Guest jonrms Posted November 3, 2006 Report Share Posted November 3, 2006 Since my .22lr is going to go off my cert... I will be able to apply for a variation free... I was thinking of the .223 for a foxing gun. Since my FLO wont put fox on any of my other guns.... and will only consider a min of a 22-250 I figured that a .223 is a good start... After much research into this... (thanks to the search button) I found that some will put fox hares etc... and looking on some of the comments.. its risky just to put down fox... ie for the reason for needing this calibre. What do you reccomend... I belive in scotlland there is a ruling that you are allowed to shoot certin types of deer with a .223.. is this true? what else should I put along side of my reason for a 223... should I just say fox... I already have a 22lr a FAC SG a spot for 17hmr <vermin only! so what do you reccomend? I am stuck for more of a reason.. thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kip270 Posted November 3, 2006 Report Share Posted November 3, 2006 Yes the .223 can be used for Roe deer in Scotland as long as you use a min of a 50grain bullet. I would put down for Fox & vermin for the .223 plus if you have access to stalking in scotland put down deer as well. Also when DEFRA get there act together you should also be able to use it in England and Wales for the smaller deer species It is not up to your FLO to dictate what calibre you can have for Fox control , read up on the Firearms guidance and have the law in front of you and do not back down. .22lr can be used for Fox control, so why doe's he say 22-250?? as the min. Yes i know the .22lr is to be used within 70-80 yards on fox.(don't want to derail this post chaps) Good luck Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frank Posted November 3, 2006 Report Share Posted November 3, 2006 .223 is perfectly cabable of taking roe and deadly on fox. Have you decided what make yet? Frank. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kdubya Posted November 3, 2006 Report Share Posted November 3, 2006 flo CAN dictate this is reason and ability to do so, not going to argue re different forces interpretations, but never the less these are his guidelines to work from? cheers KW Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
il cacciatore Posted November 3, 2006 Report Share Posted November 3, 2006 .223 is an excellent round. With a non varmint barrel its a dream to shoot. Deadly accurate and not too expensive to run. Its effective upto 300 yrds. Its just a pity that your not allowed it for Roe Deer in England. Put down vermin and roe deer control (if your planning on using it in Scotland) as reason. This allows you to use it on fox and other vermin. For a gun I would say Remington 700?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markbivvy Posted November 3, 2006 Report Share Posted November 3, 2006 http://www.airgunbbs.com/forums/showthread.php?t=150325 hi Jon. looks like you need some more chockies mate. iam sure with your luck if you put fox, moles, field mice down you will get it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonno 357 Posted November 3, 2006 Report Share Posted November 3, 2006 Since my .22lr is going to go off my cert... I will be able to apply for a variation free... I was thinking of the .223 for a foxing gun. Since my FLO wont put fox on any of my other guns.... and will only consider a min of a 22-250 I figured that a .223 is a good start... After much research into this... (thanks to the search button) I found that some will put fox hares etc... and looking on some of the comments.. its risky just to put down fox... ie for the reason for needing this calibre. What do you reccomend... I belive in scotlland there is a ruling that you are allowed to shoot certin types of deer with a .223.. is this true? what else should I put along side of my reason for a 223... should I just say fox... I already have a 22lr a FAC SG a spot for 17hmr <vermin only! so what do you reccomend? I am stuck for more of a reason.. thanks. ? Free variation ? Only like for like Going fro a rimfire to 223. New one of me ? If that the case West Yorks Police owe me about £260 Jonno Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CharlieT Posted November 3, 2006 Report Share Posted November 3, 2006 jonno I would put my claim in now then chap It's one for one, not like for like and this exact subject is covered in the guidelines. jon Your feo is talking rubbish. 223 is probably the most used foxing gun and is smaller than 22.250 so how can he say 22.250 minimum caliber. For your reason to acquire fox is all that is necessary. Obviously you would want it authorised for use on vermin, ground game and fox and if you so wish deer in Scotland. Kdubya Kip270 is quite correct. You can chose to have what you want up to .243 given the right need, as stated in the guidelines. ct Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markbivvy Posted November 3, 2006 Report Share Posted November 3, 2006 feo,s getting it wrong , never. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kip270 Posted November 3, 2006 Report Share Posted November 3, 2006 “One for one†variations 10.51 A variation is always necessary if a certificate holder wishes to change one of the firearms, even if they wish to purchase one identical to the one they are selling (Wilson v Coombe, Queen’s Bench Divisional Court, July 1988). “One for one†variation refers to firearms that are authorised to be acquired at the same time as one is being disposed of. For practical purposes this is normally taken to be within seven days. The use of authorities which can be kept open indefinitely should be discouraged. Applications for “one for one†variations should be made by the certificate holder submitting their firearm certificate together with a completed form 101 to the police firearms licensing department. Such variations are processed free of charge. ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Fox 13.23 Common rifle cartridges considered suitable for the shooting of foxes range from .17 Remington, and .22 Hornet to .22 -250 and .220 Swift, though there is a wide range of suitable similar calibres commercially available. In windy areas, where heavier bullets aid accurate shooting, or if applicants wish to use one rifle for shooting both deer and foxes they may choose a rifle in 6mm (.243/.244) or 6.5mm (.264) calibre. .22 Rimfire is generally too low-powered to be used against fox except at short range, but may reasonably be permitted for use against such quarry in certain circumstances. However, sole use against fox would not normally be sufficient “good reason†to acquire such a rifle (see paragraph 13.15). Combination shot gun/rifles should have the rifled barrel in a similar calibre. Expanding ammunition should be authorised for shooting foxes. Those involved in shooting foxes will normally be authorised to possess up to 250 rounds and acquire 200 at any given time, but consideration should though be given to each shooter’s individual circumstances, particularly where re-loaders are acquiring missiles. See also paragraph 13.14 on allowing applicant’s flexibility to reasonably shoot other species on named land. There you go all in black & white, and this is what ALL FLO must work to. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest jonrms Posted November 4, 2006 Report Share Posted November 4, 2006 Thanks guys, As I said.. I had done my homework before asking... I came upon all those problems.... and answers... but wasnt sure if I should just put fox... or list it as fox, vermin, game, deer I think I will go with the second one.... ie put the list... Thanks again..... many thanks to everyone! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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