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SPRINGADOR'S


Fudge40
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He has two other labs of varying ages which are Ok he didnt work/ train it on soft ground, he is quite capable at training, I would suggest your wrong and even dogs with good hip scores can throw a bad one.

 

I'll agree with you on that one but I read a article that explained that alot of hip dysplasia is caused on how we feed and exercise our dogs in the early stages. If I can hink where I read I'll put up a link :good:

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Buying a pure bred lab can cost you a fortune as well, what with dodgy hips and/or elbows, PRA, and breeding can`t rule them out, my mate bought a Lab both parents KC reg,

at 15month its hips were knackered, a few hundred quid for the dog , and a few hundred more for the vet, my last springer cross never ailed a thing for 15yrs cost me £20 to buy.

The boy on the right is Springer cross Cocker, he`s the replacement and coming on well.

Well this is a primary reason TRUE NEW BLOOD, this is a big problem in the UK kennel club, in other countries once the breed is breeding true to type again there is no issue in registering the later generations. A lot of issues have been created in a lot of breeds for the lack of any outcrossing. How do people feel our gundogs were created in the first place - the Lab has only been registered 100 yrs so before that time was it a useless mongrel or a worthwhile dog - I think the latter as it quickly replaced the breeds already in existence on the game shoots of the day but is the most commonly bred dog most years. In recent times there was too much close mating of many breeds and it really messed with some health wise a lot more than new blood might have.

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Dog breeding in the uk is a disaster.

Too many people know best (crossing hpr's/tracking hounds to lab's etc) too many people trying to make money out off it and too many people breeding bitches that they think are brilliant 'working' dogs when have only chased a rabbit once and to make matters worse are using top stud dogs to make the pup's more saleable and expensive, but are really only narrowing the gene pool even more.

 

As was hinted at earlier with the recent rise in trialling over the past 20 odd years dogs are now breed specifically to win trials with little or no thought to how it works in the shooting field, for me the 3 main dog breeds now have 3 distinct lines/strains Show Working and Trialling and all look totally different from each other. In my opinion labs look like whippet crosses and no longer have a double coat, springers are the size of proper cockers and almost all white as 'looks flashier' and cockers are just so small now.

Atleast the show breeders pay some attention to breed standards, if show breeders had changed the look size and shape off our most popular working dogs we'd be up in arms over it yet the triallers have done just that.

In the old days triallers were shooting men that also were good with gundogs, and it was the nearest way that toff's could compete, bet and have bragging rights over there mates who had the best 'working' gundogs. Changed days.

 

I almost feel we should be going down the way the germans breed dogs, with a breed master and all breeding dogs must first pass a test and only bred to suitable health tested dogs after the breed master has looked at both the dogs working styles and thinks they will compliment each other and there pedigree's re suitable.

Would never work here thou.

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Dog breeding in the uk is a disaster.

Too many people know best (crossing hpr's/tracking hounds to lab's etc) too many people trying to make money out off it and too many people breeding bitches that they think are brilliant 'working' dogs when have only chased a rabbit once and to make matters worse are using top stud dogs to make the pup's more saleable and expensive, but are really only narrowing the gene pool even more.

 

As was hinted at earlier with the recent rise in trialling over the past 20 odd years dogs are now breed specifically to win trials with little or no thought to how it works in the shooting field, for me the 3 main dog breeds now have 3 distinct lines/strains Show Working and Trialling and all look totally different from each other. In my opinion labs look like whippet crosses and no longer have a double coat, springers are the size of proper cockers and almost all white as 'looks flashier' and cockers are just so small now.

Atleast the show breeders pay some attention to breed standards, if show breeders had changed the look size and shape off our most popular working dogs we'd be up in arms over it yet the triallers have done just that.

In the old days triallers were shooting men that also were good with gundogs, and it was the nearest way that toff's could compete, bet and have bragging rights over there mates who had the best 'working' gundogs. Changed days.

 

I almost feel we should be going down the way the germans breed dogs, with a breed master and all breeding dogs must first pass a test and only bred to suitable health tested dogs after the breed master has looked at both the dogs working styles and thinks they will compliment each other and there pedigree's re suitable.

Would never work here thou.

Well said, not so sure about the show fraternity not having changed the look- they have by exaggerating breed stds. steady away progressively to win marks in shows

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Dog breeding in the uk is a disaster.

Too many people know best (crossing hpr's/tracking hounds to lab's etc) too many people trying to make money out off it and too many people breeding bitches that they think are brilliant 'working' dogs when have only chased a rabbit once and to make matters worse are using top stud dogs to make the pup's more saleable and expensive, but are really only narrowing the gene pool even more.

 

As was hinted at earlier with the recent rise in trialling over the past 20 odd years dogs are now breed specifically to win trials with little or no thought to how it works in the shooting field, for me the 3 main dog breeds now have 3 distinct lines/strains Show Working and Trialling and all look totally different from each other. In my opinion labs look like whippet crosses and no longer have a double coat, springers are the size of proper cockers and almost all white as 'looks flashier' and cockers are just so small now.

Atleast the show breeders pay some attention to breed standards, if show breeders had changed the look size and shape off our most popular working dogs we'd be up in arms over it yet the triallers have done just that.

In the old days triallers were shooting men that also were good with gundogs, and it was the nearest way that toff's could compete, bet and have bragging rights over there mates who had the best 'working' gundogs. Changed days.

 

I almost feel we should be going down the way the germans breed dogs, with a breed master and all breeding dogs must first pass a test and only bred to suitable health tested dogs after the breed master has looked at both the dogs working styles and thinks they will compliment each other and there pedigree's re suitable.

Would never work here thou.

A lot of what you say is very good and if only we had the way Germans breed their dogs in place it would do the gun-dog working lines a lot of good,but we don't, So I am sorry to say its no good saying, what if, or maybe if, or we should

we have a system in place and people have to work within the system we have.

Dogs and bitches should always of been health tested before being bred from.

Ask to see the stud dog work before using it, don't just look at his pedigree.

Yes to much is put on how much red is in the pedigree, when people should be asking for a demo of the bitch working before buying a pup.

 

losing the thread of the OP, the question was should he have a cross bred dog, answer in MO no!

wont get any health screening with a mongrel and can never be sure of what you end up with.

Edited by Actionpigeons
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  • 1 year later...

hi, I love labs and spaniels both excellent gundogs although with the lab chocolates don't often make the grade black ones are best, however I now work a springador can't fault her best gundog I've ever had, her father was a black working lab and mother was a working springador both were excellent having seen them in action a few times.

Mine has no white at all just look like a slightly small black lab short black shinny coat with springer face and longer ears, I do a lot of pigeon shooting over decoys and right from the start she was spot on, pigeons don't have much scent so I think the better nose of the spaniel side pays off + she will work all day relentlessly when I send her out will collect all the freshly shot birds really quickly, ive been a keen pigeon shooter for over 35 years always had labs or springer's but can honestly say my springador is better could just be her parentage though. apparently they also make good pets if that's what you want for your wife but they are best as working dogs because they need lots of stimulating and exercise if not they get bored quickly ..

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