 40yds for a shot with your shoulder gun. Another time when I had some decoys on a splash of water Pintail were coming in while my dog was splashing about picking up the ones I had just shot without showing to much alarm. So have any fowlers who have been lucky enough to have shot a few in the past noticed the same ? I have heard others say that pintail are stupid. I have found in my relatively limited experience that they can be easily called. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anser2 Posted April 30, 2015 Report Share Posted April 30, 2015 Yes marshman I have found pintail to be daft sometimes and fly over my head when in the open and when you do shoot at a bunch they often do not tower upwards like most other dabbling duck. If I could only shoot one other duck before i die it would have to be a adult drake pintail in full winter plumage. I will never forget my first , a bunch of three drakes came over me at high tide on the Wash when I was still in my teens. I have a picture in my mind of their pure white bellies and dark choclate heads so sharp against a powder blue sky in the late afternoon sun. The leading drake curled his neck and fell 30 yards off in a tiny creek so he was spottless clean when I picked him out of the water. I was so excited I forgot to fire the second barrel. Islandgun by short stopping we mean that they have made their way south from the Arctic and are stopping the other side of the North Sea as most winters the weather is not cold enough to push them over to us. Though having said that back in the 1970s we used to have 2 waves of pintail pass through the Wash. The first in late September were mainly females and young birds . Then only small numbers remained until Feburary when a second wave of pintail appeared , but these were nearly all adult drakes. Pintail are great nomads and will desert old areas if they find the right conditions elsewhere. I can remember Jef Harrison saying that they all would leave the Medway within 12 hours of the Ouse Washes flooding. Gods knows how they knew ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
islandgun Posted April 30, 2015 Report Share Posted April 30, 2015 Yes marshman I have found pintail to be daft sometimes and fly over my head when in the open and when you do shoot at a bunch they often do not tower upwards like most other dabbling duck. If I could only shoot one other duck before i die it would have to be a adult drake pintail in full winter plumage. I will never forget my first , a bunch of three drakes came over me at high tide on the Wash when I was still in my teens. I have a picture in my mind of their pure white bellies and dark choclate heads so sharp against a powder blue sky in the late afternoon sun. The leading drake curled his neck and fell 30 yards off in a tiny creek so he was spottless clean when I picked him out of the water. I was so excited I forgot to fire the second barrel. Islandgun by short stopping we mean that they have made their way south from the Arctic and are stopping the other side of the North Sea as most winters the weather is not cold enough to push them over to us. Though having said that back in the 1970s we used to have 2 waves of pintail pass through the Wash. The first in late September were mainly females and young birds . Then only small numbers remained until Feburary when a second wave of pintail appeared , but these were nearly all adult drakes. Pintail are great nomads and will desert old areas if they find the right conditions elsewhere. I can remember Jef Harrison saying that they all would leave the Medway within 12 hours of the Ouse Washes flooding. Gods knows how they knew ! thanks anser2 Do we know the numbers that are short stopping ? if so we would be able to understand if they are decreasing in numbers or just not needing to fly this far, I see very few (if any) but it would be interesting to see if numbers are down in N/E Scotland or N England Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richie10 Posted May 1, 2015 Report Share Posted May 1, 2015 Must admit, I saw more this year than other years, but that was towards the end of the season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Klammer Posted May 1, 2015 Report Share Posted May 1, 2015 I have seen more in the last two seaons than ever, although most were very late in the season, and then only on a really good tide. I have only shot 3, 1 per season. The only drake was the first, it was getting to packing up time when 3 birds came from the dark eastern sky, and I just had time to get a single shot off. It fell in some gooey mud and the dog seemed to have rolled it in even more when it finally came to hand. With no moon it was almost pitch black and taking a quick glance at the bird, and seeing lots of white mixed in with the brown mud, i thought it was, as my mate calls them Butlins Bombers, or a ****** offspring crossbreed from a randy Aylesbury, (I already had 2 of them in the bag). It was only when I got home that I saw it was a drake pintail, to say I was chuffed was an understatement. Beautiful to look at, and even better to eat. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dee Wildfowler Posted May 1, 2015 Report Share Posted May 1, 2015 Very interesting to read the comments on my favourite duck. Back in the 60s when I started wildfowling it was common to see tens of thousands of Pintail flighting on a tide but mainly due to excessive, uncontrolled cockling for a couple of years the numbers dropped considerably but we still get more than our share with club members shooting a few hundred each season. The 2012-2013 season was the worst season for Pintail we've ever had but numbers were back to a more normal level last season. We shoot a majority of our Pintail in the September to December period with fewer being shot in January and February, perhaps the birds we lose are the ones which appear in other areas late in the season. John Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scolopax Posted May 2, 2015 Report Share Posted May 2, 2015 I wonder if more Pintail these days fall to the few punt gunners than to the shore shooters. The few guys who I know who go afloat seem to get some good shots at the Pinnies, in fact even a small shot generally produces more pintail than I have shot in my life. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Farma Geddon Posted May 2, 2015 Report Share Posted May 2, 2015 For those of you who think pinnies are stupid,try shooting the ******* late season on the Ouse washes. Very cautious Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fenboy Posted May 2, 2015 Report Share Posted May 2, 2015 I am still waiting for one to be stupid enough to get within range of me ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anser2 Posted May 3, 2015 Report Share Posted May 3, 2015 (edited) Fenboy next season think out of your normal confort zone to get your pintail. Pick a smallish tide with a strong North gale. Select a section of marsh well away from any creeks and leave the dog at home. Walk out to a decent clump of spartania and be prepared to lay down on your back on the mud and as the tide comes in we used to find quite a few pintail would come up the tide edge very low in the wind. As long as you were lying down the pintail never seemed to notice you and over the years I shot a lot like this. Forget about a hide and as long as you are well away from any sizable creeks you should have no problem picking your birds even winged ones as on the Wash the water is usually very shallow until you are a long way out from the marsh edge. Shooting from a lying position is not easy , but let the birds come well into you and you should have some good chances. Do not attempt long shots , usually you will miss. I dont supose I hae shot more than a few dozen pintail at morning or evening flight. But tide flighting had produced more pintail than I should like to admit to on here. But this style of shooting is a young mans game. Edited May 3, 2015 by anser2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fenboy Posted May 3, 2015 Report Share Posted May 3, 2015 Thanks for the advice anser2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
washwildfowler Posted May 3, 2015 Report Share Posted May 3, 2015 I am still waiting for one to be stupid enough to get within range of me ! .that will change this season , i can now take You to them , well if they come ... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony G Posted May 3, 2015 Report Share Posted May 3, 2015 I can't wait to see Fenboy laid on his back in the mud on the edge of the tide ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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