Do you think fishing is cruel?

[John_R]

Anglers pay for a licence which goes to the upkeep of our water ways, not the canoeist, not the people in yachts, but Anglers.

 

Actually, boaters pay a lot of money for use of the rivers and canals. That includes everything from canoes to gin palaces to static houseboats.

[njc110381]

Back to topic, why post the question about fishing being cruel on a pro hunting site if there is no alterior motive to the question?

 

Because I'm pro hunting too, that's why I'm here. Perhaps I'm just a little softer than some of you regarding animals feelings? When I shoot something it's usually dead straight away. Things do go wrong sometimes but that's accidental and I do my best to avoid it.

 

As it's been said I may be putting human feelings into the animal world, which I agree is silly. I can't help but think though that no matter how basic life is if a creature is forcefully removed from it's natural environment and put in a very different one it is likely to cause it some level of stress? Whether it bothers them to a serious level though I doubt we'll ever know!

[pyr8]

fishing is cruel,you have to get up a stupid o,clock spend fortunes on tackle and bait.drive miles to get were your going sit for hours bored rigid and after all this you catch bogger all.dam write i feel hurt.

[MattSoanes]

If the fish are treated with respect and cared for when on the bank then NO fishing is not cruel.

[J@mes]

Because I'm pro hunting too, that's why I'm here. Perhaps I'm just a little softer than some of you regarding animals feelings? When I shoot something it's usually dead straight away. Things do go wrong sometimes but that's accidental and I do my best to avoid it.

 

As it's been said I may be putting human feelings into the animal world, which I agree is silly. I can't help but think though that no matter how basic life is if a creature is forcefully removed from it's natural environment and put in a very different one it is likely to cause it some level of stress? Whether it bothers them to a serious level though I doubt we'll ever know!

 

 

I turn my dog upside down and carry her through the house. It's not her natural environment, it's very different. she can't work out what the hell is going on, but she flies off round the garden with her tail wagging and then comes back and tries to jump in to my arms.

 

I don't think it bothers her.

 

I don't think fishing bothers the fish either!

[henry d]

No Fishing isn't crule

 

It can be.

 

I have given some of it up as I don`t like being dictated to. I do not go Salmon fishing any more, even though I have Britains best salmon river near me.

To catch a big fish like a Salmon and fight it to a stand still and then be duty bound to return it due to a rule isn`t on to me, also there is a rule where you could keep it if it was bleeding badly.

 

Nah, I`d rather not fish thanks.

[vole]

It can be.

 

I have given some of it up as I don`t like being dictated to. I do not go Salmon fishing any more, even though I have Britains best salmon river near me.

To catch a big fish like a Salmon and fight it to a stand still and then be duty bound to return it due to a rule isn`t on to me, also there is a rule where you could keep it if it was bleeding badly.

 

Nah, I`d rather not fish thanks.

Ideally would you not want to use robust enough gear and technique to land it before it was completely spent? New braided lines allow you to fish light yet not go undergunned.

I think fish do feel pain but not in the way we would if there was a hook in our sirloin steak. They feel a basic and primitive signal that tells their brain that there is a threat to them and they go completely ape to escape (unless its a bream).

IF the pain signal was bad enough why would they pull against the line? They would be drawn to the net very easily.

I believe that the minimal number of fish death or damage is MUCH outweighed by the whole eco system that angling has promoted in the waterways of this country. Where the fish live so do insects and birds. Some achievement in a land getting covered in houses.

Like with all hunting and fishing; What we do to them is nothing compared to what they do to each other. Nothing wrong with NJC asking us lot our opinions either. We know his heart is in the right place.

Edited May 18, 2010 by vole

[Boromir]

NJC you beginning to sound like a vegetarian. :blink:

[Richie10]

Actually, boaters pay a lot of money for use of the rivers and canals. That includes everything from canoes to gin palaces to static houseboats.

 

They pay for moorings but don't pay that to the Environment Agency. Also Houseboats are exempt from Council tax.

 

What money do Canoeist pay? They were campaigning for the right to roam on any water but anglers put their foot down because the Canoeist do not contribute to the EA.

[henry d]

Ideally would you not want to use robust enough gear and technique to land it before it was completely spent? New braided lines allow you to fish light yet not go undergunned.

 

Believe me I don`t mess around ! Most beats are fly only unless the water is high and remember that Salmon are natures athletes and in a flowing river it is hard to get them in fast unless they are under 5lb.

 

This took nearly 10 minutes with spinning gear in fast spate water and I don`t know who was more tired.

[Richie10]

That one didn't go back though.... :blink:

[John_R]

They pay for moorings but don't pay that to the Environment Agency. Also Houseboats are exempt from Council tax.

 

What money do Canoeist pay? They were campaigning for the right to roam on any water but anglers put their foot down because the Canoeist do not contribute to the EA.

 

Environment Agency licenses are required for any use of any boat at all on Thames, Medway, Royal Military Canal and the Anglian region that I know of, and possibly more than that.

 

A canoe or other unpowered craft costs £30 per annum, and it goes right up into the thousands for a big vessel. That is solely for the right to float it, not including any mooring.

 

British Waterways takes the money from most of the rest of the UK boaters, but I do not know much about them as I am based on the Thames and have no experience of BW, therefore I cannot comment on their rates nor on their policy towards canoes. I think a few waterways are under National Trust, so the license fee goes to them... but there is always a fee to pay.

 

I am well aware of the canoeists campaign for a right-to-roam equivalent and I am dead set against it.

 

Houseboats are not exempt from Council tax if they are on a residential mooring, they are usually in Band A or other lower band, but they still pay the tax.

Edited May 19, 2010 by john_r

[vole]

Cracking fish Henry.

[peter-peter]

This thought has just crossed my mind as I answered another topic so I thought even at the risk of being shot down, I'd ask!

 

I'm perfectly happy to kill things. I'm by no means an anti of anything but I pretty much stopped coarse fishing some years ago now. I was sat back watching the Koi in the pond one day when I was in my teens and wondered, why do we go out and drag these poor animals out of the water just to see how big they are then put them back? I pictured myself walking into a pub next to a nice river and getting a tasty steak delivered to my table. I take a bite and it's nice so I carry on. Then I pick up an onion ring that stands out as better than the rest and take a big bite. All of a sudden I'm off out of the door, dragged by my head by a force much stronger than me yet I can't see it. Then I'm in the river being dragged under. It sounds like a scene from a low budget horror movie!

 

That's what happens to the fish! Now, if you're eating it then I guess there's no food without a moment of sufferring but to do it just for fun just isn't my thing any more. I have the odd day when that thought disappears into the background and go off doing a day of Piking etc, but afterwards I always feel bad.

 

Has anyone else ever felt that way? I'm quite happy to shoot a bunny or even a Fox or Deer but there seems to be a purpose for that. Whether it's for pest control or for the pot it has a purpose. What's the purpose of coarse fishing apart from to entertain us? I feel that this question would drag up screams of "TROLL" if I was a newbie but I've been here long enough now for you all to know that's not the case. I'm not trying to stir an arguement or suggest people shouldn't go fishing, I'm just interested to know if anyone else shares my views?

I have the answer nic eat the bloody fish.

[John_R]

I have the answer nic eat the bloody fish.

 

Careful what you wish for. In Germany the Greens managed to make it illegal to go fishing unless you kill and take away everything.

[henry d]

That one didn't go back though....

 

That`s because it was 16 years ago when putting fish back was an option not a requirement :blink:

[njc110381]

If you're going to eat it then that makes it a lot better in my mind. I think a certain amount of sufferring is always going to exist for as long as man eats meat but that's offset by its food value.

 

Me a veggie? Yeah right! I just had steak and chips for lunch and I'll have chicken curry for dinner! I can't remember the last time I went a whole day without some form of meat in my diet!

[Blackpowder]

This year the River Tweed Commission have made it a rule that all spring salmon have to be returned until the end of June. A few decades ago famous angling authors were posing at Tweedside angling hotels with well into double figures of salmon. Dead salmon, most of these fish had to be getting sold via game dealers as no one could have eaten a weeks catch in those halcyon days. But this is getting away from the post , I have fished for sport all my life and been a creel fisherman and charter boat skipper for 20 of those years. In that time I have seen fit rod caught fish with what can only be described as horrific injuries inflicted by marine predators. These wounds were healing and the fish were feeding so I reckon fish do not feel the degree of pain warm blooded creatures do, as the trauma and shock from some of these wounds would surely have killed them.

 

Blackpowder

[gottsy boy]

i feel sorry for the maggots

[MITCHF]

NO.

 

But I think making humans live in house boats "is" cruel.

Should't there be a fundraising campain to buy them a proper house ?

[gladrag]

Man has fished since time began.The only fish issue which p&**es me off is where trawlers throw back perfectly good fish,often dead because it is the wrong sort/the daft EU Quota system that is a waste and a crime.If a fish is caught and eaten great,if it is caught/properly handled and returned thats great too.

Personally I have not fished since I was a child but I shall defend the right to fish...It is another fantastic way to get out into peaceful countryside and enjoy life rather than sit in vacuous wingeing w(h)ine (sic) bars worrying about how fish feel. Fishing is a country pursuit to most and a living to some the thought of a ban is simply daft. If you personally worry about how the fish feels don't fish simple,as a child I had a pet Jackdaw so personally don't shoot jackdaws but I 'll shoot a magpie/crow without a second thought...thats my personal freedom and choice,lets defend these freedoms so people have their choices too!

 

Succinctly put Sir. I won't bother to comment further.

[Norrie]

Has anyone else ever felt that way? I'm just interested to know if anyone else shares my views?

 

 

Been fishing for 40 odd years, never felt like that...and NOPE, I dont share yer views...they seem too anti for my mind!!!! D'you think the same about the Rabbit, or Deer, or even the Fox you shoot ?....no, so why think like that about a fish...hmmm, next it'll be Mussels, then Worms.....

[MPT1]

I've fished most of my life and have returned 99% of my catch unscathed.

On occasion I know that the odd 1% have died but then they have joined the food chain.

 

The use of keepnets is now frowned on and in some places banned.

Barbed hooks are now not use so removing the hook is easy.

 

The only suffering is being duped into taking a bait with a hook in.

[Richie10]

I wonder if in the natural world the predators are asking whether when they were eating the fish alive was cruel or not?

Are any predators campaign for their preys Animal rights?

I think things are only seen as humane if people can pretend they don't happen.

 

Nothing is humane not even in nature, so stop try pretending it is, that is reality and if you personally can't deal with it don't do it, but don't try and stop other people doing it because you are going against nature.

[BIGDAN]

nic1 does have a valid point. its not one i share but he has every right to voice it. i sea fish so not much goes back. what really ****** me off was that not a single member of the angling hierachy stuck up for shooting and hunting when it was under threat just after the fox ban. if shooting goes then fishing must surely follow. the government wont ban fishing as there are over four million of us in britain that fish regularly and most of us vote.

just remember we are all in this together. anglers ,hunters,foragers, shooters etc every single person in he country hunts every time they walk down the supermarket aisle and buys any kind of meat, they are just as responsible for the death of the creature as the person who killed it on their behalf.

stick together !!