nicknsd1978 Posted June 24, 2016 Report Share Posted June 24, 2016 I seem to have got into a horrible habit of lifting my head....had a lesson where it was spotted that I was doing it. During the lesson we fitted a comb raiser and I was doing ok. A week later on a round of skeet I shot 20 still using the comb raiser (about average) and then last night I did absolutely terrible. Again still with the comb raiser on I was told I was lifting my head.....really wondering if this is for me Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glenlivet Posted June 24, 2016 Report Share Posted June 24, 2016 Try shooting unmounted, gun down if you're not already. Also possible variable master eye?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nicknsd1978 Posted June 24, 2016 Author Report Share Posted June 24, 2016 How will shooting gun down help?.....I have only ever shot with the gun mounted Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
subsonicnat Posted June 24, 2016 Report Share Posted June 24, 2016 FLY YOUR ELBOW. Right Angle to gun,,push's the gun firmly in your cheek.. Right,left handed,, or even BOTH.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nicknsd1978 Posted June 24, 2016 Author Report Share Posted June 24, 2016 I'm right handed and fully right eye dominant......was also told to shoot both eyes open Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
subsonicnat Posted June 24, 2016 Report Share Posted June 24, 2016 I'm right handed and fully right eye dominant......was also told to shoot both eyes open So FLY Your Right Elbow,,It will lock your head to Stock. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nicknsd1978 Posted June 24, 2016 Author Report Share Posted June 24, 2016 What do you mean by "fly your right elbow"?....I was told to lower my right elbow as I previously had it raised which was causing me to tilt the gun Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hamster Posted June 24, 2016 Report Share Posted June 24, 2016 I seem to have got into a horrible habit of lifting my head....had a lesson where it was spotted that I was doing it. During the lesson we fitted a comb raiser and I was doing ok. A week later on a round of skeet I shot 20 still using the comb raiser (about average) and then last night I did absolutely terrible. Again still with the comb raiser on I was told I was lifting my head.....really wondering if this is for me What gun do you have and what sort of sight picture (amount of rib) do you see when mounted correctly ? Also what experience level ? Do you just shoot Skeet or other disciplines as well ? This last one is important because ESP for instance has many more angles/distances and speed variations which would expose your technique and knowledge flaws much more. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nicknsd1978 Posted June 24, 2016 Author Report Share Posted June 24, 2016 I have been shooting for about 1 1/2 years only really shot skeet.....done 50 bird sporting probably 3 or 4 times.....now I'm using the comb raiser I'm seeing quite allot of rib.....what is ESP?. I have tried dry mounting tonight and really pushing my cheek down to the point it's almost hurting Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bakerboy Posted June 24, 2016 Report Share Posted June 24, 2016 It could be something really simple like , are you wearing a Baseball Cap and the peak hides the target and causes you to raise you head to see the target. The best remedy despite the very good advice you will receive from the PW members is to see a good coach. BASC APSI & CPSA websites will identify a coach in your area. Where are you based? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
subsonicnat Posted June 24, 2016 Report Share Posted June 24, 2016 Look down the barrel in mirror,,WITHOUT Forcing you face down.. You should SEE The colour ONLY of your eye above the barrel,,it sounds like you have got your riser TOO HIGH.... The higher your EYE above the barrel will make you shoot Higher.. It is like the rear sight of a rifle,,higher, means,,Higher,,,lower, means, lower.. Simple really. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hamster Posted June 24, 2016 Report Share Posted June 24, 2016 I have been shooting for about 1 1/2 years only really shot skeet.....done 50 bird sporting probably 3 or 4 times.....now I'm using the comb raiser I'm seeing quite allot of rib.....what is ESP?. I have tried dry mounting tonight and really pushing my cheek down to the point it's almost hurting ESP is English Sporting, what gun do you have, this is important because some (in truth most) guns have a particularly low comb which is simply not conducive to good shooting. A few people reach very high levels of competence with lowish combs but the better shots invariably use what could almost (if not literally) be described as Trap spec. Low combs are bad news because the target has to be covered (hidden from the eye) with the barrel in order to get good breaks, it's possible to overcome this anomaly by forcing oneself to remember not to lift the head but in practice you're always going to eventually lift your head in order to see the target better - it's an involuntary reaction. High combs which allow the eye to have a clear view of the target and its surroundings ROCK for this simple reason alone although they also have better recoil characteristics. Look down the barrel in mirror,,WITHOUT Forcing you face down.. You should SEE The colour ONLY of your eye above the barrel,,it sounds like you have got your riser TOO HIGH.... The higher your EYE above the barrel will make you shoot Higher.. It is like the rear sight of a rifle,,higher, means,,Higher,,,lower, means, lower.. Simple really. Hmmm, sorry but not quite, it can be a fair bit more complicated especially on real targets as opposed to a pattern plate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nicknsd1978 Posted June 24, 2016 Author Report Share Posted June 24, 2016 I'm based in Nottingham.....I think it is slightly high but only going by what was said in my lesson. I don't wear a baseball cap....I'm going to try the £1 coin placement and then see how much of the bead I'm seeing. He did say without the raiser for a normal person the sight picture would be ok but with me lifting my head he said although I may be seeing more rib than normal it would help with the head lifting situation Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul1440 Posted June 24, 2016 Report Share Posted June 24, 2016 (edited) I have been shooting for about 1 1/2 years only really shot skeet.....done 50 bird sporting probably 3 or 4 times.....now I'm using the comb raiser I'm seeing quite allot of rib.....what is ESP?. I have tried dry mounting tonight and really pushing my cheek down to the point it's almost hurtingESP is English Sporting.. Pushing upur head down not only may cause it to get sore it will also cause your head to lift more as it will tend to spring back up as yhe muscle tention is naturally teleased on firing. If the stock isn't too low.)recommend the put a £1 coin on the rib nearest the eye end and check that you can see the bottom of the bead trick. Ifyou can then it's unlikely that your vision is obscured by the top leaver and gubbins causing youvto lift to sed the target If thats ok it could be your mount. Bring the gun ip to the face rather than dropping the head onto the stock. A slight drop ofvyhe head is required otherwise thecstock will be above your shoulder but nothing yhat will induce tension in the neck/ shoulder Watch some videos on the ISSF website of the skeet and trap shooting. Edited June 24, 2016 by Paul1440 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nicknsd1978 Posted June 24, 2016 Author Report Share Posted June 24, 2016 I have a 30" silver pigeon....I'm just average height and weight Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul1440 Posted June 24, 2016 Report Share Posted June 24, 2016 I'm average hight and weight and find Beretta sporters too low.. I need a comb spacer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glenlivet Posted June 24, 2016 Report Share Posted June 24, 2016 How will shooting gun down help?.....I have only ever shot with the gun mountedIf you shoot gun down you can clearly see the target as you mount the gun. It sounds like you may be lifting your head to get a better view of the target as you are pre mounting. As others have said, find a good coach and have some lessons. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nicknsd1978 Posted June 24, 2016 Author Report Share Posted June 24, 2016 I never thought of shooting gun down and makes perfect sense Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welshwarrior Posted June 25, 2016 Report Share Posted June 25, 2016 We could write pages of advice here and there has been potentially some good advice but non of us can diagnoise the problem problems with out seeing you shoot. Find a good coach in your area and go for a visit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hamster Posted June 25, 2016 Report Share Posted June 25, 2016 I'm average hight and weight and find Beretta sporters too low.. I need a comb spacer. Beretta combs are generally too low, a comb spacer may help but a much better solution is a ground up Trap stock because the whole stock is angled higher meaning the gun sits in a more comfortable position in the shoulder pocket. Getting the comb raised via adj combs/spacers and/or building up layers of cardboard etc, are all OK to a degree but often the gun ends up sitting low in the shoulder with the face/head unnaturally forced to adopt an upright posture. If you asked a stocker to make you a gun, would he build one with a adj comb and loads of spacers ? No he wouldn't, he'd make sure your eye sat where it ought to by angling the whole stock a little higher. Once the new comb configuration has been adopted the next step is plenty of practice, in other words this is going to help but not cure your head lifting altogether, only practice will eventually result in fluid shooting on all angles without the subconscious taking over and lifting the eyes to see better, because you won't need to. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Sipe-ist Posted June 25, 2016 Report Share Posted June 25, 2016 It seems to me the original point has not been addressed.The problem sounds to me to be head lifting during or at the moment of firing the gun. A comb raiser may be a good starting point if a shooters eye alignment is too low, but it sounds like the problem re-occurred after the comb raiser was used.To me this would point to one of two things, either it is an aversion to recoil (which could still be a gun fit issue) or looking for the result of the shot before it has been fully completed (similar to lifting your head when hitting a golf ball). The best advise as usual though is go and see a decent coach. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nicknsd1978 Posted June 25, 2016 Author Report Share Posted June 25, 2016 The coach I used last time actually buttoned on the last round of skeet I shot.....he said the best thing to do for now is to just get out and shoot.....plenty of practice and it should correct it's self Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul1440 Posted June 25, 2016 Report Share Posted June 25, 2016 Beretta combs are generally too low, a comb spacer may help but a much better solution is a ground up Trap stock because the whole stock is angled higher meaning the gun sits in a more comfortable position in the shoulder pocket. Getting the comb raised via adj combs/spacers and/or building up layers of cardboard etc, are all OK to a degree but often the gun ends up sitting low in the shoulder with the face/head unnaturally forced to adopt an upright posture. If you asked a stocker to make you a gun, would he build one with a adj comb and loads of spacers ? No he wouldn't, he'd make sure your eye sat where it ought to by angling the whole stock a little higher. Once the new comb configuration has been adopted the next step is plenty of practice, in other words this is going to help but not cure your head lifting altogether, only practice will eventually result in fluid shooting on all angles without the subconscious taking over and lifting the eyes to see better, because you won't need to. Yes.. I use a DT10 fitted with a standard Trap stock and it is a big improvement for the reasons Hamster has described. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EdSolomons Posted June 25, 2016 Report Share Posted June 25, 2016 It's unlikely to fix itself, only get worse. Another thing to look at would be stance, if you are too neutral between your feet or coming onto the back foot you will start to come away from the gun. Get it nailed down before putting a load of lead down the gun, you will only be practicing bad habits otherwise. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andra Posted June 25, 2016 Report Share Posted June 25, 2016 Hi try this as a guide for gun mounting I found it helpful. It might just be something as simple as teaching yourself to lock your eyes on the target and following through after the trigger is pulled etc http://www.procoachshootingschool.com/images/pdf/Perfect%20Gun%20Mount.pdf Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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