Scully Posted July 31, 2015 Report Share Posted July 31, 2015 In the air gun section there is someone who is debating whether to sell his air rifle prior to licensing being introduced next April, and a thought occurred to me. If someone who licenses an air rifle in Scotland but then travels to England to sell it, where they aren't licensed, how would they go about it? Is there provision in the act which prevents the rifle being sold to someone who lives over the Border where they aren't licensed? Is there anything in place to prevent that air rifle being carried across the Border, or would any transaction on the Scottish side have to be made via a RFD ( at cost ) to simply disappear once sold to someone in England? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carman06 Posted July 31, 2015 Report Share Posted July 31, 2015 Would it be same as selling a FAC/SGC firearm abroad where you just notify them of buyers details. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scully Posted July 31, 2015 Author Report Share Posted July 31, 2015 (edited) Would it be same as selling a FAC/SGC firearm abroad where you just notify them of buyers details. I have no idea, but an English buyer is not required to register the purchase so long as he buys the rifle outside of Scotland, ( he can't buy one inside Scotland as he wont have a license) but the seller is, so I doubt private sales outside Scotland will take place unless via a RFD, otherwise there is no proof of legitimate sale. If a Scottish RFD is stuck with a rifle can he then decide to sell it to an English RFD, whereafter the rifle simply disappears and is registered as 'gone to England'? I'm not being awkward; this is one of the points I was trying to make. A Scottish RFD can sell to either a licensed individual or ONLY an English RFD; he can't sell directly to an English buyer as he has no proof of to whom the rifle was sold. Or am I being a bit thick and have missed the obvious? Edited July 31, 2015 by Scully Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rovercoupe Posted July 31, 2015 Report Share Posted July 31, 2015 So you could just have it on ticket and then make it vanish to a scumbag in scotland and claim it went to england which makes the law totally pointless? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neutron619 Posted July 31, 2015 Report Share Posted July 31, 2015 (edited) So you could just have it on ticket and then make it vanish to a scumbag in scotland and claim it went to england which makes the law totally pointless? The really scary thing is that they probably know this will happen already and this is all a pretence so that after 3 years, they can say "the law doesn't work, we're banning all ownership of anything resembling a gun etc.". They're not daft these Nats. Well - they are - they're a bunch of illiberal scumbags about as interested in the traditions of personal freedom and democracy as the next fascist - but they know how to play the system and they're doing their damndest to do it. Edited July 31, 2015 by neutron619 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeadWasp Posted July 31, 2015 Report Share Posted July 31, 2015 (edited) I'm just liking the concept behind Scully's question as a potential spoiler for the Natwits - anything that shows their harebrained schemes up for what they are is of interest! Edited July 31, 2015 by LeadWasp Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ordnance Posted July 31, 2015 Report Share Posted July 31, 2015 I am not sure but air rifles are FAC only in this part of the UK and they manage. I assume it would be the same rules that go for selling any firearm in the UK. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
geoffwales Posted July 31, 2015 Report Share Posted July 31, 2015 DONT HANG ME, BUT I hope this doesnt cause a kick off. i have my sgc licence and aiming for my Fac in future. I wouldnt have a problem with an air rifle licence as long as the police had a system that could easily instantly register / transfer a rifle. Maybe online or via phone. Recently ive seen posts about a poor lady being shot in the eye and a badger set being fired upon. Having a licence wouldnt stop the tossers that do that but if your out and about and had something as simple as a credit card sized certificate you could easily carry on you then your normal, buying, selling, using wouldnt be hindered. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Les*1066 Posted July 31, 2015 Report Share Posted July 31, 2015 In the air gun section there is someone who is debating whether to sell his air rifle prior to licensing being introduced next April, and a thought occurred to me. If someone who licenses an air rifle in Scotland but then travels to England to sell it, where they aren't licensed, how would they go about it? Is there provision in the act which prevents the rifle being sold to someone who lives over the Border where they aren't licensed? Is there anything in place to prevent that air rifle being carried across the Border, or would any transaction on the Scottish side have to be made via a RFD ( at cost ) to simply disappear once sold to someone in England? I think that that's just one more unanswered question to go on the list. The Scottish police have said for some time that the new legislation will be practically impossible to implement and control in Scotland, never mind across any borders. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeadWasp Posted July 31, 2015 Report Share Posted July 31, 2015 DONT HANG ME, BUT I hope this doesnt cause a kick off. i have my sgc licence and aiming for my Fac in future. I wouldnt have a problem with an air rifle licence as long as the police had a system that could easily instantly register / transfer a rifle. Maybe online or via phone. Recently ive seen posts about a poor lady being shot in the eye and a badger set being fired upon. Having a licence wouldnt stop the tossers that do that but if your out and about and had something as simple as a credit card sized certificate you could easily carry on you then your normal, buying, selling, using wouldnt be hindered. Hi geoff - not having a go fella but I thought I'd say this. If a licensing system won't stop the idiots then there's no point in restricting something. We need to live in a world where there's minimal legislation not maximum. Where we do have legislation it needs to be simple, clear and effective. There's nothing worse than bad legislation AND we've got enough of a problem with legislators legislating...'cos if they don't then they cease to have a reason to exist. Best not encourage them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
geoffwales Posted July 31, 2015 Report Share Posted July 31, 2015 Hi geoff - not having a go fella but I thought I'd say this. If a licensing system won't stop the idiots then there's no point in restricting something. We need to live in a world where there's minimal legislation not maximum. Where we do have legislation it needs to be simple, clear and effective. There's nothing worse than bad legislation AND we've got enough of a problem with legislators legislating...'cos if they don't then they cease to have a reason to exist. Best not encourage them. Yeah no problem i take on board what you said, just think our current systems are to antiquated to cope now. Chances are it may just make it harder for them to buy or get hold of an air rifle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welshwarrior Posted August 1, 2015 Report Share Posted August 1, 2015 Hi geoff - not having a go fella but I thought I'd say this. If a licensing system won't stop the idiots then there's no point in restricting something. We need to live in a world where there's minimal legislation not maximum. Where we do have legislation it needs to be simple, clear and effective. There's nothing worse than bad legislation AND we've got enough of a problem with legislators legislating...'cos if they don't then they cease to have a reason to exist. Best not encourage them. Here here. May ask police Scotland when I get time how I sell an airgun from England to someone in Scotland? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeadWasp Posted August 1, 2015 Report Share Posted August 1, 2015 Yeah no problem i take on board what you said, just think our current systems are to antiquated to cope now. Chances are it may just make it harder for them to buy or get hold of an air rifle. Hi Geoff. What i should have added - and I apologise for not saying this sooner - is that I do completely agree with you about, and applaud your sentiment that, these offences are plain nasty and shouldn't happen. I'm just not sure that licensing would stop people being cruel. Unfortunately most laws affect the majority for the sake of few bad apples. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ordnance Posted August 1, 2015 Report Share Posted August 1, 2015 Although conventional air weapons are not required to be licensed in England, Scotland and Wales, they are currently required to be licensed in Northern Ireland. Consequently, shooters wishing to take their air weapons to Northern Ireland are required to obtain a valid certificate of approval issued by the Chief Constable of the Police Service of Northern Ireland. I assume the same will apply if you want to take an air rifle into Scotland from England. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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