Finding time to do proper Reconnaissance

[Super major]

Hello,

 

I'm new to pigeon shooting and seem to be falling at the first hurdle really as I don't feel like I'm doing my reconnaissance properly. I've studied John Batley's book The Pigeon Shooter: The Complete Guide to Modern Pigeon Shooting and think I've got most of it committed to memory but the few times I've been the birds haven't played ball.

The other evening (got there roughly 5:45pm) they were sat in the corner of a neighbouring field (spring drillings, apparently they'd been on the winter OSR on my permission earlier where I was sat), no more joining them so no particular flightline I could see. Bit later they flew no more than 70-80yards to sit up in a wood on my permission, then a little later still came down to the OSR on my permission but again only 70-80yards from the wood. Eventually they returned to the same wood to roost. During the time I was there maybe 4 birds flew on something which I thought vaguely looked like a fightline but nothing like as clear as I had hoped and I'm not sure whether these birds would have heading to roost elsewhere. I think I may have been there too late in the day but during the week and usually Saturdays as well this is the only time I have to do reconnaissance. I'd be interested to hear how others find the time to properly do their reconnaissance as I'm struggling to work out how. Any other advice would be appreciated too.

 

Cheers,

 

Rob

[AlistairB]

I find sitting in the truck in a field at the weekend after an arguemwnt with the missus works! It's amazing what you see then!

[COACH]

Yeah, bit late in the day really. But saying that, another day you will be lucky.

[Cranfield]

As has been said, it was a bit late in the day to find committed flightlines, but you did learn something.

 

The birds are using "your" wood to drop down on to "your" rape and also the neighbouring field.

A hide on the edge of the wood where they were sitting and some decoys out in the rape should give you some shooting.

It also looks as though that might be their last feeding spot before going to roost, so its a good late afternoon spot (also probably first thing in the morning).

 

When you go to shoot on the land have a good drive round all the potential fields first, spending some time watching each one.

If you see birds feeding scare them off, preferrable by walking them off, but if necessary fire a scare shot.

See how long it takes them to come back (if they do), if they are back reasonable quickly, or there is bird traffic, then go and set up.

Watch which way the birds enter and leave the field and if there are areas on the field they consistently go to.

 

If after 30 minutes or so no birds show an interest in the field, go and look at another one.

 

I don't set up unless I have seen birds feeding on a field.

 

Sometimes you just have to accept that the birds are not playing the game and committing to a field, this happens when they are spoiled for choice and differing weather conditions can have a large influence.

You have the choice of going home, or setting up in "lite" mode and being prepared to move a few times in the day and "chase" the birds.

"Lite" mode is just a few decoys, no electronics , cartridges in pocket, no camp building, etc., it can provide surprisingly good shooting opportunities and you can learn a lot by visiting a few fields in a day.

[WoodyPopper]

I could almost have written your post myself. I read that book too - and I was also disappointed to find that flight lines are not as obvious as I'd expected.

However, the longer I spend on this lark, the more I'm beginning to notice. As far as I can see, flight lines do exist but they're not always in use. But when they are in use, they're pretty rigid. For example, I placed myself recently where I thought I'd be right under a flight line. But after half an hour, it became obvious that the line was about 25 yards further down the hedgerow. I moved my hide and that 25 yards made all the difference.

My permission is just about within walking distance, and I can detour through it in the car on the way to and from work some times. But still, my time on it on any day is limited to ten minutes or so.

I suspect you'll find, like me, that gradually it all starts to fall into place. Spend as much time on your permission as possible. I've still got a long, long way to go - but at least I'm beginning to notice patterns, signs and portents!

Edited April 8, 2011 by WoodyPopper

[retromlc]

"Lite" mode is just a few decoys, no electronics , cartridges in pocket, no camp building, etc., it can provide surprisingly good shooting opportunities and you can learn a lot by visiting a few fields in a day.

That's what i've started doing,with so many fields and therefore food options available 1 shot will see them vanish,so being able to move off a field to another without losing to much time and energy is ,at the moment a better option.

[yickdaz]

i went for a look yesterday on drilling 3 or 4 fields in an area with birds going on all of them,didn;t know which field was best so picked the best flightline but when i set up birds just went to one of the other fields and didn;t come back,packed up thought i would look at one of the other fields,watched for a while then saw birds going back to where i was in the first place,set up again did the same never came back,so thought not chasing you round all afternoon, so 2 of us will go sat and maybe split up only way i see it working.

[Cranfield]

i went for a look yesterday on drilling 3 or 4 fields in an area with birds going on all of them,didn;t know which field was best so picked the best flightline but when i set up birds just went to one of the other fields and didn;t come back,packed up thought i would look at one of the other fields,watched for a while then saw birds going back to where i was in the first place,set up again did the same never came back,so thought not chasing you round all afternoon, so 2 of us will go sat and maybe split up only way i see it working.

 

Sometimes its worth investing in a box/tub of string bangers and putting a string out on one, or two, of the other fields (depending how close they are).

This is quicker than putting out ferilizers sack flags, but not as cheap.

This can give you the same effect as another gun.

[proTOM1]

Hello,

 

I'm new to pigeon shooting and seem to be falling at the first hurdle really as I don't feel like I'm doing my reconnaissance properly. I've studied John Batley's book The Pigeon Shooter: The Complete Guide to Modern Pigeon Shooting and think I've got most of it committed to memory but the few times I've been the birds haven't played ball.

The other evening (got there roughly 5:45pm) they were sat in the corner of a neighbouring field (spring drillings, apparently they'd been on the winter OSR on my permission earlier where I was sat), no more joining them so no particular flightline I could see. Bit later they flew no more than 70-80yards to sit up in a wood on my permission, then a little later still came down to the OSR on my permission but again only 70-80yards from the wood. Eventually they returned to the same wood to roost. During the time I was there maybe 4 birds flew on something which I thought vaguely looked like a fightline but nothing like as clear as I had hoped and I'm not sure whether these birds would have heading to roost elsewhere. I think I may have been there too late in the day but during the week and usually Saturdays as well this is the only time I have to do reconnaissance. I'd be interested to hear how others find the time to properly do their reconnaissance as I'm struggling to work out how. Any other advice would be appreciated too.

 

Cheers,

 

Rob

 

for me the best time of day to spot flightlines is first light when the birds are hungry and leave the roost wood and head to there choosen field

Edited April 8, 2011 by proTOM1

[Super major]

Some great replies so far thank you

 

Went again tonight, managed to finish work a bit sooner so got onto the same field about 4:55. They were doing the same again more or less, dropping from the wood, flying along the hedgerow and either sitting in the hedge then dropping onto the field or landing directly on the field.

There was a nice steady stream dropping in until they were disturbed and flew back to the wood again. When they dropped down again most went onto the neighbouring field but some came back to mine.

Plan is to go tomorrow afternoon, not expecting much but hopefully get a couple of hours of sport.

 

Didn't realise in my first post I might have left out a little bit of important information. There is a railway line running between the wood and the two fields I've mentioned. The line is well up a bank with lots of cover. Problem is I'm unsure of the exact law relating to shooting near railway lines, I'll have a quick search on here but if there's any doubt I'll keep away. Logically it shouldn't be a problem as I'd be shooting away from the line and it'd be very unlikely that anyone on the train would even see me because of all the cover.

 

At the moment I can't decide whether to-

 

Set up with my back to the line in a nice bit of dense hawthorn giving me a good background for the hide and a little cover overhead. I'm uncertain whether the birds would fly over my decoys then turn back or once they've set off from the trees have they decided where they want to land and ignore the decoys. Also with the amount of cover near the hide I don't think they'll see the decoys from the trees.

 

Other option is to set the hide up further down the hedge where I've seen the birds feeding but my only concern there is whether I could make as good a job of the hide as with the other spot.

 

With either set up I'd thought of putting a few full bodied decoys in the hedge, any thoughts on whether it'd be worth doing?

 

Anyway we'll see how it goes, if it doesn't go to plan at least I might not have to clean the gun

[motty]

As has been said, it was a bit late in the day to find committed flightlines, but you did learn something.

 

The birds are using "your" wood to drop down on to "your" rape and also the neighbouring field.

A hide on the edge of the wood where they were sitting and some decoys out in the rape should give you some shooting.

It also looks as though that might be their last feeding spot before going to roost, so its a good late afternoon spot (also probably first thing in the morning).

 

When you go to shoot on the land have a good drive round all the potential fields first, spending some time watching each one.

If you see birds feeding scare them off, preferrable by walking them off, but if necessary fire a scare shot.

See how long it takes them to come back (if they do), if they are back reasonable quickly, or there is bird traffic, then go and set up.

Watch which way the birds enter and leave the field and if there are areas on the field they consistently go to.

 

If after 30 minutes or so no birds show an interest in the field, go and look at another one.

 

I don't set up unless I have seen birds feeding on a field.

 

Sometimes you just have to accept that the birds are not playing the game and committing to a field, this happens when they are spoiled for choice and differing weather conditions can have a large influence.

You have the choice of going home, or setting up in "lite" mode and being prepared to move a few times in the day and "chase" the birds.

"Lite" mode is just a few decoys, no electronics , cartridges in pocket, no camp building, etc., it can provide surprisingly good shooting opportunities and you can learn a lot by visiting a few fields in a day.

I agree with almost all that Cranfield says. However, just because there aren't any pigeons on the field you intend to shoot on when you arrive, doesn't mean they won't turn up. Obviously if you've never seen pigeons on a field before, it might be a mistake to set up, but if you're fairly certain birds are using a field, give it a go. Many good bags i've shot have come from setting up on fields that didn't have a pigeon on when i arrived.

[motty]

Some great replies so far thank you

 

Went again tonight, managed to finish work a bit sooner so got onto the same field about 4:55. They were doing the same again more or less, dropping from the wood, flying along the hedgerow and either sitting in the hedge then dropping onto the field or landing directly on the field.

There was a nice steady stream dropping in until they were disturbed and flew back to the wood again. When they dropped down again most went onto the neighbouring field but some came back to mine.

Plan is to go tomorrow afternoon, not expecting much but hopefully get a couple of hours of sport.

 

Didn't realise in my first post I might have left out a little bit of important information. There is a railway line running between the wood and the two fields I've mentioned. The line is well up a bank with lots of cover. Problem is I'm unsure of the exact law relating to shooting near railway lines, I'll have a quick search on here but if there's any doubt I'll keep away. Logically it shouldn't be a problem as I'd be shooting away from the line and it'd be very unlikely that anyone on the train would even see me because of all the cover.

 

At the moment I can't decide whether to-

 

Set up with my back to the line in a nice bit of dense hawthorn giving me a good background for the hide and a little cover overhead. I'm uncertain whether the birds would fly over my decoys then turn back or once they've set off from the trees have they decided where they want to land and ignore the decoys. Also with the amount of cover near the hide I don't think they'll see the decoys from the trees.

 

Other option is to set the hide up further down the hedge where I've seen the birds feeding but my only concern there is whether I could make as good a job of the hide as with the other spot.

 

With either set up I'd thought of putting a few full bodied decoys in the hedge, any thoughts on whether it'd be worth doing?

 

Anyway we'll see how it goes, if it doesn't go to plan at least I might not have to clean the gun

My advice would be to go to the spot that you think would bring most success ( and where the pigeons want to be) - the hide is not as important.

[Albion]

I've spent a lot of time in the woods near me, and the pigeon movements there are variable to say the least. Some evenings there will be dozens come in to roost, while other evenings there are only one or two birds. It depends on where they've been feeding in the day, wind direction, other people nearby (cherry bangers, shooters and dog walkers etc), and which foods are avaible in the woods (ivy, berries, and at the moment cherry blossom). So although you can observe and predict flight lines, you cannot depend on them and they will change seasonally if not daily.

[Super major]

First chance I've got to get on here and report on how Saturday afternoon went.

Got onto the field at 4:30 and there were no pigeons but I got set up in the hope that they were sat up and would come for a feed a little later. The wind was blowing different from when I had done my reconnaisance, a very slight wind blowing from the bottom of the field rather than it blowing from the top. Put the hide in front of the hedge and was quite happy with how it looked then set 9 decoys in an L shape. After 10 minutes or so had three come in and of course I missed, and the pair after that. Then I hit the next bird that came. After that there was a lull for about 15 minutes, when I checked the wind it was blowing stronger and had turned from roughly westerly to Southerly. Gave it 5 minutes and after seeing no pigeons altered the patern into a horseshoe as the wind was blowing from behind the hide now. Saw no more birds anywhere until I packed up at 7:00.

So there'd been a couple come in, nothing amazing in terms of numbers but the few that came didn't seem to see me and landed in the decoys so there's perhaps a very small positive to take from it.

However, I think the reconnaisance and the shooting need to improve

[Towngun]

Yep the trouble is that shooting books assume you dont work for a living and also have free access to may miles of farm land. The problem thus is twofold:

 

1.Pigeons don’t have flight lines to correspond with your permission

2.The modern shooter has so many heavy pieces of kit that mobility is a huge task

 

Of course the reason may have so much kit is they want to compensate for not having the idael permission and therefore try every elctonic device to get the pigeons to come to them!

 

Perhaps the solution is to be content with small bags. If you shoot pheasants then ten birds would equate to a 100 bird day costing several hundred pounds therefore be content to the day out and maybe 1o--20 birds irrespective of the flight line. Pigeons offer supreme sport the equal of a grouse moore or a pheasants drive.

[Super major]

Yep the trouble is that shooting books assume you dont work for a living and also have free access to may miles of farm land. The problem thus is twofold:

 

1.Pigeons don’t have flight lines to correspond with your permission

2.The modern shooter has so many heavy pieces of kit that mobility is a huge task

 

Of course the reason may have so much kit is they want to compensate for not having the idael permission and therefore try every elctonic device to get the pigeons to come to them!

 

Perhaps the solution is to be content with small bags. If you shoot pheasants then ten birds would equate to a 100 bird day costing several hundred pounds therefore be content to the day out and maybe 1o--20 birds irrespective of the flight line. Pigeons offer supreme sport the equal of a grouse moore or a pheasants drive.

 

I don't think my kit's too heavy. I managed to carry all my gear in one trip from my van to the other side of the field and for now I'm trying to learn the sport with basic kit before I start looking at rotaries and flappers.

 

I've got two permissions and am lucky that they're both quite laid back, although I'd like to get better as much to feel like I'm giving them something in return as for my enjoyment.

[Super major]

When you go to shoot on the land have a good drive round all the potential fields first, spending some time watching each one.

If you see birds feeding scare them off, preferrable by walking them off, but if necessary fire a scare shot.

See how long it takes them to come back (if they do), if they are back reasonable quickly, or there is bird traffic, then go and set up.

Watch which way the birds enter and leave the field and if there are areas on the field they consistently go to.

 

If after 30 minutes or so no birds show an interest in the field, go and look at another one.

 

I don't set up unless I have seen birds feeding on a field.

 

Sometimes you just have to accept that the birds are not playing the game and committing to a field, this happens when they are spoiled for choice and differing weather conditions can have a large influence.

You have the choice of going home, or setting up in "lite" mode and being prepared to move a few times in the day and "chase" the birds.

"Lite" mode is just a few decoys, no electronics , cartridges in pocket, no camp building, etc., it can provide surprisingly good shooting opportunities and you can learn a lot by visiting a few fields in a day.

 

Hello again,

 

Just thought I'd add a couple of questions that have come to mind while re-reading this topic:-

 

If the birds are keen to get back on the field after being scared off would they usually be at least 20minutes until they return as I've read before that this is the usual time for nature to return to normal after a disturbance? Or is this more with rabbits, deer etc

 

When you say to move to another field if you don't see any birds for 30minutes do you allow for birds sitting up or would you expect a steady stream at most times if the field's being heavily fed on? While shooting it's often said if it isn't working after 20/30minutes change it, but assuming you've looked at the field properly and the birds aren't jinking or visibly flying elsewhere (in other words it's just quite)would you sit it out thinking it may be a lull?

 

Do pigeon seem to see a static car as a threat? I'm not planning on parking right where they want to feed but is 200yds reasonable (feels like a stupid question I'll be reminded of at a later date )

 

Or shall I just bloody get out there with my binoculars and see for myself rather than nagging you lot?

 

Thanks again,

 

Rob

[WelshLamb]

However, the longer I spend on this lark, the more I'm beginning to notice. As far as I can see, flight lines do exist but they're not always in use. But when they are in use, they're pretty rigid. For example, I placed myself recently where I thought I'd be right under a flight line. But after half an hour, it became obvious that the line was about 25 yards further down the hedgerow. I moved my hide and that 25 yards made all the difference.

My permission is just about within walking distance, and I can detour through it in the car on the way to and from work some times. But still, my time on it on any day is limited to ten minutes or so.

I suspect you'll find, like me, that gradually it all starts to fall into place. Spend as much time on your permission as possible. I've still got a long, long way to go - but at least I'm beginning to notice patterns, signs and portents!

 

Echo this! After a week or so of shooting the same permission practically every day, Im now fairly confident as to where to find the flight paths. It can only get easier!

[Cranfield]

Hello again,

 

Just thought I'd add a couple of questions that have come to mind while re-reading this topic:-

 

If the birds are keen to get back on the field after being scared off would they usually be at least 20minutes until they return as I've read before that this is the usual time for nature to return to normal after a disturbance? Or is this more with rabbits, deer etc

 

When you say to move to another field if you don't see any birds for 30minutes do you allow for birds sitting up or would you expect a steady stream at most times if the field's being heavily fed on? While shooting it's often said if it isn't working after 20/30minutes change it, but assuming you've looked at the field properly and the birds aren't jinking or visibly flying elsewhere (in other words it's just quite)would you sit it out thinking it may be a lull?

 

Do pigeon seem to see a static car as a threat? I'm not planning on parking right where they want to feed but is 200yds reasonable (feels like a stupid question I'll be reminded of at a later date )

 

Or shall I just bloody get out there with my binoculars and see for myself rather than nagging you lot?

 

Thanks again,

 

Rob

 

For me, if I have scared the birds off a field and within 30 minutes there are birds back in the area, either doing a fly past, sitting in nearby trees, etc., I will set up my decoys.

 

Distance in parking from the hide depends very much on the locality.

If there are lots of hedges, woodland, buildings, etc., to hide your vehicle thats great, but if you have to park it in the open, then the further away the better (200 yards is not far enough).

Birds regularly using the field see a picture and anything very different will spook them, until they get use to it.

[Super major]

Thanks

[motty]

For me, if I have scared the birds off a field and within 30 minutes there are birds back in the area, either doing a fly past, sitting in nearby trees, etc., I will set up my decoys.

 

Distance in parking from the hide depends very much on the locality.

If there are lots of hedges, woodland, buildings, etc., to hide your vehicle thats great, but if you have to park it in the open, then the further away the better (200 yards is not far enough).

Birds regularly using the field see a picture and anything very different will spook them, until they get use to it.

While i would try to park my vehicle away from where i'm shooting, i don't really think that pigeons fear a static car. On saturday i had to park my truck about 20 yards from my hide and i still had birds in the decoys.