rjimmer Posted November 27, 2003 Report Share Posted November 27, 2003 In the BASC magazine, that came through the door a few days ago, it was mentioned that vermin and pest species may only be shot under the general license if certain conditions are met, including crop protection. Does this mean that setting up decoys on clover is not allowed? If so then 'Well done Basc', another let down!!! Not got the mag with me at the moment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Columbus Polumbus Posted November 27, 2003 Report Share Posted November 27, 2003 Rjimmer The general licence is issued by the Government and not BASC and usually, interested bodies are invited to discuss which means at the very best interested bodies only have an opportunity to influence and not directly change wording of various governmental documentation. So if the goverment doesn't want to listen.............. well just look at the Fox hunting Bill!! Under the general licence shooting or decoying over clover is acceptable as pigeon are classified as a pests and like most things they do not have to be carrying out the damage at the time you shoot them so your ok as long as all the other criteria is met. If you have such a downer on BASC and feel they are letting you down, why not join another organisation? Col Pol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rjimmer Posted November 30, 2003 Author Report Share Posted November 30, 2003 Under the general licence shooting or decoying over clover is acceptable as pigeon are classified as a pests and like most things they do not have to be carrying out the damage at the time you shoot them so your ok as long as all the other criteria is met. If you have such a downer on BASC and feel they are letting you down, why not join another organisation? People have been prosecuted apparently. Can you, for example, shoot pigeons on a property and claim to be protecting crops of somebody else where you don't shoot? The article sounded quite serious. I think it was on the same page as another promoting hevi-shot as an alternative to lead, at £3.00 a cartridge. I am a member of BASC only through club affiliation. It's part of the club's constitution. I joined as an individual in about 1963, I think, but not any more. Once the ban on night shooting of duck comes in, I shall probably give it up anyway. We already give BASC over a fiver for every duck we shoot and still the begging letters keep coming through the door. Have a read of what Eric Begbie has to say here http://pub59.ezboard.com/fduckandgoosehunt...picID=143.topic Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teal Posted November 30, 2003 Report Share Posted November 30, 2003 The case you refer to I believe was when a bloke baited starlings in his garden in the suburbs and then shot them with an airifle. Its quite a bit different to the situation with woodies in the countryside. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rjimmer Posted November 30, 2003 Author Report Share Posted November 30, 2003 The case you refer to I believe was when a bloke baited starlings in his garden in the suburbs and then shot them with an airifle. Its quite a bit different to the situation with woodies in the countryside. No mention of suburban starlings in the article. It just said 'Shooters have been prosecuted'. Some put forward the idea of prebaiting for pigeons on here a few months back. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Columbus Polumbus Posted November 30, 2003 Report Share Posted November 30, 2003 Rjimmer The general licence is quiet clear in that if the woodpigeon pose problems, for example, crop damage then you can shoot them year round. In the cities, if you are plagued by woodies for example then again you would be covered, generally speaking that is if they were doing damage and being in a city, you would have to justify your actions if called to do so by the appropriate authorities. What is not acceptable is baiting so you are enticing them to land and then shooting them, with even the widest and loosest view, this cannot be classed as crop protection and therefore would (excuse the pun) fall fowl of the law. As long as you have the landowners permission or permission from the person who owns or leases the shooting rights (not necessarily one in the same person) then you are acting within the law. A landowner who does not have the shooting rights still has the right to control pests, usually, but you would need to check the wording carefully, better safe than sorry. Numerous people have been convicted for shooting "pest species" listed on the general licence because they believed, quite wrongly, if its on the list you can shoot on site irrespective of where they are. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
red_stag88 Posted November 30, 2003 Report Share Posted November 30, 2003 So basically i'm safe knocking off bunnies on the farm with a shotgun then? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MAJ Posted November 30, 2003 Report Share Posted November 30, 2003 I have had some very productive days on clover, and have always thought that because it is being grown as food for livestock, any pigeons landing on it are fair game. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Columbus Polumbus Posted November 30, 2003 Report Share Posted November 30, 2003 Red In 1956 (I think it was) the goverment decalred the UK a rabbit free zone and all were to be destroyed on site. Interesting to note the policies or politicians were as bigga liars then as they are now. So whacking bunnies is fair game as long as you have permission, if not YOU could be charged with armed tresspass in pursuit of game which is a criminal offence carrying a maximum of three years. And before you comment, NO I was not around in '56 lol lol Maj Yup if the clover is grown for animal feed then it is crop protection the rest is as above about permission. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
red_stag88 Posted November 30, 2003 Report Share Posted November 30, 2003 Thanks, I have permission. And no the though didnt even cross my mind.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ernyha Posted November 30, 2003 Report Share Posted November 30, 2003 I am a bit confused as to the difference between decoying and baiting. Surely both are methods of drawing the quarry to a place that they would not necessarily want to be. We all have had days where no matter what methods we use, we have not drawn birds to our gun and have returned home empty handed so presumably we could be accused of trying to shoot birds that were not doing any damage or intending to do so. Seems a very grey, wishy washy sort of law to me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Columbus Polumbus Posted December 1, 2003 Report Share Posted December 1, 2003 In principle Ern I note your point but alas there is a clear distinction, if you are decoying then it a realistic assumption the "pest" is there already and is following, to some degree its instincts in responding to your decoys, however if you bait an area specifically to attract a species into the area with the sole purpose of destroying it then no, that is unlawful. It is important to try and not read into these laws what we know as "the but for test" it is applicable in other area's of law but not in pest control. Simply put, there is a measure or level of acceptance of certain practices that are permitted and baiting is not one of them. Another example is live decoying (for woodpigeon) as the French participate in extensively, in this country it is not acceptable to do this, it is reasonable to suggest in a general way, the decoy birds are looked after very well, after all they have a job to do and cannot do it if your neglecting them, either way, this country has determined it is ilegal and therefore against the law. Just the way it goes I'm afraid. Some people recently have fallen foul of the law when using live decoys for say, larsen traps in that they have not taken care of their "call bird". What this means is, whilst the method of capture i.e. trapping is acceptable (again with certain legal requirements being met as to size etc) you still have a duty of care to take care of your call bird as it is captive and its only means of survival for its basic fundamnetal needs is totally in your control and your responsibility. If you fail to do this then you can be charged with animal cruelty etc. Ignorance of the law is no excuse and I think BASC and others are trying to make us all aware of the law and our responsibilities if we participate in these activities. Hope this helps Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leon Posted December 1, 2003 Report Share Posted December 1, 2003 Col Pol it was 1954 mate. And it was under section 1 of the rabbit clearance order no.148 issued in 1972 that all England and wales are rabbit clearance areas with the exception of the city of London, the Isles of scilly and Skokholm island. I need to get out more!!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Columbus Polumbus Posted December 1, 2003 Report Share Posted December 1, 2003 Well done Leon, I have such a bad memory with dates, I think I did alright being only two years out this time :yp: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quercus Posted December 1, 2003 Report Share Posted December 1, 2003 If anyone is interested the general licence can be seen here. Q :yp: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
red_stag88 Posted December 2, 2003 Report Share Posted December 2, 2003 If anyone is interested the general licence can be seen here. Q :yp: BL**DY DICTATOR OF A HEADMASTER. First Cabelas was blocked, now the hunting bit of Defra, I have a fealing I may not be able to access here soon, because we have killed pigeons. They must think i'm a wacko looking to buy guns to go kill people, by the amount of times i've been nicked trying to access Ramsbottom, gun traider, uttings, the list is endless, it really p*sses me off that my mates can look at buying football boots, but i cant look at buying an air rifle. Sorry Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Columbus Polumbus Posted December 2, 2003 Report Share Posted December 2, 2003 Try talkin to them Red and see where they're coming from and if you think it biased or still unfair get your folks to speak with the headmaster or perhaps BASC??? Good luck If all else fails get a computer for xmas :yp: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
red_stag88 Posted December 2, 2003 Report Share Posted December 2, 2003 I'll have a word, I'm on my laptop now, we have like a radio connection which uses the same ISP number but 800 people can go on the internet at the same time. I am brewing an email... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rjimmer Posted December 2, 2003 Author Report Share Posted December 2, 2003 So, does anybody know the circumstaces of the cases where 'Shooters have been prosecuted', as mentioned in the BASC mag? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cranfield Posted December 2, 2003 Report Share Posted December 2, 2003 The only case I have heard of , is the one William mentioned, of a chap shooting starlings with an air rifle, that he had attracted into his garden using bread. If there had been any, or many, others, I,m sure the shooting press would have published the details. The General Licence has been around for years and is a "non issue" for most shooters, especially pigeon shooters. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BIGJON Posted December 5, 2003 Report Share Posted December 5, 2003 The B.A.S.C. has a legal dept, as a member you can phone them up for advice. :yp: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teal Posted December 5, 2003 Report Share Posted December 5, 2003 BL**DY DICTATOR OF A HEADMASTER. First Cabelas was blocked, now the hunting bit of Defra, I have a fealing I may not be able to access here soon, because we have killed pigeons. They must think i'm a wacko looking to buy guns to go kill people, by the amount of times i've been nicked trying to access Ramsbottom, gun traider, uttings, the list is endless, it really p*sses me off that my mates can look at buying football boots, but i cant look at buying an air rifle. Sorry The only reason this one isn't blocked is probably because he thinks you are a bit of an ornithologist (pigeonWATCH) :yp: try this link: http://www.defra.gov.uk/corporate/regulat/...s_man/WLF18.htm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.