holloway

Fair enough 👍

Konor please understand it is not in the hands of Basc or myself and it is not my argument it is just the way these things are looked at in todays world and the way things will eventually pan out ……my view for what its worth in the ideal world would mirror yours almost exactly, to me its a good common sense view which seems reasonable to us . I haven't thrown the towel in, but i am a realist i use steel or Bismuth for all my shooting from 410 to vintage guns but in my opinion only really possible by home loading and having no involvement with big bag shooting ,its a pain and i would rather buy shop bought cartridges but for me accepting that i cant get the ammunition to use all of my guns would be throwing the towel in. There is a much bigger picture than Bascs involvement .

Konor in todays world correctly or incorrectly the precautionary principle rules ,as anybody who has had to deal with Natural England shooting consents know .The authorities who ever they happen to be at the time will restrict ban or regulate if you cannot prove that no harm is being done ,this is the way things are being sorted today ,and with the best will in the world scattering what looks to be hundreds of thousands of tons of Lead shot over the countryside is going to be very tricky to say no harm is being done i will go further and say it will be impossible. Authorities do not need any evidence of harm they need evidence of no harm. With or without Basc this is what is happening in this country they cant stop it ,at least only by using there own evidence based data might they have any chance of doing so ,i have searched the internet for answers and data myself and am satisfied that there is a problem with lead shot ingestion there has been 50 years worth of worldwide research, all of your questions have answers that can be found on the internet if you want to you will find them. What will eventually happen is that with no firm evidence to prove that Lead shot is not harming wildlife etc it will be banned, Basc or yourself have no say in this without evidence to prove otherwise. Not saying any of this is right or wrong but it is whats happening .🙁

So 160 lbs a season if 8 shoots a season ,x 25 years comes to 1280 lbs of toxic lead shot scattered over the land,(making allowance for my awful maths ) .I would not call this a big shoot by any means but still a staggering amount of pollution by any standards. Also just to play devils advocate to all of those asking to be shown the proof of harm to wildlife by lead shot ,just do a google search yourself and you will be able to find all of the evidence you need should you choose to put in a little effort . The Americans were looking for lead shot replacement as a consequence of toxic shot restrictions over wetlands in the seventies earliest date i can find is 1966 all instigated by their research into the poisoning of waterfowl.

so using 1 1/8 loads as a good average chucking nearly 20 lbs of lead shot over the ground every shoot day .multiply that by days shooting year after year 🤔

I have always wondered just what percentage of commercial shot game is fit for sale ,what with the average consumer looking for packaged perfection in their purchases.I imagine that if a survey was done it would be alarmingly small. My own bag is used whatever state its in ,badly shot badly bruised whatever it all goes in the pot but if someone else shot it i certainly wouldn't spend money on it .

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so do you know where the Pheasant and Partridge bag ends up ? Is your rifle club affiliated to Basc ?

I tend to put my faith in the quality of the English gun maker no matter how old and as long as in good condition to be superior to most modern offerings.

I think you are probably right i am in a minority ,i do to be fair load my own but have used shop stuff successfully. I use a maximum of 1 1/8 2 shot for geese ,but stick to 1oz of 2s for the hammer gun that might seem ridiculously light but i find it works for me . My chokes are half and half in one and what i would describe as a tight half in the other .I use as light a load as works and as small a shot as i can get away with ,it does make a delightfully soft shooting experience . I have used some shop brought goose loads of 1 3/8 but found them a bit thumpy .

I use a Midland 3 inch sxs for geese have used all sorts of steel loads through it ,also a G E Lewis hammer gun never had any problems but as you know with steel you can use lighter loads to the same effect as the old heavy lead loads ( been doing this for probably 15 years ).

If the government dont decide to ban lead shot before .

I think both sides have debated very well, i have enjoyed the thread immensely. Nice to see polite disagreement .

Thanks ,i had been keeping an eye out for one for several years.

yes you can pick them up for peanuts at the moment !

They have to process thousands of lots so you will have to wait a little while to be sure ,i wouldnt give up yet its a little early.

That face means business ! lovely pup .

if you have won you will be notified by email ,if you were unsuccessful you don't hear anything ,the realised prices will be published in a day or so.

Looking forward to next season already just back from the gunsmith after a re tightening of the action .G E Lewis wildfowling gun 32 inch barrels .Its certainly had a life but sound enough for my purpose .

sorry but if you can see any bids its definitely not the sealed bid auction .

sorry i had assumed you were looking at the sealed bid 👍

The one that finishes tomorrow is a sealed bid auction you cant see what or if any bids ,prices will be published after the auction.

We have a lot of Mandarin down here on the river Dart they are seen in trees the female a lot plainer similar eye stripe ,or. wood duck maybe ?

Usually a sign that they haven't enough to eat on there own side ,maybe tell the horse owner they are poisonous trees and your worried they might get sick electric probably your best bet 👍

I like that Kevin and easy to see if you should drop it in the half light 👍