shootthepigeon Posted October 9, 2015 Report Share Posted October 9, 2015 My sgc runs out on Sunday with no replacement issued, so I phoned the local firearms dept who said (as predicted) put them to an rfd,after a bit of phoning locally, apparently all ledgers were full due to the backlog of certs issued. I then spoke to the firearms dept again who assured me the RFD'S did have room, so back on the phone to no avail, now the dept say they will phone round and find room and be back in touch, I gave them till 5pm with no phone call back. Why are they so intent on not granting temporary certs, which would allow people to keep shotguns in there possession even if not using them? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scully Posted October 9, 2015 Report Share Posted October 9, 2015 If the cause of the delay is down to licensing then they have no option but to serve you a S7 temp' ticket. If the cause of the delay is down to the applicant then licensing can insist he places his guns with a RFD, at his expense. Have you been in touch with your shooting organisation? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shootthepigeon Posted October 9, 2015 Author Report Share Posted October 9, 2015 The delay is partly my own doing, as the reminder/forms were lost in the post ( or more than likely posted by our trusty postie to the other end of our road. But I knew it was coming up but thought it was the end of November, but either way I've explained all this in various phone calls and cover letter with my paperwork. In the first conversation with my FAO a month back when I spotted the issue, he said there's no chance of a temporary cert. I just wondering why they are so against granting while the RFD'S haven't got room to take anymore on there ledgers due to the firearms backlog? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saddler Posted October 9, 2015 Report Share Posted October 9, 2015 Lodge a formal complaint Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scully Posted October 9, 2015 Report Share Posted October 9, 2015 Contact your shooting organisation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danger-Mouse Posted October 9, 2015 Report Share Posted October 9, 2015 I might be able to help with the RFD, ie put you in touch with one who has room. Drop me a pm if you`re interested. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robbiep Posted October 9, 2015 Report Share Posted October 9, 2015 If it's just SGC shotguns, you can lend them to a friend and put them onto his certificate, to transfer back over once your renewal/S.7 ticket has come through Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris1961 Posted October 9, 2015 Report Share Posted October 9, 2015 (edited) It was a odds on cert this was going to happen only two feos for south Yorkshire when mine runs out I will demand a temp ticket it's all down to south Yorkshire police cutbacks and incompetence how can just 2 people cover the whole of south Yorkshire impossible Edited October 9, 2015 by chris1961 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AULD YIN Posted October 9, 2015 Report Share Posted October 9, 2015 Put my coterminous renewal in on 28th June , both fac/shotgun licence's ran out on the 8th October temp certs were delivered on the morning of the 8th, the saga continues but well done to lothian and borders (Police Scotland) for at least getting my temps on time ,lasts two months so will keep you updated. johnnie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saddler Posted October 10, 2015 Report Share Posted October 10, 2015 Put my coterminous renewal in on 28th June , both fac/shotgun licence's ran out on the 8th October temp certs were delivered on the morning of the 8th, the saga continues but well done to lothian and borders (Police Scotland) for at least getting my temps on time ,lasts two months so will keep you updated. johnnie Good to hear you got S.7 cover, but not good that they cannot process a renewal within 12 weeks! Seems that most of the rest of the UK can process GRANTS in less than half that time.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shootthepigeon Posted October 10, 2015 Author Report Share Posted October 10, 2015 I'm not too bothered about a formal complaint, firstly I don't want to risk my renewal being pushed further back down an ever increasing pile, and also the people I've spoken to at South Yorkshire dept have been helpful and agreed a temp cert looked like the best option, however there managers must have disagreed. I'm just trying to understand why temps are so hard to get? Is it too much paperwork? As I know nothing has changed in my personal circumstances since my initial sgc was granted. Best go and find an rfd with room for 3 I've put 2 more precious ones to a friend. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dougy Posted October 10, 2015 Report Share Posted October 10, 2015 If you were given enough notice to fill in your renewal, and you didn't. Or failed to ensure it got thete on time.Then it's likely you will be asked to place your gun's in storage, or as it's SGC and not FAC transfer them to another SGC holder. Why do people moan about other people and organisations when in fact.in these circumstances it's down to negligence or absent mindedness of themselves. To the topic starter, you have admitted that you failed to ensure prompt and secure delivery. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shootthepigeon Posted October 10, 2015 Author Report Share Posted October 10, 2015 I have said it was partly my doing, and as stated I am not complaining about the way this has panned out, I just can't understand why a temp cert is so difficult to obtain, this is only compounded by the fact that the rfds I've tried to get my guns into are full, mainly down to the fact south yorks have such a backlog of paperwork to get through,as I see it due to lack of staff. I appreciate it's my responsibility and will be sorted one way or another. Why do temp certs exist if they don't consider issuing them? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dougy Posted October 10, 2015 Report Share Posted October 10, 2015 Staffordshire and warickshire have now combined as have a few other's. But there's less bums on seats to do both counties. It's not "the" reason why a sect can't be given, but what I presume is that Mable still needs to go through the same process for that as she would a full licence. But I agree that a FAC would be more work due to permission checks and reason. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Good shot? Posted October 10, 2015 Report Share Posted October 10, 2015 It may be that If the need to issue a temp certificate is down to their inadequaces and not yours, it may flag up in their system and show their failings and therefore someone may be answerable. This is possible considering the apparent understaffing in these department. Likewise if it is applicants error in submitting late etc they can insist storeage at RFD etc and no argument can be made. Just a thought. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dougy Posted October 10, 2015 Report Share Posted October 10, 2015 It may be that If the need to issue a temp certificate is down to their inadequaces and not yours, it may flag up in their system and show their failings and therefore someone may be answerable. This is possible considering the apparent understaffing in these department. Likewise if it is applicants error in submitting late etc they can insist storeage at RFD etc and no argument can be made. Just a thought. Dont you think that the amount of time that its taking will show up the problems or as you call them "inadequacies" We have the same kind of problems many others face nowadays. The same amount of work and even more in some cases but less time to do the work. Stand up in front of our work force and call them "inadequate" Now if your referring to the system them "yes" i see its not suitable there are failing in the system, and that's down to higher level management. As folk are aware BASC are pushing for a 10 year licence, thats a good think, but again when it starts off or "If" it goes ahead then there will be delays again, and I suppose there will be some "inadequate" person to blame then. I Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shinybum Posted October 10, 2015 Report Share Posted October 10, 2015 it is my understanding that when a temporary cert is issued the police have to notify the home office and it shows that they are not fulfilling their criteria, also they do not want to waste time that could be spent on ordinary applications but when a temp is needed it should be issued. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Good shot? Posted October 10, 2015 Report Share Posted October 10, 2015 Dont you think that the amount of time that its taking will show up the problems or as you call them "inadequacies" We have the same kind of problems many others face nowadays. The same amount of work and even more in some cases but less time to do the work. Stand up in front of our work force and call them "inadequate" Now if your referring to the system them "yes" i see its not suitable there are failing in the system, and that's down to higher level management. As folk are aware BASC are pushing for a 10 year licence, thats a good think, but again when it starts off or "If" it goes ahead then there will be delays again, and I suppose there will be some "inadequate" person to blame then. I 'Any' inadequacies or failings as you call them shown up by any means are down to the management to identify and resolve. If they fail to provide suitable key monitoring points and appropriate action when problems are shown then they are at fault. I intended to illustrate failures in the System and did not apportion blame on any section of the department. in fact acknowledged staffing levels as one area of concern. Higher management in any area of work are always responsible for correcting failures in the system. 'Inadequate ' staff occur at all levels and after a lifetime of work I have seen it for myself, don't be so touchy and accept it. I again reiterate not once have I said dept staff are inadequate which you seem to imply I may have. I hope I have clarified my post. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redditch Posted October 10, 2015 Report Share Posted October 10, 2015 Here in NI, the standard is, EVERYTHING with an ME of over 1 joule (0.635 ft/lbs) is an FAC section one. This includes ALL air rifles and shotguns, not just rifles and pistols. That said, usually within a couple of weeks of sending your forms in for variation or renewal, they have sent you a temporary cert, so you can buy ammo, hold and use your guns. It seems to be standard here, although in the bad old days, it could take 4 months to get one, now it's generally 7-10 days for it to arrive in the post. As far as sending the forms in, I always hand deliver them to my local police station, in an envelope for the attention of "explosives and firearms dept" And that then gets delivered by their internal post soupy stem the very next day Haven't had one get lost yet Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dougy Posted October 10, 2015 Report Share Posted October 10, 2015 Good shot ? I take your point, and I didnt feel touchy, far from it its not my scene. Maybe I took your post the wrong way, but none the less there are an awful lot of people that put blame on the people that are on the front line, ie; the root level admin staff trying to supply FAC's and SGC's in a timely manor, and through no fault of there own are put in a position none of them would choose to be in. And I think that if you (not you personally) have failed to return your application for a renewal in a reasonable time as requested then you need to just sit back and be patient as its only yourself that created the problem. Now then,, if on the other hand you have returned your renewal in a timely manor, then yes apply for a section 7. and demand one if necessary. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snow white Posted October 10, 2015 Report Share Posted October 10, 2015 I send mine by recorded delivery signed for check two days later if nobody as signed for it I chases it up the onuse is on you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
old man Posted October 12, 2015 Report Share Posted October 12, 2015 I send mine by recorded delivery signed for check two days later if nobody as signed for it I chases it up the onuse is on you. Absolutely. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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