staglioni Posted January 24, 2014 Report Share Posted January 24, 2014 your spot on there duck. Bang rite! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
staglioni Posted January 24, 2014 Report Share Posted January 24, 2014 If i know i will get a clean kill i shoot anything if i aren't sure i leave it!common sense and moral's prevail. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluesj Posted January 24, 2014 Report Share Posted January 24, 2014 It may not be "sporting" but if its heading for the table so what, when was the last time your pork chop had a sporting chance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alfred Posted January 24, 2014 Report Share Posted January 24, 2014 Easier to shoot a duck on a pond with a head shot from an air rifle than it is to shoot them on the wing with a 12g shotgun. I haven't shot a duck with an air rifle for 20yrs, but I don't remember it being particularly difficult. I don't really do 'sporting' for the sake of it, I shoot stuff to eat, if I want 'sporting' I go clay shooting. If I'm on a driven shoot and the birds are silly high or too far in front I don't even raise my gun, I'd rather not bother than wing one and have it run away injured, there are enough runners as it is without taking shots unlikely to drop them instantly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Livefast123 Posted January 24, 2014 Report Share Posted January 24, 2014 Head shot on a duck...head shot on a rabbit. Last time I checked dead was dead and looks rather rather tasty. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
srspower Posted January 25, 2014 Report Share Posted January 25, 2014 (edited) I don't think there is any problem legally, as has been said, a well placed shot at a reasonable range to the head from an airgun would probably be more humane than a shotgun shooting it in flight. And I know of a few people who have done this, with pheasants too. It isn't really the 'done' thing though. I guess its because geese, ducks and pheasants are generally considered more game than vermin and so is something to be savored like a fine wine as in you give it a sporting chance etc. Edited January 25, 2014 by srspower Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
timmytree Posted January 25, 2014 Report Share Posted January 25, 2014 "Sporting" is where the difference lies! Vermin shooters tend to be one shot people who go for as close to 100% clean kills record as possible and leave shots they are unsure of. "Sporting" shooters enjoy taking more difficult high and fast birds with all the risk of pricked birds, runners etc. Which group causes more suffering? Which group has the higher percentage of clean kills? No prizes for the right answer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
secretagentmole Posted January 25, 2014 Report Share Posted January 25, 2014 Pheasants taste better with only one man made hole, in a part of the bird you do not eat! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
srspower Posted January 25, 2014 Report Share Posted January 25, 2014 "Sporting" is where the difference lies! Vermin shooters tend to be one shot people who go for as close to 100% clean kills record as possible and leave shots they are unsure of. "Sporting" shooters enjoy taking more difficult high and fast birds with all the risk of pricked birds, runners etc. Which group causes more suffering? Which group has the higher percentage of clean kills? No prizes for the right answer. I agree wholeheartedly, I was just pointing out the general perception. It's like when people criticize some of my pigeon shooting videos for shooting the odd pigeon just as it has landed. I have a job to do and it's a clean kill. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Underdog Posted January 25, 2014 Author Report Share Posted January 25, 2014 Pheasants taste better with only one man made hole, in a part of the bird you do not eat! Lol brilliant I agree wholeheartedly, I was just pointing out the general perception. It's like when people criticize some of my pigeon shooting videos for shooting the odd pigeon just as it has landed. I have a job to do and it's a clean kill. Yep I will shoot a pigeon just as it has landed or sometimes wait for it to lift. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kent Posted January 26, 2014 Report Share Posted January 26, 2014 Is it illegal to shoot ducks and geese with an air rifle? I would prefer just clarification on the law, not opinions! Thanks. Underdog. No legal illegal quarry is listed, the RSPCA have in the past made it clear they will press cruelty charges though and have done many times. They would not be short of expert witnesses if we were talking geese, just about every experienced wildfowler would take the stand let alone vets! The only thing you certainly cannot shoot with one is deer as its the only quarry we have with such restrictions. Opinion you already know mine as both an airgunner and sportsman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kent Posted January 26, 2014 Report Share Posted January 26, 2014 "Sporting" is where the difference lies! Vermin shooters tend to be one shot people who go for as close to 100% clean kills record as possible and leave shots they are unsure of. "Sporting" shooters enjoy taking more difficult high and fast birds with all the risk of pricked birds, runners etc. Which group causes more suffering? Which group has the higher percentage of clean kills? No prizes for the right answer. Its more than possible to get similar wounding rates with shotgun at range in the air and air gun when they are sleeping in the trees etc. I know this factually first hand! The guy who takes a crack at a tall bird on a driven day also has a team of skilled pickers up with some great dogs, this is the only difference a Pheasant is no tougher than a crow - geese are way different and more akin to a fox, indeed the fox has bigger more easy to locate vitals (no way airgun quarry though either of the latter two) The question of pheasants is all about what is sporting and how many places does the shooter genuinely have the sporting rights to do this? Few farmers / landowners will take kindly to rabbit permission being abused in my experience Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deershooter Posted January 26, 2014 Report Share Posted January 26, 2014 It would be outside the law to use a multi shot air rifle for shooting game and waterfowl Deershooter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Mat Posted January 26, 2014 Report Share Posted January 26, 2014 It would be outside the law to use a multi shot air rifle for shooting game and waterfowl Deershooter Can you provide links to the appropriate piece of legislation please Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deershooter Posted January 26, 2014 Report Share Posted January 26, 2014 Can you provide links to the appropriate piece of legislation please It's due to the magazine capacity it's not legal to shoot game and waterfowl with any firearm which can hold more than 3 shots ie no pump action ,semi auto 5 or 8 shot this includes air rifles Deershooter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Mat Posted January 26, 2014 Report Share Posted January 26, 2014 It's due to the magazine capacity it's not legal to shoot game and waterfowl with any firearm which can hold more than 3 shots ie no pump action ,semi auto 5 or 8 shot this includes air rifles Deershooter It actually says no automatic or semi automatic weapons which hold more than 3 rounds. Wildlife and Countryside Act 1981 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
timmytree Posted January 26, 2014 Report Share Posted January 26, 2014 It strikes me that there are far too many bloody armchair lawyers who think they know what they're talking about, or at least are hoping to convince other people that they do. Tomorrow I'm going to phone BASC, simple question, "Is it legal, or illegal, to shoot waterfowl with any air rifle as long as it is in season and you have the required permission?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Mat Posted January 26, 2014 Report Share Posted January 26, 2014 It strikes me that there are far too many bloody armchair lawyers who think they know what they're talking about, or at least are hoping to convince other people that they do. Tomorrow I'm going to phone BASC, simple question, "Is it legal, or illegal, to shoot waterfowl with any air rifle as long as it is in season and you have the required permission?" Its not hard to read the appropriate legislation and find out. I did earlier on hence my questioning. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kent Posted January 26, 2014 Report Share Posted January 26, 2014 It strikes me that there are far too many bloody armchair lawyers who think they know what they're talking about, or at least are hoping to convince other people that they do. Tomorrow I'm going to phone BASC, simple question, "Is it legal, or illegal, to shoot waterfowl with any air rifle as long as it is in season and you have the required permission?" I don't think the legality answers the questions 1. could you be convicted of causing unnecessary suffering provided for in law ? Yes it happens! fairly regular geese are certainly off the menu on that count alone! 2. Is it sporting to shoot what amounts to sitting / semi tame fowl and gamebirds? Nobody can kid on an experienced fowler that you can stalk into real wildfowl well enough to give a chance at a clean shot - those that have been fed / habituated sure and pheasants? well they are dumber than drunken frogs. Why not ask BASC will that take on your case in court if charges of cruelty are brought? You can shoot anything that's legal as quarry or vermin in the UK with an airgun other than deer (which is only because the deer act stipulates min energy and calibres). That doesn't make it right and it doesn't mean you cannot be prosecuted successfully for other offences in the undertaking of such an act Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
timmytree Posted January 26, 2014 Report Share Posted January 26, 2014 I don't think the legality answers the questions 1. could you be convicted of causing unnecessary suffering provided for in law ? Yes it happens! fairly regular geese are certainly off the menu on that count alone! 2. Is it sporting to shoot what amounts to sitting / semi tame fowl and gamebirds? Nobody can kid on an experienced fowler that you can stalk into real wildfowl well enough to give a chance at a clean shot - those that have been fed / habituated sure and pheasants? well they are dumber than drunken frogs. Why not ask BASC will that take on your case in court if charges of cruelty are brought? You can shoot anything that's legal as quarry or vermin in the UK with an airgun other than deer (which is only because the deer act stipulates min energy and calibres). That doesn't make it right and it doesn't mean you cannot be prosecuted successfully for other offences in the undertaking of such an act It doesn't make it wrong either, my view is that if I have permission to shoot waterfowl on private land or water and have satisfied the requirements of the law as far as season and permission is concerned then anything I shoot has more chance of being killed cleanly and quickly than a duck flighting in fast and high over a marsh somewhere. Any shooter could be prosecuted for cruelty whether he's using an airgun, shotgun or puntgun. If we have to worry about prosecutions for cruelty then I would rather be taking 99% certain shots at close range with an air rifle than 50/50 chance shots with a 12 bore. I've done both in the past and I know which method is more humane on a shot for shot comparison. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
terrier Posted January 26, 2014 Report Share Posted January 26, 2014 There is nothing specifically illegal about using an air rifle to shoot ducks and geese and there is no legal problem using a single lead pellet. Your problems would potentially relate to assorted animal cruelty legislation. http://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/1999/2170/contents/made There can be few times when an air rifle could be considered the appropriate tool and BASC etc., are not happy with air rifles for this use. unless you have a 74 ftlbs FX Boss .30 and below the 50m shooting ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dekers Posted January 26, 2014 Report Share Posted January 26, 2014 (edited) It strikes me that there are far too many bloody armchair lawyers who think they know what they're talking about, or at least are hoping to convince other people that they do. Tomorrow I'm going to phone BASC, simple question, "Is it legal, or illegal, to shoot waterfowl with any air rifle as long as it is in season and you have the required permission?" It is legal, that has already been answered! That is what the BASC will tell you, and then they will likely give you a lecture as to why you should not do it. Edited January 26, 2014 by Dekers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kent Posted January 27, 2014 Report Share Posted January 27, 2014 It doesn't make it wrong either, my view is that if I have permission to shoot waterfowl on private land or water and have satisfied the requirements of the law as far as season and permission is concerned then anything I shoot has more chance of being killed cleanly and quickly than a duck flighting in fast and high over a marsh somewhere. Any shooter could be prosecuted for cruelty whether he's using an airgun, shotgun or puntgun. If we have to worry about prosecutions for cruelty then I would rather be taking 99% certain shots at close range with an air rifle than 50/50 chance shots with a 12 bore. I've done both in the past and I know which method is more humane on a shot for shot comparison. Well I am a heck of a site worse a shot with the shotgun than a rifle but I 100% disagree with that. Take two shots both at 35 yds max effective range for both (shotgun using steel) and the duck in the air is more likely to be killed dead in the air in my experience. wildfowl have small brains for their scull size and there is no heart of lung shot available when a duck is on the water (this is why punt gunners wait for the rise of birds just leaving the water). I performed the autopsy on a Canada head not long back to find exact brain placement and size, it was posted on this forum (it can be replicated by slightly overlapping two 5 pence coins, it being more a sausage shape) A Canada goose is about a ten fold increase on a duck, though if you want to dispute that that is a hard shot on a bird on the water I can do the same with a widgeon and confirm the actual target size. Even on the water the target is unlikely to be stationary even while sleeping it will drift. I bet there isn't one prosecution for cruelty for shooting duck with shotgun, I have personally stood against two different cases with airguns being used to poach duck one when I was a river keeper, the other against some yob who thought it a good idea to shoot mallard on the canal. I admit that some seem to think that 80yds is suitable range for a 12ga, though the same can be said of airguns - it gets a bit boring listening to airgun hunters who think they can outshoot FT word champs when you hear of their exploits and claims. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Underdog Posted January 27, 2014 Author Report Share Posted January 27, 2014 Sooo...what you pair trying to say? That you wish it was illegal? U. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kent Posted January 27, 2014 Report Share Posted January 27, 2014 Sooo...what you pair trying to say? That you wish it was illegal? U. I cannot speak for others but I personally think airguns should be limited to certain quarry in law to clarify what is humane and yes what is sporting . Remember many countries do not allow airguns for hunting anything alive yet have an easy attitude to other field and shooting sports. In short people who shoot outside the remit (ducks, geese, hares, foxes etc) risk putting their continued use at risk. I remember BASC doing guidelines on quarry in the past and I seem to remember it ended with Rabbits and Carrion crow. The airgun is a useful tool but It use should be a humane and yes a sporting match for the quarry. Do we need to see any more x-rays on TV and the press showing airgun pellets in inappropriate quarry? I think not Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts