BRAD1927 Posted June 7, 2013 Report Share Posted June 7, 2013 I again personally dont use my HMR specific for fox only if the shot presents as this is my bunny gun along with my .22lr. out of the 5 I have shot 2 were to the back of the head (spotted them before they spotted me) the other 3 were face on and straight into the bib of their chests. Although I have my FAC conditioned for fox it is not my prefered choice of gun and agree .223cf or .243cf is really the tool to use. Please dont take my comments as being rude or flippent but I know my limits when shooting and like to ensure clean kills, unfortunatley there are some individuals who will take unnecessary risks just so thay can say they did get a long range kill or more to the point there fieldcraft and calling abilities are not up to scratch. To the OP in all fairness it does happen and I dont profess to be a dead eye **** myself so keep up the good work but maybe leave the shot a little longer so as to be as close to 100% sure of a clean kill as possible. Good luck with the .243 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fabarm gamma boy Posted June 7, 2013 Report Share Posted June 7, 2013 i think some folk on this site need to get of there high horses at times tbh! biased bull**** is aired on here abit to often! these things happen give the guy a break! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fabarm gamma boy Posted June 7, 2013 Report Share Posted June 7, 2013 just use what your comfortable with at a comfortable range and thatl do you! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
al4x Posted June 7, 2013 Report Share Posted June 7, 2013 Its always going to cause controversy shooting them with a HMR I've shot a fair few and what I will say is chest shots even if they run they are dead much as the same as the way deer can run after a shot. I've only had one we didn't account for and that went down on the shot started trying to get up and the shooter had an empty mag so I let the dog out. With that the fox found a new lease of life and she rolled over with it twice and couldn't quite hold it before I had to call her off as it was by a road. She was plastered in blood so you know it wasn't going to last and I would imagine died in the brambles alongside the road. Very surprising but then I have had them make 50 yards when shot with the .243 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jayDT10 Posted June 7, 2013 Report Share Posted June 7, 2013 Make me laugh when people say I only use the hmr for a dead cert kill, it's only a dead cert when it's dead on the deck, anything is possible with live quarry with any rifle, if it was such an issue it would be illegal to use a rimfire for fox, I've seen foxes run with all calibres , 8 inches low of the chest and a legs off. It happens with all shooting, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fabarm gamma boy Posted June 7, 2013 Report Share Posted June 7, 2013 exactly! :good: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
browning123 Posted June 7, 2013 Report Share Posted June 7, 2013 (edited) It happens - don't fret about it! Put it down to experience! Edited June 7, 2013 by browning123 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
imissalot Posted June 7, 2013 Report Share Posted June 7, 2013 Is fox on his hmr ticket if so no harm done ,if not ?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frenchieboy Posted June 8, 2013 Report Share Posted June 8, 2013 Is fox on his hmr ticket if so no harm done ,if not ? ? I would guess so or it would have been pure folly to have put it on an open forum otherwise. Further than that I am not going to comment on the matter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alanl50 Posted June 8, 2013 Report Share Posted June 8, 2013 I would guess so or it would have been pure folly to have put it on an open forum otherwise. Further than that I am not going to comment on the matter. .17HMR is legal on fox in Suffolk. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rimfireboy Posted June 8, 2013 Report Share Posted June 8, 2013 brown bread... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dob Posted June 8, 2013 Report Share Posted June 8, 2013 You could shoot a fox with a .243 or even a .308 and they can still run its not always about power but accuracy , obviously u should not be shooting at anything that's out of killable range for your rifle but lets be honest haven't we all pulled shots from time to time ,we ain't all snipers. It's a difficult call going onto land that u don't have permission for but although you want find foxy it can't be worth ******* your permissions neighbour off . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jay222 Posted June 8, 2013 Report Share Posted June 8, 2013 It happens - don't fret about it! Put it down to experience! Couldn't agree more Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dee Posted June 8, 2013 Report Share Posted June 8, 2013 Nice shooting mate,a good fox is a dead one,shame you lost the first one but hey **** happens. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kes Posted June 9, 2013 Report Share Posted June 9, 2013 I find the tone of those who advocate the use of HMR for fox at longer ranges (100yds) etc, shortsighted and simply naive. People reading this will think there is no conscience amongst those who shoot foxes or other wild animals and that is not, and cannot be correct, for the future of the sport. .17HMR for fox is, IMHO too little gun at anything exceeding 70yds. There are higher energy calibres - .17 hornet etc which will humanely kill at longer ranges. This is not about what you can kill at what range but what you should be killing at sensible ranges. A lot of consideration has been put into the energy requirements for clean kills on all animals and centrefire for fox is axiomatic in my view. Why esle do we use expanding ammunition but to kill cleanly and instantly? A .223 or .222 or 22-250 will all drop foxes like a sack of potatoes at ranges up to that which the shooter can ensure a clean kill. Yes you can use .22 and .17HMR as vermin applies to foxes but would you want to - not me I'm afraid - I like them to die instantly and preferably not even knowing I am there. Better not to shoot than to wound for me I'm afraid. Larger calibres give you reserves of killing energy to allow for slight movement etc, HMR and .22 do not. You can shoot a red with .22.250 in NZ but would you ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
channa Posted June 9, 2013 Report Share Posted June 9, 2013 All guns kill it's what there designed for. It's down to us the the evolved bigger brained of the two species to know whats the best most humane way to dispatch our quarry,the police recommend no less than a .22 centrefire for just this reason. I do believe there was no intent to wound the fox OP shot at,but the 243 will be better suited to carry out the task in hand. Cruelty is only one mans desire not an instinct. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jayDT10 Posted June 9, 2013 Report Share Posted June 9, 2013 (edited) I find the tone of those who advocate the use of HMR for fox at longer ranges (100yds) etc, shortsighted and simply naive.People reading this will think there is no conscience amongst those who shoot foxes or other wild animals and that is not, and cannot be correct, for the future of the sport. .17HMR for fox is, IMHO too little gun at anything exceeding 70yds. There are higher energy calibres - .17 hornet etc which will humanely kill at longer ranges. This is not about what you can kill at what range but what you should be killing at sensible ranges.A lot of consideration has been put into the energy requirements for clean kills on all animals and centrefire for fox is axiomatic in my view. Why esle do we use expanding ammunition but to kill cleanly and instantly?A .223 or .222 or 22-250 will all drop foxes like a sack of potatoes at ranges up to that which the shooter can ensure a clean kill. Yes you can use .22 and .17HMR as vermin applies to foxes but would you want to - not me I'm afraid - I like them to die instantly and preferably not even knowing I am there. Better not to shoot than to wound for me I'm afraid. Larger calibres give you reserves of killing energy to allow for slight movement etc, HMR and .22 do not.You can shoot a red with .22.250 in NZ but would you ? your right in what your saying I just think that someone with a 17 or .22 who knows the capabilities of the round and gun is just as good as someone with cf taking 200-300 yard shots, I've seen more foxes lost over big distances with cf than I have with a rf or shotgun over short distances. Edited June 9, 2013 by jayDT10 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kes Posted June 9, 2013 Report Share Posted June 9, 2013 your right in what your saying I just think that someone with a 17 or .22 who knows the capabilities of the round and gun is just as good as someone with cf taking 200-300 yard shots, I've seen more foxes lost over big distances with cf than I have with a rf or shotgun over short distances. I dont disagree Jay but its got to be damned close and how many foxes just stop when you are calling them within longer range than you anticipated ? Its just too tempting for some not to try and extend their sensible longest range. With a CF many shooters simply limit themselves to ranges at which they can kill in 100 % of cases - CF's give you so much more flexibility whilst guaranteeing a kill. I wouldnt take shots at 200-300 yds unless i had suitable kit and knew how to dial in the scope. That said, I have the kit and have shot a few at up to 225. They didnt even know we were there either. Problems do occur and we have all had and regretted those but in hunting/shooting, you dont leave injured quarry for any reason. Remove the bolt and bullets place your rifle safely on your land and go look and give up only when you find it, If you dont find it - change the way you do it. This is just humane and simple respect for the quarry - I think most of us do this anyway. As I said before, learn from your mistakes and keep them to yourself or within your circle of shooting friends, dont be explicit on a public forum. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jayDT10 Posted June 9, 2013 Report Share Posted June 9, 2013 (edited) I dont disagree Jay but its got to be damned close and how many foxes just stop when you are calling them within longer range than you anticipated ? Its just too tempting for some not to try and extend their sensible longest range. With a CF many shooters simply limit themselves to ranges at which they can kill in 100 % of cases - CF's give you so much more flexibility whilst guaranteeing a kill. I wouldnt take shots at 200-300 yds unless i had suitable kit and knew how to dial in the scope. That said, I have the kit and have shot a few at up to 225. They didnt even know we were there either. Problems do occur and we have all had and regretted those but in hunting/shooting, you dont leave injured quarry for any reason. Remove the bolt and bullets place your rifle safely on your land and go look and give up only when you find it, If you dont find it - change the way you do it. This is just humane and simple respect for the quarry - I think most of us do this anyway. As I said before, learn from your mistakes and keep them to yourself or within your circle of shooting friends, dont be explicit on a public forum. I still don't agree about a cf guaranteeing a kill, but it's far more likely to kill yes , it just pains me to see other people ponce on someone who has done what we've all done , ( hit something and not killed it) . This is just a downside to the pursuit of live quarry . Edited June 9, 2013 by jayDT10 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
browning123 Posted June 9, 2013 Report Share Posted June 9, 2013 I still don't agree about a cf guaranteeing a kill, but it's far more likely to kill yes , it just pains me to see other people ponce on someone who has done what we've all done , ( hit something and not killed it) . This is just a downside to the pursuit of live quarry . Well said! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kes Posted June 9, 2013 Report Share Posted June 9, 2013 Well said! Sorry the point here is being missed - we all do this but we should keep the chances of this happening to a minimum - use enough gun and dont take quarry at excessive ranges. As for finding shot quarry, I'll leave that one up to you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FOXHUNTER1 Posted June 9, 2013 Report Share Posted June 9, 2013 I think you still owe it your quarry to follow it up if wounded and dispatch it , it goes without saying. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
simon6ppc Posted June 9, 2013 Report Share Posted June 9, 2013 i think we all make mistakes and when you do just dont put them on a open forum,as to do that you have to be braver than the fox. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
walt1980 Posted June 9, 2013 Author Report Share Posted June 9, 2013 (edited) Think I should of just put "shot my first fox!" And left it at that, thought people on here said about hi and lows. The fox I couldn't find was within range, 60 yards approx, I thought shot was good, he moved just as I squeezed trigger, maybe a bit of inexperience, lesson learnt! As for follow up to check, not allowed on the land, farmer was pleased I didn't as they don't see eye to eye! I wouldn't of considered the shot if I was confident it would be a kill, the fox pictured was slightly further away, only a little bit, and dropped where it was hit, quick and clean, as I expected the first to be. But lesson learned, don't share everything!! Edited June 9, 2013 by walt1980 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vince Green Posted June 9, 2013 Report Share Posted June 9, 2013 (edited) When I was a lad all foxes were shot with .22s but you wouldn't shoot it side on you would only shoot it chest on. Too many biggish bones in the way side on. Head shots are not that easy either. They hold their heads really low. Popular wisdom back then was that a .22 could be deflected by the low sloping forehead if you only hit it with a glancing shot. Everybody believed it, never put it to the test personally. Edited June 9, 2013 by Vince Green Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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