Deer calibre

[al4x]

All of them by the looks of it, I'm sorted for the .223, I have dates booked for roe, fallow and cwd.

 

get the rifle you want any legal caliber will deal with all 3, I have no issue with my .243 on all the above but if you want an excuse to go bigger then go for it.

[Dunkield]

Bit of a hijack here but dunkield what round would you use for pigs? As I would like to bag one in the future and was wondering what other people use. I was thinking Norma oryx 156g or 140g nosler partition

I use factory rounds and so do most of my friends. I used to use Federal 140's but I now use Hornaday.

Apparently they no longer make them, so when they run out I will switch to 140 sst's reloads.

As always it's all about placement, I wouldn't get hung up on bullet type too much and certainly don't listen to anyone who starts a sentence with "270 is the minimum calibre"

Many will tell you the 6.5 isn't up to it, but I shot a 165kg pig with a single shot with mine years ago, just shy of a bronze medal, I know they go bigger but that was pretty huge.

For what it is worth, my advice is always talk to people who have done it, not those who have just read about it on the internet

Good luck, but be careful it can become addictive

[neutron619]

There is probably no perfect caliber and personal choice has a lot to do with it. I've been looking for less meat damage than the .243.

 

Appreciated your post about the 7x57 above the one I quoted - and yes, fine if you know the drops. We all should, for our respective rifles, really.

 

There were a couple of folk saying things like "buy a .223 if it's mostly muntjac" - a fair comment, but (this bit addressed to the OP) remember that most bullets smaller than 6mm are intended for "varmint" shooting, tend to be weakly constructed and will therefore do a lot more damage to a carcass, without making it any more or less dead. They also tend to fly very, very fast (relatively), which again doesn't help on the meat damage front.

 

What you buy will ultimately be down to how you feel about X, Y or Z calibre, but there is no reason that a larger calibre will be unsuitable, even if you mainly shoot smaller deer. Choose an appropriate bullet at appropriate (i.e. sub 3000fps) velocity, and you don't have to lose the whole front half of an animal because your gun is "too big". Many people are still to discover this fact, apparently.

 

Personally, I tend to shoot muntjac (and everything else) with a .308 with an ordinary 150gr SP doing 2700fps or so. I throw very little meat away. I'll be moving up to a 180gr pill later this year, pushed even slower (~2400-2500 maybe), simply because it's the next logical step in my journey of finding out what's quickly effective / humane, but as non-destructive to the quarry (which I want to eat) as possible.

 

Good luck with whatever you choose (but slow and heavy is the way forward! ).

Edited June 30, 2015 by neutron619

[tomov]

What Dunkield and Malkiserow said - most people will just recommend what they have...

 

For what it's worth, I shoot Muntjac, Roe, Fallow and the odd Red with 150 grain ammunition from a moderated .270. (Occasionally unmoderated if I forget to pick the mod up!!). The recoil for me is no issue for me out stalking and has never been a problem when zeroing. An awful lot of perceived recoil seems to come down to rifle weight though - mines a pretty bog standard stalking set up, so not massively heavy but not particularly lightweight either.

 

What I would say is that I don't get many runners (allowing of course for reasonable bullet placement) and meat damage is OK - certainly better than with other calibres I have used.

 

I'm sure you could do the same with .308 and 30-06 though!!

[scotslad]

Not going to disagree with u neutron about slow and heavy=less carcass damage.

 

But the problem u have with that is a loopy trajectory so making a humane shot placement slightly harder, so will need to know the range more acurately and hold off/adjust scope. Most people now really want as flat a shooting rifle/bullet combo as possible.

 

Like a few have said no right or wrong answers, and it's just wot compromises u make, and getting used to wot ever u choose.

 

Might make more sense to think about wot size/wieght of bullet u would want to shoot and work back from there.

 

100grains is the legal min in scotland for large deer, which is the very top end of a 243 range, If u want to shoot boar often gidelines state 270 as a min calibre, not saying other smaller calibres won't do the job thou

[Underdog]

I never had any issues with loopy traj's, I used 30/30 for years! 170grners in 308@ 2650 also.

 

Every or nearly everyone wants to be able to forget the great constant that is gravity and be able to shoot a deer to 300yds with little thought.

Somehow though they forget to do an average on the distance they do shoot something at!

Heck, I bet the whole national average is under 150yds!

[neutron619]

But the problem u have with that is a loopy trajectory so making a humane shot placement slightly harder, so will need to know the range more acurately and hold off/adjust scope. Most people now really want as flat a shooting rifle/bullet combo as possible.

 

...

 

Might make more sense to think about wot size/wieght of bullet u would want to shoot and work back from there.

 

Yep, that is the compromise. It depends where you're doing the stalking - if it's all 300 yard shots on the hill then fast and flat is the way to go. Most of mine is in woodland where 40-70 yards is a much more likely distance, in which neither calibre, nor bullet weight, nor drop makes much difference. I guess what we're both getting at really is that the key is to know what to compromise and adapt to the circumstances where that compromise isn't ideal.

 

I've actually got some 220gr RN's loaded up for my .308 at the moment. They're quite a bit below how fast I could push them - only 2150fps or so, when I think I could probably get to 2300fps - but I've no doubt they'll drop a muntjac if / when I try them! I also know a chap who uses a .45-110 on deer - a 300gr bullet on top of a mild load too, only doing about 1500-1600fps at the muzzle. In effect, you might call it "authoritative", though it's definitely a load for sub-100 yard ranges as it drops about 8" at 150yd and nearly 2' at 200 yards...

[malkiserow]

 

Appreciated your post about the 7x57 above the one I quoted - and yes, fine if you know the drops. We all should, for our respective rifles, really.

 

There were a couple of folk saying things like "buy a .223 if it's mostly muntjac" - a fair comment, but (this bit addressed to the OP) remember that most bullets smaller than 6mm are intended for "varmint" shooting, tend to be weakly constructed and will therefore do a lot more damage to a carcass, without making it any more or less dead. They also tend to fly very, very fast (relatively), which again doesn't help on the meat damage front.

 

What you buy will ultimately be down to how you feel about X, Y or Z calibre, but there is no reason that a larger calibre will be unsuitable, even if you mainly shoot smaller deer. Choose an appropriate bullet at appropriate (i.e. sub 3000fps) velocity, and you don't have to lose the whole front half of an animal because your gun is "too big". Many people are still to discover this fact, apparently.

 

Personally, I tend to shoot muntjac (and everything else) with a .308 with an ordinary 150gr SP doing 2700fps or so. I throw very little meat away. I'll be moving up to a 180gr pill later this year, pushed even slower (~2400-2500 maybe), simply because it's the next logical step in my journey of finding out what's quickly effective / humane, but as non-destructive to the quarry (which I want to eat) as possible.

 

Good luck with whatever you choose (but slow and heavy is the way forward! ).

 

I think the OP already has a .223.

 

My purpose in quoting some drop figures is for the OP to judge for himself if these are too much for him, my choice was for mild slower shooting rounds but I don't do big shooting in open country much. My own caliber would be daft choice for the OP as it almost forces reloading or scant picking of factory rounds. However, I know a few who would hate much of a drop in a "short" distance and really are only happy with big cartridges shooting fast rounds to keep it flatter for longer.

[Underdog]

Even up the hill all my shots were under 200 yards!

[Dunkield]

I shoot a six point five, I therefore subscribe to the slow and heavy theory, but...

 

I still maintain the .223 is gods own muntjac calibre, it's drop them where they stand pretty well every time and does very little meat damage at all.

I do use fairly conservative home loads though, I have never chromo'd them but I know they could be a lot quicker.

Don't tell the 'kill em all' brigade this, but I have let muntjac walk by as I have had the 6.5 with me and not the .223.

[neutron619]

Well - there are enough people shooting off enough rounds of .223 Remington that it must be good for something! Never shot a munty with one, but if and when, I'll remember what you said and see what I think.

 

I suppose the only thing to add, in case anyone not up to speed with all this comes looking through all this for advice later, is that - in my book at least - "heavy" bullets implies both "heavy for quarry" and "heavy for calibre".

Edited June 30, 2015 by neutron619

[kyska]

Thanks for all the replies, very useful.

 

I think the 30-06 is in favour due to the versatility if I do start to reload.

[Dunkield]

You could have just asked Dougy then

[Bewsher500]

ask 100 people the same question get a 101 answers

 

1) Cartridge and calibre - makes not a jot of difference! ALL deer legal calibres are closer to each other in trajectory at 200-300 yds than you will ever be able to shoot in the field

2) Recoil is one thing, perceived recoil is another. - get a gun that FITS YOU - MOST IMPORTANT RULE all the rest is semantics as you won't notice it in the heat of combat if it fits you well (I had a horrible lightweight .243 that used to kick lumps out of me, compared to my current 300WM which is a pussy!)

3) Buy one you can feed - no point buying the latest sexy fashionable round if you can't buy or afford to buy enough ammo/components to feed it and practice

 

and

 

4) whatever you buy - learn it! be able to empty the mag/box, remove bolt, cock/decock, make safe, make ready and shoot it well out past where you expect to in all conditions of darkness and light, rain or shine!

 

 

and so long as you get a .270 you will be fine.....

seriously though the deer don't know the difference between 2800 and 3000fps, 100gr and 180gr

learn your anatomy and stick them in the right place you'll be fine

Edited June 30, 2015 by Bewsher500

[kent]

Anything from .243 win upwards, will do the job on all UK deer so don't restrict yourself to Scottish roe and Munties by getting a .222, .223 etc. I like the .243as it very versatile and easy to shoot good from improvised or off hand positions well. Availability of ammo is a big factor if you go for something other than the norm.

Its better to ask which bullet for which deer at which impact speed than which calibre.

,243, .308 followed by .270 and 6.5x55 have been the most popular in the UK for decades and are all easy enough to feed

[Underdog]

Kent, how is 243 any better to shoot off hand or from improvised positions?

I did not realise it was a design feature of 243!

[tbox]

I had the same dilemma a couple of years back. Went for a .270 and been really happy with it. Not had anything run more than 20yards and flat shooting so you don't have to change point of aim (at least not on the range I'm comfortable with!) only problem I find is 1. Very loud even moderated and 2. Can be a little heavy on meat damage. I'm told that if I move from a 130gn to a 150gn this will fix that but it will be at the cost of flat shooting... And I like that!

[Harnser]

I keep reading that it is important for a bullit to shoot as flat as a blind cobblers thumb at the speed of light . Any 30 calibre bullit will shoot flat enough out to 200 yards if properly zeroed with out having to hold over and will hit the vitals of a deer to point of aim from 50 to 200 yards . Some seem obsessed with having a rifle that will shoot one hole groups at any distance , not necessary for stalking deer . A four inch group at 100 hundred yards is more than enough accuracy for deer At sporting ranges . I like to shoot the maximum of a 2 inch group at 100 yards . Easily achieved with any 30 calibre .

Harnser

Edited June 30, 2015 by Harnser

[Underdog]

I keep reading that it is important for a bullit to shoot as flat as a blind cobblers thumb at the speed of light . Any 30 calibre bullit will shoot flat enough out to 200 yards if properly zeroed with out having to hold over and will hit the vitals of a deer to point of aim from 50 to 200 yards . Some seem obsessed with having a rifle that will shoot one hole groups at any distance , not necessary for stalking deer . A four inch group at 100 hundred yards is more than enough accuracy for deer At sporting ranges . I like to shoot the maximum of a 2 inch group at 100 yards . Easily achieved with any 30 calibre .

Harnser

Here here, daft how it gets int it.

[Dougy]

I wasn't going to comment, been reading it all daily though, just waiting for someone else to suggest the 30.06.

Sounds like the gentleman has seen the light without any input from me. Lol

 

Oh and now of course it can be used over the water were they grow the onions.

30.06 Lovely cal. So good I might get another; -)

[Bewsher500]

I had the same dilemma a couple of years back. Went for a .270 and been really happy with it. Not had anything run more than 20yards and flat shooting so you don't have to change point of aim (at least not on the range I'm comfortable with!) only problem I find is 1. Very loud even moderated and 2. Can be a little heavy on meat damage. I'm told that if I move from a 130gn to a 150gn this will fix that but it will be at the cost of flat shooting... And I like that!

 

you wont notice the difference in flatness!

I only use 130gr BECAUSE it has more energy than the 150gr at factory speeds

 

get a decent bullet construction and shoot for lung shots not heart shots or through shoulders when possible. still drops them fast

if shooting roe or small deer with it you will always have damage if you hit bone

if reloading you can slow them down too

my pet 130gr load is a around 2900 (vs 3100 factory) very accurate, zeroed an inch high at 100 it is still well within most people's capabilities at 200

 

FWIW at a stalker's target shoot competition at the weekend 90% of the people shooting the 200yd target prone did not get 4 shots inside the 4" rings (still perfectly acceptable to kill deer whatever anyone says)

the variable at that range is you, not the trajectory

[scotslad]

 

 

FWIW at a stalker's target shoot competition at the weekend 90% of the people shooting the 200yd target prone did not get 4 shots inside the 4" rings (still perfectly acceptable to kill deer whatever anyone says)

the variable at that range is you, not the trajectory

 

 

Out of couriosty wot were the groupings like at 200m?

Were all shots off target but still grouped reasonbly well (poor holding off) or grouping quite poor (human error/poor shooting)?

[Dougy]

The thing is when someone asks for the best this or best that, if its a rifle calibre, make of rifle, scope or bag to chuck it all in. The individual has, in the majority of times in there possession what they believe to be the best of what's suitable for them.

Look at all the choices out there, pro's and cons also look ahead,, would you require something bigger in the near future.

 

If so go for 30.06 lol

[geordieh]

Why bother trying to get 1 rifle to do everything just get 1 of each calibre, and it is much more fun that way

[shootgun]

I had the same dilemma a couple of years back. Went for a .270 and been really happy with it. Not had anything run more than 20yards and flat shooting so you don't have to change point of aim (at least not on the range I'm comfortable with!) only problem I find is 1. Very loud even moderated and 2. Can be a little heavy on meat damage. I'm told that if I move from a 130gn to a 150gn this will fix that but it will be at the cost of flat shooting... And I like that!

 

Get the right bullet and you won't have any meat damage