figgy Posted February 21, 2017 Report Share Posted February 21, 2017 Milo have a look at Armas Garbi they do some very nice guns based on the Holland & Holland action. I have the Gunmark Royale built by Garbi and it handles better than virtually every other SxS I've handled. If I had the money I'd have a pair of Garbis or Grullas made to measure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Milo Posted March 7, 2017 Author Report Share Posted March 7, 2017 Thanks, Figgy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
button Posted March 7, 2017 Report Share Posted March 7, 2017 Milo - Have you made a decision on what to go for yet? B Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Milo Posted March 7, 2017 Author Report Share Posted March 7, 2017 Milo - Have you made a decision on what to go for yet? B Hi Button, Yes. Having thought about it, I decided to go English. It will take me longer to find exactly what I am looking for but should be worth the wait. I found a Belgian pigeon gun to keep me going and have had a lot of fun with it over the winter. My 12, 20 and 28 bore over and unders hardly had an outing! Best wishes, Milo. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
button Posted March 7, 2017 Report Share Posted March 7, 2017 Hi Button, Yes. Having thought about it, I decided to go English. It will take me longer to find exactly what I am looking for but should be worth the wait. I found a Belgian pigeon gun to keep me going and have had a lot of fun with it over the winter. My 12, 20 and 28 bore over and unders hardly had an outing! Best wishes, Milo. Enjoy the search - part of the fun Good luck B Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spanj Posted March 7, 2017 Report Share Posted March 7, 2017 Hi Button, Yes. Having thought about it, I decided to go English. It will take me longer to find exactly what I am looking for but should be worth the wait. I found a Belgian pigeon gun to keep me going and have had a lot of fun with it over the winter. My 12, 20 and 28 bore over and unders hardly had an outing! Best wishes, Milo. All good things come to he who waits Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terry2016 Posted March 7, 2017 Report Share Posted March 7, 2017 Hi Milo I have a matched Pair of William Powell's (english made not the Spanish versions others are referring to) and they handle superb you can tell quality when you feel it. Whilst I agree that Spanish sxs are very good guns and some are well made, nothing feels as good to me as an english best quality side lock. Plus very few other guns are an asset in your cabinet increasing in price.. not that you should ever buy to sell. Sure all guns are tools but you will love owning an english if you do not already...below is a pic of my pair ATB Terry Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Milo Posted March 7, 2017 Author Report Share Posted March 7, 2017 Hi Milo I have a matched Pair of William Powell's (english made not the Spanish versions others are referring to) and they handle superb you can tell quality when you feel it. Whilst I agree that Spanish sxs are very good guns and some are well made, nothing feels as good to me as an english best quality side lock. Plus very few other guns are an asset in your cabinet increasing in price.. not that you should ever buy to sell. Sure all guns are tools but you will love owning an english if you do not already...below is a pic of my pair wp1.jpg ATB Terry Thanks, Terry. Have you had any mechanical issues? Have you had them a long time and put a lot of rounds through them both? Best wishes, Milo. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terry2016 Posted March 7, 2017 Report Share Posted March 7, 2017 Hi Milo, I've had this pair near 6 month (bought pre game season) no mechanical issues what so ever, they have not missed a beat ..its only me that misses ..... plenty of shots in quick succession and never a problem... just delight and a smile from ear to ear ... you can't beat heritage... ATB Terry Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Milo Posted March 7, 2017 Author Report Share Posted March 7, 2017 Hi Milo, I've had this pair near 6 month (bought pre game season) no mechanical issues what so ever, they have not missed a beat ..its only me that misses ..... plenty of shots in quick succession and never a problem... just delight and a smile from ear to ear ... you can't beat heritage... ATB Terry Thanks, Terry. Did you buy these from Holt's? I was looking at a pair. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
figgy Posted March 8, 2017 Report Share Posted March 8, 2017 (edited) Milo have a look online at articles on English SxS guns in modern use. There are two trains of thought, one is buy it use it and get a good gunsmith to remake any parts that wear out or break. The other is they were never designed for modern carts and payloads or the amount of carts and shooting they get as a pigeon gun and will be ruined in a relatively short time. As much as I love shooting my Garbi I would not use it for pigeon orclays as my main gun as I wouldn't expect it to last, it was designed as a light fast handling game gun. A dedicated pigeon SxS is a different gun built on a heavier action to take the abuse of lots of shooting. Some English pigeon guns can still be found. I don't think blindfolded very many could tell the difference between a very good foreign made SxS on the H&H and a English made of the same design. Edited March 8, 2017 by figgy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnfromUK Posted March 8, 2017 Report Share Posted March 8, 2017 (edited) I have two English s/s (one a genuine Birmingham built William Powell). My view is that they were built to shoot plenty of cartridges (there were BIG game days all through the 20th century), but they were intended for relatively modest loads. I have owned the William Powell for over 40 years - and yes, it has had a little work in that time, but in my view partly age rather than use related. The gun has clearly had a LOT of use over the years as the engraving on the trigger guard and under the action where it sits on the arm are very worn. Repairs have been; Hinge pin replaced to tighten action - done by Powells about 30 years ago Peg on knuckle that works the extractors remade/refitted due to looseness - done by Powells at the same time as the hinge pin Ribs relayed and barrels reblacked - done by Powells due to soldered join failing and risk of corrosion/water ingress Broken guide on ejector - repaired by Powells Cracked firing pin replaced by Powells - this was a 'non original replacement' according to Powells I had a friend who shot well over 10,000 cartridges (1 oz) a year through his pair of Purdeys and had no issues at all in 40 years use. He used them hard, but looked after (cleaned and lubricated after every use) them even harder. I also have two AyA s/s. I use one of the AyA's (a No 1) for driven game, clays, walked up game - but with suitably light loads (21g Hull Comp X for clays and 26 or 28g Hull Imperial for game). The AyA has about 3 or 4 thousand cartridges a year through it. It is about 50 years old and in several years use it has had both firing pins replaced (one cracked, one as a precaution). My own view is that with suitable loads English guns will be very reliable, but that many are old - and will not necessarily have been well looked after in their long lives. For example, joint pin wear is very minimal when the gun is used with clean fresh lubrication on the hinge, but can be much more rapid when used dry or with dirty gritty lubricant. There is a higher risk of damage if excess pressures occur - and this can occur through using unsuitable cartridges - which is much more likely in a 2 1/2" chambered gun Simply because there are many commonly used cartridges that are 2 3/4"). I know of one instance where the use of a slab of 2 3/4" cartridges on a simulated game day through a 2 1/2" chambered Boss gun did expensive damage (off the face) - I have heard of others who regularly use 2 3/4 in 2 1/2 chambers and 'claim' no ill effects, but it is not the right thing to do. Edited March 8, 2017 by JohnfromUK Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terry2016 Posted March 8, 2017 Report Share Posted March 8, 2017 Thanks, Terry. Did you buy these from Holt's? I was looking at a pair. Hi Milo, Thats correct there were a few pairs of WP at the time I purchased these, these were the most original of them all, I have since gone and got the original paper work and receipt of sale... So original guns, in the original oak and leather case with the original paperwork... Im happy and I am sure you would be too.. All the best Terry Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Milo Posted March 8, 2017 Author Report Share Posted March 8, 2017 Hi Milo, Thats correct there were a few pairs of WP at the time I purchased these, these were the most original of them all, I have since gone and got the original paper work and receipt of sale... So original guns, in the original oak and leather case with the original paperwork... Im happy and I am sure you would be too.. All the best Terry Thanks, Terry. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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