Gordon R Posted September 2, 2014 Report Share Posted September 2, 2014 Miroku still claim to hand finish by lamp black. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
a303 Posted September 2, 2014 Author Report Share Posted September 2, 2014 My hobby is metal work with a lathe and milling machine so I have a small idea about clearances and contact etc. admittedly I'm not a gunsmith.But to every single person I've shown it to, they have all responded with the same comment.'Thats not right, get it sent straight back'I've paid my money and I expect a product of satisfactory quality. I'm a long ***** way from been satisfied!!It's shoddy bloody assembly that's caused this problem. If Browning is happy peddling this as normal well so be it, it'll be the last browning I ever purchase.The rfd admitted it wasn't correct when I first spoke to him and agreed when he examined it in person and then quickly changed his tune when browning wasn't going to fix it.It's ok saying just use the gun, if it gets worse it's got a 10 year action warranty. The reason I returned it as quickly as I could was to avoid the typical warranty nobbing off of its too late to sort. Or should have returned it earlier. Etc.Still it's not done me any good.Where's a resident gun smith when you need one!!Rant over, I do however appreciate all your comments and thoughts, and hats of to the ones that have gone to the trouble of posting pictures! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dodeer Posted September 2, 2014 Report Share Posted September 2, 2014 My advice is get the gun back and depending on where you live phone BWM and ask to meet one of their reps in Didcot where there basdd Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HDAV Posted September 2, 2014 Report Share Posted September 2, 2014 (edited) Miroku still claim to hand finish by lamp black.They do? Not according to this..... http://www.fieldandstream.com/photos/gallery/guns/shotguns/2011/03/citori-miroku-shotguns-browning-japan-factory-tour/?image=6 Edited September 2, 2014 by HDAV Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon R Posted September 2, 2014 Report Share Posted September 2, 2014 HDAV - I should have been clearer. I accept that they do. Had quite a few Brownings and Mirokus. Never had this type of problem. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HDAV Posted September 2, 2014 Report Share Posted September 2, 2014 Hand finished but with chalk according to the article. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rich_morris Posted September 2, 2014 Report Share Posted September 2, 2014 My hobby is metal work with a lathe and milling machine so I have a small idea about clearances and contact etc. admittedly I'm not a gunsmith. But to every single person I've shown it to, they have all responded with the same comment. 'Thats not right, get it sent straight back' I've paid my money and I expect a product of satisfactory quality. I'm a long ***** way from been satisfied!! It's shoddy bloody assembly that's caused this problem. If Browning is happy peddling this as normal well so be it, it'll be the last browning I ever purchase. The rfd admitted it wasn't correct when I first spoke to him and agreed when he examined it in person and then quickly changed his tune when browning wasn't going to fix it. It's ok saying just use the gun, if it gets worse it's got a 10 year action warranty. The reason I returned it as quickly as I could was to avoid the typical warranty nobbing off of its too late to sort. Or should have returned it earlier. Etc. Still it's not done me any good. A303 - not sure if your 'rant' was aimed at me. As I said, I haven't seen your gun, or the damage that has been done. I will happily post photos of my gun, but they look exactly like the ones above. (Although mine say 32"), and show no signs of damage or interference, except for the bluing wearing slightly as shown above. Incidentally the bluing is also worn off where the fore end wood touches the barrels - I expect that. If everyone you have shown it to says its wrong, having actually seen it, then stick to your guns and get your money back. I haven't seen it, and you haven't described it well enough for me to make any other judgement than the one I did. I'm not a gunsmith either. Sorry if I caused offence or annoyance... Rich Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
a303 Posted September 2, 2014 Author Report Share Posted September 2, 2014 Rich Morris, The rant was at the situation. I'm just bloody annoyed that's all. No offence or annoyance at all was taken for your comments, I value every coment whether positive or negative. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rich_morris Posted September 2, 2014 Report Share Posted September 2, 2014 I can understand your annoyance. A new gun should be perfect, especially if you opt for a higher grade gun from a reputable manufacturer. I have just got my 725S1 out. It has no sign of wear or marking on the LHS. It has slight wear to the bluing on the RHS, and I just noticed a couple of radial score marks on the RHS. Maybe a bit of dirt got in there at some point. But it doesn't seem to be touching or rubbing the action - I will keep an eye on that, now I notice it. It looks like neither side of the barrels touch the action sufficiently to leave marks, except the top section where it is blued. If I could work out how to post pictures, I would do that for you! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon R Posted September 2, 2014 Report Share Posted September 2, 2014 HDAV - I stand corrected. I read the same article. Basically same procedure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andrew f Posted September 3, 2014 Report Share Posted September 3, 2014 this is why I don't spend more than £500 on a shotgun browning are useless. They are the same with there rifles bunch of ******* Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
a303 Posted September 3, 2014 Author Report Share Posted September 3, 2014 That's the only reason I spent the extra for a brand new gun. For the warranty if I was to have a problem and mainly for the fact I wanted a brand new unmarked gun that would stay that way in my ownership. So far, the warranty means ****, and I've got a gun with uneven tatty excessive wear at just under a month old and under 500 shots. The dealer doesn't want to know. Browning couldn't give a ****. I'm sure any prospective buyer wouldn't want it if they noticed the wear. I wouldn't want to sell it without telling the future buyer about it. No offer from either the dealer or browning to either repair it, replace it or to refund it. Not even to look at it again. The dealer at the minute seems to not even care about aknowledging my last letter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harnser Posted September 3, 2014 Report Share Posted September 3, 2014 Just out of interest I have a 325 citori made in 1986 . It has very ,very minor wear marks on the bright metal work were the engine turning would be and absolutely no wear marks on the blued part . Harnser Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
figgy Posted September 3, 2014 Report Share Posted September 3, 2014 If your getting no where, might be time to consult a solicitor. Figgy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bostonmick Posted September 3, 2014 Report Share Posted September 3, 2014 (edited) Get a independent gunsmiths to give an opinion make sure it is a proper gunsmiths. If they agree that it should not have worn this way then write to both your rfd and browning or email both telling of your findings and if something is not done to rectify the matter then trading standards and maybe a solicitor will be brought into the argument. You obviously do not want to pay out more in legal fees than the gun is worth so do as much groundwork as you can first.atb Edited September 3, 2014 by bostonmick Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grrclark Posted September 3, 2014 Report Share Posted September 3, 2014 Had a look at my gun today and it is showing light wear on both sides of the block, just longitudinal surface scratches as the block moves through the action. Probably slightly more on the right hand side than the left. Will try and get a pic with the macro lens a little later on and post up. It is the S1 725 so no engine turning on my gun. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trevorevans Posted September 3, 2014 Report Share Posted September 3, 2014 My 425 has wear to both sides but not what I would consider as excessive, where metal meets metal there is bound to be some wear. What you describe seems to be unreasonable at the very least. As for the quality of new Brownings I know 6 people who bought new 725s and 5 of them have gone back for repair mostly due to the pin running through the back of the forend (don't know the correct term for it) working it's way out. Although I am very happy with my gun (2003 as I recall) I'm not sure I'd have the confidence to shell out my hard earned on a new one after seeing/hearing of such issues. Hope you get things sorted. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
a303 Posted September 3, 2014 Author Report Share Posted September 3, 2014 Well, eventful afternoon. I received back a letter from the dealer so I gave them a ring to see if I could get anywhere. What followed was a civil conversation in which I explained my frustrations and I listened to the dealers frustrations and their side. They are obviously in a difficult place with browning not wanting to repair it and of course they don't want to pick the bill of repair up. But alas, it doesn't help my situation with a faulty gun. I've asked for a repair or a replacement and ultimately a refund if neither is possible. Which I think is very reasonable and well within my rights under the sale of goods act and exhausts all options of satisfactory resolution before it resorts to legal action. If I could get what I paid for the browning, put against another (dearer)gun I'd happily pay the difference just so I could have a gun back that I can use and be happy with. That way I end up happy, I've got a gun to use and the margin on the new gun covers the cost of the old gun so the dealer is happy and gets me out of their hair. Fingers crossed for a satisfactory outcome. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TIGHTCHOKE Posted September 3, 2014 Report Share Posted September 3, 2014 Good luck Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rich_morris Posted September 3, 2014 Report Share Posted September 3, 2014 Good luck +1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rich_morris Posted September 4, 2014 Report Share Posted September 4, 2014 Look at the LHS and RHS difference in wear on this.... http://www.guntrader.co.uk/Guns-For-Sale/Winchester_Shotgun_101-XTR-Lightweight_For-Sale_140904135339929 Not a B725, but a browning style Winchester. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dougall Posted September 4, 2014 Report Share Posted September 4, 2014 Op. ring David Stapley,head of Browning UK;01235 514550.If he is not there,ask for his email address and email him.He is the public face of Browning and he will not want threads like this going anywhere other than 'resolved'. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B725 Posted September 4, 2014 Report Share Posted September 4, 2014 My 725 is having the stock refinished and I will not get it back untill the end of the month or I would have had a look to see if it was the same but I cannot recall any wear. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B725-chris Posted September 8, 2014 Report Share Posted September 8, 2014 Any news a303? If you've not got the gun back yet, it may pay to get Browning to have a look down the chambers and check for internal marks caused by the stamps on the outside of the barrels. Mostly on the bottom barrel. And see what their opinion is. I had a look at 4 different B725's at the week end, ranging from Grade 1's to Grade 5's and all of them had a mark in the bottom chamber bore caused by the proof stamp on the exterior of the barrel. B725 owners that have their guns in possession may want to check theirs as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
a303 Posted September 8, 2014 Author Report Share Posted September 8, 2014 Still no news, Will be ringing tomorrow for an update. In a weeks time it will be 2 months old and in that time it's spent over a month in the dealers / Brownings possession. I had recently heard that there was an issue with the proof marks, never had chance to check mine as it had already been returned. Can't say that it instills confidence if such marks are present in the chamber. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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