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How cheap is too cheap when buying an air rifle second hand?


PeaceFrog
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Some good skills knife throwing there-pigeon right in the neck and a Bunny right up the ....well its dead and thats all that counts. Showing pictures of cheap guns and dead game is meaningless-I have killed Rabbits by throwing a screwdriver at them but if I posted a picture of it would it suggest that people go out and buy a set? Turkish guns are cheap for 2 main reasons-materials are heavily subsidised to allow the Turks to buy them and secondly your average Turk will work for peanuts-I guess that niether really has an over riding effect on quality as long as some sort of quality control exists, I think that, with time, we will see more and more Imported Guns from countries such as Turkey and we will all get used to them-there are bound to be some Turkeys from Turkey but that's the same with any Importer-look at Hyundai-terrible cars 10 years ago but look how quickly they have got their act sorted out-shame the british car industry didn't do the same 25 years ago.

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It's been said a million times before but consistency in terms of accuracy, power and reliability is all that you NEED in a rifle and some cheap guns will give you that, but the point I was making is that if you can spend a small amount more you will not only get an accurate, consistent rifle but one that is easy and enjoyable to shoot. I would go to a gun shop and have a play with a few rifles to look at the difference in quality, but personally I'd rather pay a little more for a nice used HW with the pretty much perfect rekord trigger than a new Hatsan and spend my valuable time faffing about tinkering to get it, at best, almost as good. Underdog, absolutely agree, a cheap rifle will kill a rabbit, but then again so will a house brick :lol: but I've owned various spring guns of various prices and qualities but nothing has ever come close to my HW98 or quality and useability. I could have bought 2 hatsans for the price of the HW but I would have wasted my money if I had. I wish I'd never sold it now.

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The thing is Bruno that they have got their act together horrifyingly quickly. True the odd turkey does rear it's head but when they make and sell as many rifles as they do, you will get the odd one that requires plucking rather than shooting.

 

Had one myself, bought an AT 44 as a bad weather gun, grouped nicely, just 8 inches to the right at 6 yards! Replaced instantly under warranty. The rifle that replaced it was perfect. So yes the odd plucker is out there. This has happened to most makes of gun though, there will be one that does not shoot where you expect it to. The wife had a Scorpion SE that grouped worse than a blunderbus. Had to be sent back to BSA and repaired.

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The Hatsan 900 is very consistent shot to shot. The quality in build is not that different to an HW, in fact in some cases better than a modern one (I know I have a mark 1 HW77 the wife has 2 modern 95s that were pigs, rough edges, swarf, spring apparently cut by angle grinder and not finished properly). The trigger is the down side but if they could upgrade it to a Quattro unit, it would be much more refined.

 

It will be interesting in 6 months or so after more use to test it and see what it is doing then!

Edited by secretagentmole
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SAM they do look amazing for the price, but you have just confirmed exactly what I said. Why buy a £100 (most places arent selling them for £70 unfortunately) rifle to then spend another £30 on a trigger that will be not quite as good as the Rekord? Put a new scope on and you're looking at £170 in most shops, or spend £30-50 more and get a HW80. No contest for me, but each to their own, its just my 'umble 'pinion. :good:

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SAM they do look amazing for the price, but you have just confirmed exactly what I said. Why buy a £100 (most places arent selling them for £70 unfortunately) rifle to then spend another £30 on a trigger that will be not quite as good as the Rekord? Put a new scope on and you're looking at £170 in most shops, or spend £30-50 more and get a HW80. No contest for me, but each to their own, its just my 'umble 'pinion. :good:

Problem is a secondhand rifle can be full of SEPs (Somebody Else's Problems) and cost a load more to fix than what you spent on it. From what I have read the trigger is easily fixed with a 8mm m3 bolt and a slight bend of the trigger spring. I may be tempted a few months down the line to see if this is true! In the meantime I am going to keep using the poorer though functional trigger!

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Hi Peacefrog,

 

You say you only want a cheap gun to target shoot in the garden and I can fully recommend the SMK XS19 or 20 range with a cheap Nikko Stirling Mountmaster scope on. There is nothing wrong with them for what you are asking and they might surprise you. I bought a secondhand B20 (same as an SMK XS20 for £80 and hunted with it successfully out to 30 yards for quite a few years, in the garden it would group nicely within a penny at 25 yards all day. If you feel the interest and need, there is plenty of good info on the Chinese Airgun Forum to open it up one day and fettle it a little... :good:

 

Atb.....David

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Thanks for the opinions guys, debate is always useful. I'll mull it all over before I go to the shop this weekend and buy something. I'm not even sure what they have in stock but hopefully I'll be able to compare a second hand Weihrauch and a new hatsan then make up my mind. I got to say that when I was growing up my dad gave me a Gamo with some scope. I think it cost about 130 back then all in brand new and it was great for targets up until I broke it (my fault entirely), so I won't be quick to dismiss a hatsan when I do compare the two!

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What it boils down to is what you want to spend surely? Chinese airguns, Hatsan, Gamo and so on are perceived as being cheap and cheerful and not particularly good.

The Chinese stuff is often copied from European designed rifles, early ones were let down by the quality of materials and some machining was rough but they are improving.

Gamo purchased BSA for the name, they don't produce anything really interesting, just pull in punters with silly names on rifles that by and large will end up rusting and forgotten in a shed after a year or two.

Hatsan on the other hand are making strides in the right direction, they may have the advantage of cheap labour and some of their stuff is still a bit rough round the edges but generally seems solid and dependable. For the lucky few who can get the 900 at £69 I reckon it's well worth a punt. It seems someone has already worked out how to improve the trigger. It's already reported as being twang free which is a big bonus, nothing much wrong inside then is there? It has a walnut stock that doesn't cost you an extra £100 or so, open sights for those who like them, even an arrestor block already fitted.

OK, it's not an HW or AA or Diana but it's nowhere near the same price league either. All marques have problems, people buy brand new rifles between £300 - £500 and still resort to tuning kits because they don't perform as expected. Buying the big name rifles is ok if you can afford it but many can't, those that buy expensive kit often forget that fact, and yes, cheap can often mean not as good but can also mean you're getting a serious bargain, whether you decide to fettle or not is up to you but that decision will be taken no matter how much you spend.

Without having tried one I think these Hatsans may actually be ok and be worth getting with a view to doing a bit of tinkering. If it all goes wrong it's not a lot of money to lose is it? Not like an HW99 that eats itself or an AA that suffers from a guide that doesn't fit the spring or a Daystate that lets you down after you've spent £1000 plus.

I don't mind being disappointed at £69 but spend £300 and feel the same? Blood pressure goes up!

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Underdog,, you stated " So what do think now gobby? "

 

do you always have to be so rude and offensive when someone has an opinion that differs from yours :no::no::no:

 

I will not lower myself to your childish silly rants, all I will say is you stick to your cheap and cheerful guns and I,ll stick with my opinion and my guns,

 

behaving like an idiot ranting at people whom express there opinions only make you LOOK a bigger fool than we already know you are,but posting pictures of yourself does make me howl with laughter,

 

best wishes Evo

 

Falconfn, I could not agree more with you sir,

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Underdog,, you stated " So what do think now gobby? "

 

do you always have to be so rude and offensive when someone has an opinion that differs from yours :no::no::no:

 

I will not lower myself to your childish silly rants, all I will say is you stick to your cheap and cheerful guns and I,ll stick with my opinion and my guns,

 

behaving like an idiot ranting at people whom express there opinions only make you LOOK a bigger fool than we already know you are,but posting pictures of yourself does make me howl with laughter,

 

best wishes Evo

 

Falconfn, I could not agree more with you sir,

:lol: brilliant :lol:

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I am considering the drive! Thanks for posting

Have a drive, whilst you are there also look at what else they have in and the cost!

They may let you have a plink with it on their test rage and I would recommend .22 as they do have low recoil in that calibre, just remember the auto safety so when you have broken the rifle and loaded it, got it to aim just bring the thumb on your trigger hand up and flick that easy safety forward and you are ready to fire.

 

They have the SMK XS18 as well (that is £19 more expensive), the HW99 at £225 (which will depreciate by the cost of the Hatsan when you buy it and is renown for galling, badly cut springs and nicked seals), a Walther Century £289 (depreciation again), Crosman Phantom and Phantom 2 at £150 and £160 respectively,

 

But try many and see what you like! After all if you fall in love with the Walther it is no use singing the praises of the Hatsan. However if you want cheap and the back up of a warranty, I will recommend the Hatsan heartily.

Edited by secretagentmole
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Will snobby do?

 

Some folk are of limited means and some are content with their manhood.

To make someone feel uncomfortable with their limited funds is mean. To imply they a doomed to failure or struggle is a lie.

 

In all honesty the words I used in my opinion say more of the other than me, any one to respect this opinion of mine? I wonder!

 

I did answer with photographic evidence to displace the negative comments, action always speak the loudest no?

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"Potentially" snobby would have been best IMHO. My last 3 puffguns were -AA S410/Daystate mk3/Logun pro none of which are cheap guns but if I could find a local supplier of the Hatstand for £69 I would have one tomorrow.

so would I Bruno, even if it was just to do some plinking in the back garden,,

 

Underdog, being able to afford certain rifles through hard work all my life does not make me a snob, infact I am the exact opposite as people who know me will vouch for, I try to be as helpful as I can to everyone not just on here but in life as a whole, something else people who know me will vouch for,

 

with regards being content with the size of my manhood ( ??? ) yes I am thankyou just ask the wife and the 5 kids we have produced,, but what on earth has the size of manhood got to do with cheap springers ???

 

as an avid hunter for over 40 years, I have found out that buying cheap has always been false economy, the rifles I use are the BEST that I can afford, through working hard all my life to give my family a good home and my kids a good education, now if its that making you think I,m a snob then " a snob I am "

 

playing on a low income " Some folk are of limited means " as you clearly stated is your paranoia taking over because not once have I tried making you or anyone else feel uncomfortable ,

 

 

UD ,, my only friendly advice I could give to you would be, " stay of the drink before coming on here making derogatory comments that have no truth "

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