Dekers Posted July 30, 2015 Report Share Posted July 30, 2015 (edited) If you can aford it have several calibres then you can use what best fits your quarry :yes: You can cut your lawn with a pair of nail scissors if you want, and you can cut your nails with a pair of shears, that doesn't make nail scissors and shears good all rounders. Or you could just use the most appropriate tool for each specific job. I don't take a Rimfire out when I'm after the Boar, and I have never reached for my .308 when I go out after the fox! Edited July 30, 2015 by Dekers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dekers Posted July 30, 2015 Report Share Posted July 30, 2015 (edited) What you have to remember is this is the internet ghosthunter, Dekers is not what you may think, I know for a fact that he is a spotty faced teenager who just wishes he could hit something with his gat gun, just another internet nurd, he has been reasonably quiet of late, probably because he's been revising for his sats. I find it difficult to take anyone seriously who needs to use a .308 on CWD because they are so hard to stop, and even then, when using such a cannon needs to follow blood trails. Edited July 30, 2015 by Dekers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dekers Posted July 30, 2015 Report Share Posted July 30, 2015 (edited) My initial comment seems to have offended you Sir! Rather than trying to make me one of your targets, why not try others on here who also have given a thumbs up for a 308. Have a nice day yourself. Happy hunting/Pest controlling! Your selective responses were as I expected, and I knew you wouldn't have any pictures. You must have deep pockets if you are buying factory ammo in all weights for the .308, and who supplies factory in sub sonic? Or don't you actually have one, perhaps you're just reading a lot? Edited July 30, 2015 by Dekers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dekers Posted July 30, 2015 Report Share Posted July 30, 2015 Guys If many of you are finding the .308 a good all rounder I'm happy for you, reloading will make that more appropriate. Just the same there is no way in the world I could/would ever refer to it as a good all rounder. As I have mentioned earlier, I don't even see it as a good all rounder just for deer. Then again I have a selection of calibres to choose from, and don't have to reach for a .308 for fox or small deer, and don't have any problem stopping larger deer with my .243! If I found other calibres lacking for deer, fox, squirrels whatever, I'd use my .308, because its my business and I have the tools for the jobs. ATB! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dekers Posted July 30, 2015 Report Share Posted July 30, 2015 (edited) I have been a one gun stalker for many years . For many years I used the mighty .270 and for many years I used the venerable .308 . Both these calibres are without a doubt the only gun you will ever want to shoot any deer in Europe . I also used both calibres for fox ,as my brief was always to shoot a fox before a deer . There are 3 estates in Norfolk that I know of that won't allow .243 to be used on red deer . If you intend to be a one gun stalker then you ought to seriously consider the mighty .270 or the venerable .308 . Harnser A number of other Estates don't allow anything less than .308 for larger deer, so what, all that means is people can't shoot or the land doesn't lend itself to smaller calibres for whatever reason, that doesn't turn the .308 into a good all rounder! Obviously if he intends to be a one gun stalker and shoot on such estates he will need the likes of a .308, but he said mainly fox and small deer and maybe some Reds! Edited July 30, 2015 by Dekers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welshwarrior Posted July 30, 2015 Report Share Posted July 30, 2015 Right I've not said a 308 is an all rounder I said if I could only have one CF it would be a 308 I don't believe in all rounders more a tool box to pick from. Possibles to look at as well. 243 25-06 260 and 7x64 all deer legal will of course kill foxes, ammo in your area needs to be checked for some of your not hand loading. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Underdog Posted July 30, 2015 Report Share Posted July 30, 2015 6.5x55 makes a good all......is a versatile cartridge lol. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dekers Posted July 30, 2015 Report Share Posted July 30, 2015 (edited) Right I've not said a 308 is an all rounder I said if I could only have one CF it would be a 308 I don't believe in all rounders more a tool box to pick from. That is precisely my point! Possibles to look at as well. 243 25-06 260 and 7x64 all deer legal will of course kill foxes, ammo in your area needs to be checked for some of your not hand loading. My views stem from a comment in #3. If I could ONLY have one centrefire it would most probably also be the .308, because it can deal with the biggest quarry I currently encounter and is now ALL other species legal thanks to AOLQ. Some years back my region flately refused to condition it for fox saying it was too much gun. In the context of the current discussion I find myself in the middle of, that does not mean its a good all rounder! 6.5x55 makes a good all......is a versatile cartridge lol. Edited July 30, 2015 by Dekers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Underdog Posted July 30, 2015 Report Share Posted July 30, 2015 30wcf or 30/30 is unappreciated in this country in my opinion. Takes deer no problem at normal distances and is very loading easy, efficient. Shoots light bullets plenty good for vermin. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Underdog Posted July 30, 2015 Report Share Posted July 30, 2015 30/30 m94 trapper. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welshwarrior Posted July 30, 2015 Report Share Posted July 30, 2015 30/30 like 7 TCU are under used in this country which why I've left them off and several other so the op can get a rifle and ammo. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neutron619 Posted July 30, 2015 Report Share Posted July 30, 2015 (edited) You must have deep pockets if you are buying factory ammo in all weights for the .308, and who supplies factory in sub sonic? Lapua make a subsonic .308 round with a 200gr bullet: http://www.lapua.com/en/products/special-purpose/centerfire-rifle/20 Second one down in the table on that page. I have 20 of them awaiting testing in my cabinet currently - we'll see if they're as good as my Trail Boss / Cast Bullet loads. .308 is extremely versatile. So versatile in fact that you can load it like a .243 - my own approximation is 41.2gr of H335 under a 100gr or 110gr bullet and, hey presto, you have a .243 with a trajectory about an inch or two different from the real thing at all ordinary stalking ranges. Of course, if you need instant kills on 12-point reds at 900 yards, well - the .308 is just useless by comparison. Obviously. Edited July 30, 2015 by neutron619 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dekers Posted July 30, 2015 Report Share Posted July 30, 2015 (edited) Lapua make a subsonic .308 round with a 200gr bullet: http://www.lapua.com/en/products/special-purpose/centerfire-rifle/20 Second one down in the table on that page. I have 20 of them awaiting testing in my cabinet currently - we'll see if they're as good as my Trail Boss / Cast Bullet loads. .308 is extremely versatile. So versatile in fact that you can load it like a .243 - my own approximation is 41.2gr of H335 under a 100gr or 110gr bullet and, hey presto, you have a .243 with a trajectory about an inch or two different from the real thing at all ordinary stalking ranges. Of course, if you need instant kills on 12-point reds at 900 yards, well - the .308 is just useless by comparison. Obviously. Out of interest I wonder how many on here have ever attempted such a shot? Well, I learnt something today about .308 factory subs. I do note its an FMJ and has a trajectory slightly worse than falling off a cliff. If a .308 is your ONLY tool I expect you may find some use for it, I'm trying to think what though, I suspect throwing a brick may have a similar effect! Cheers! Edited July 30, 2015 by Dekers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ghosthunter Posted July 30, 2015 Report Share Posted July 30, 2015 If I could ONLY have one centrefire it would most probably also be the .308 Exactly my thoughts. OP wants a recommendation for a FIRST firearm that will do EVERYTHING he wants. I'm glad you have come around to my way of thinking :yahoo: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pothunter Posted July 30, 2015 Report Share Posted July 30, 2015 There are two questions being mixed up: 1) is a single rifle from fox up to red deer the best approach? 2) if you DO select one rifle from foxes up to reds, what's your best bet? My answer to 1) would be that you might ideally be better with two: one smaller (eg .243) and one larger (eg .308 or 30-06). In my area, for instance, it won't be unusual to find land which is cleared for .243 but not .308. As the OP will presumably be on a closed FAC, this may be relevant. There is a very big difference in size between a fox and a large red deer, and it would be strange if the same calibre were ideal to shoot them both. If you do want just one rifle, though, I think there are probably quite a lot more people who will consider it appropriate and effective to shoot a fox with a .308 than a large red stag with a .243. Not to say that the most common view is necessarily the right one, but quite often it is a good pointer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dekers Posted July 30, 2015 Report Share Posted July 30, 2015 (edited) Dekers, on 30 Jul 2015 - 07:41 AM If I could ONLY have one centrefire it would most probably also be the .308.......................... Exactly my thoughts. OP wants a recommendation for a FIRST firearm that will do EVERYTHING he wants. I'm glad you have come around to my way of thinking :yahoo: Sort of changes the comment when you take a small section out of context, you forgot the rest below, and I clearly said "I", if I wasn't shooting Boar I almost certainly wouldn't bother with a .308, did the OP mention Boar? "If I could ONLY have one centrefire it would most probably also be the .308.....because it can deal with the biggest quarry I currently encounter and is now ALL other species legal thanks to AOLQ. Some years back my region flately refused to condition it for fox saying it was too much gun. In the context of the current discussion I find myself in the middle of, that does not mean its a good all rounder!" What .308 do you shoot and what mixture of factory ammo do you use that makes it such a good all rounder? Don't tell me you can't even put up a picture of your rifle and a selection of all your ammo!? Edited July 30, 2015 by Dekers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neutron619 Posted July 30, 2015 Report Share Posted July 30, 2015 Well, I learnt something today about .308 factory subs. I do note its an FMJ and has a trajectory slightly worse than falling off a cliff. If a .308 is your ONLY tool I expect you may find some use for it, I'm trying to think what though, I suspect throwing a brick may have a similar effect! Cheers! Hopefully not many making 900 yard shots here. Certainly not me. Btw - in case you were wondering, those FMJs won't get pointed at anything living when I test them. They are merely for target practice / a bit of fun on the range. Same with the cast loads - think gallery rifle range, 50 yards and under. Cheap though - about 13p per pop for the ones I load myself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ghosthunter Posted July 30, 2015 Report Share Posted July 30, 2015 Sort of changes the comment when you take a small section out of context, you forgot the rest below, and I clearly said "I", if I wasn't shooting Boar I almost certainly wouldn't bother with a .308, did the OP mention Boar? "If I could ONLY have one centrefire it would most probably also be the .308.....because it can deal with the biggest quarry I currently encounter and is now ALL other species legal thanks to AOLQ. Some years back my region flately refused to condition it for fox saying it was too much gun. In the context of the current discussion I find myself in the middle of, that does not mean its a good all rounder!" Sort of changes the comment when you add things extra to it later on too doesn't it: The OP didn't mention Boar and Neither did you! I have no photographs at all of any of my guns. Nor do I have any photographs of my gun cabinet or even an empty ammunition box. I don't have a photograph of my car, motorcycle, house, horses, land, laptop or chickens that I care to post on the internet for total strangers to view. Now if you construe that to mean that purely because I don't have or want to post photographs of anything onto a public forum or anywhere else for that matter that I don't have them then that's fine. I have nothing to prove to anyone especially to you. The people I shoot with know who I am and what I have. You try to change statements to suit your purpose by adding words and changing meanings however you did say IF you could have just one then it would be a 308 and the OP is asking for first firearm (i.e. ONE) then you must admit that you agree with my comment and if you don't then your talents are wasted as a pest controller and should have been a politician instead This will be my last post on this thread. I shall no longer feed the troll. . Have a nice day! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dekers Posted July 30, 2015 Report Share Posted July 30, 2015 (edited) Sort of changes the comment when you add things extra to it later on too doesn't it: The OP didn't mention Boar and Neither did you! #4 chap, pay attention! I have no photographs at all of any of my guns. Nor do I have any photographs of my gun cabinet or even an empty ammunition box. I don't have a photograph of my car, motorcycle, house, horses, land, laptop or chickens that I care to post on the internet for total strangers to view. Now if you construe that to mean that purely because I don't have or want to post photographs of anything onto a public forum or anywhere else for that matter that I don't have them then that's fine. I have nothing to prove to anyone especially to you. The people I shoot with know who I am and what I have. You try to change statements to suit your purpose by adding words and changing meanings however you did say IF you could have just one then it would be a 308 NO I DIDN'T and the OP is asking for first firearm (i.e. ONE) then you must admit that you agree with my comment You are deluding yourself and if you don't then your talents are wasted as a pest controller and should have been a politician instead This will be my last post on this thread. I shall no longer feed the troll. . Have a nice day! Obviously English comprehension is an issue for you. There is nothing political about my response, it is factual, accurate and refers to me in my situation, and I haven't tried to change any statements or meanings to suit my purpose. I have never agreed with you, and never suggested the .308 is the ideal calibre for the OP, I haven't even said it is the ideal calibre for me either, because there simply isn't ONE ideal calibre, neither do I agree it is a good all rounder. Logic dictates that as I'm not keen on shooting Boar with a Pea shooter, I need a calibre capable of Boar, which I would just have to make do with shooting smaller species. Hence why I said If I could ONLY have one centrefire it would most probably also be the .308, (and that was a response to welshwarrior #33, not the OP) if you practice reading and comprehension you will note I didn't say IF you could have just one then it would be a 308, if you insist on quoting me kindly get it right! Is that all clear? Edited July 30, 2015 by Dekers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kennym Posted July 30, 2015 Report Share Posted July 30, 2015 The best advice I could offer would be buy a bigger gun cabinet than you think you will ever need I'm on my third cab it holds 8 guns ..... guess what its about full, guns as a hobby are infectious and they seem to bread in said cabinet (try that on the wife),..... sure an OU 12 gauge a .22LR and a .308 will do, but if you can afford it why make do, that means a 12G semi auto, a HMR, a 20G hushpower, a .204, a dedicated night gun,..... oh the list goes on, lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
69chris Posted July 30, 2015 Report Share Posted July 30, 2015 after reading thru 3 pages of this id suggest whatever you decide its prob for the best to just keep it to yourself Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redgum Posted July 30, 2015 Report Share Posted July 30, 2015 I once asked an old gamekeeper the question of what is a good number of guns to own, his answer was ' one more than you already have son'. That just about sums it up really. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hugh hickey Posted July 31, 2015 Author Report Share Posted July 31, 2015 I never thought a question could cause so much **** I got my answer from marshy Pete but thanks anyway to all that helped Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
delburt0 Posted July 31, 2015 Report Share Posted July 31, 2015 (edited) Lol reading this post I remember why I don't ever come on this site very often anymore, I see the handbag warriors are still airing there nylons. Edited July 31, 2015 by delburt0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neutron619 Posted July 31, 2015 Report Share Posted July 31, 2015 (edited) Lol reading this post I realize why I don't ever come on much. This and 50% of everything that gets posted here... :( Edited July 31, 2015 by neutron619 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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