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BASC statement on Home Office proposals


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1 hour ago, fse10 said:

All of this will be irrelevant when the Home office bring in the compulsory GP report & write it in to the firearms act.

Then so be it, if they bring it in to law in the correct way rather than add it to the bloody awful Home Office Guidelines that most Police Forces seem to interpret in the worst possible way.

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On 4/30/2018 at 12:42, fse10 said:

All of this will be irrelevant when the Home office bring in the compulsory GP report & write it in to the firearms act.

At least this way it will be equitable across the country, rather than the 'make it up as we go along' approach of Lincs Police and others at present. Whether BASC will be able to influence the wording of this is debatable, I hope they can but I wasn't impressed with the lack of help they gave me last year with my renewal debacle.

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A different slant on this if I may….

 Why don’t BASC and the like, consider being proactive, rather than reactive?  We (The UK Shooting Fraternity) have on the whole, a law abiding and healthy attitude to our hobby and no amount of cursory legislation is going to make any difference to current safety levels amongst legal gun owners.  Derrick Bird didn’t have any medical records to suggest he was unfit to own firearms, and I suspect that will continue to be the case for many moons to come.  All this legislation will do is punish those with ‘subjective’ ailments that a GP will probably highlight due to being frightened of any possible future recriminations.

 I personally would be more comfortable with something along the lines of Ad-Hoc visiting carried out by suitable persons such as FEO’s, at least this way there’s the possibility of ongoing monitoring of the mental state of the license holder.

 Its buffoons like this (littered all over the web) that politicians should be concentrating on……  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8h8fi3o4lsc

 

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23 minutes ago, KB1 said:

 

 I personally would be more comfortable with something along the lines of Ad-Hoc visiting carried out by suitable persons such as FEO’s, at least this way there’s the possibility of ongoing monitoring of the mental state of the license holder.

 

And what special knowledge/training/qualification does a FEO have to decide if I am mentally fit to have a firearm. The thought certainly doesn't fill me with confidence.

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Guest stevo
39 minutes ago, KB1 said:

A different slant on this if I may….

 Why don’t BASC and the like, consider being proactive, rather than reactive?  We (The UK Shooting Fraternity) have on the whole, a law abiding and healthy attitude to our hobby and no amount of cursory legislation is going to make any difference to current safety levels amongst legal gun owners.  Derrick Bird didn’t have any medical records to suggest he was unfit to own firearms, and I suspect that will continue to be the case for many moons to come.  All this legislation will do is punish those with ‘subjective’ ailments that a GP will probably highlight due to being frightened of any possible future recriminations.

 I personally would be more comfortable with something along the lines of Ad-Hoc visiting carried out by suitable persons such as FEO’s, at least this way there’s the possibility of ongoing monitoring of the mental state of the license holder.

 Its buffoons like this (littered all over the web) that politicians should be concentrating on……  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8h8fi3o4lsc

 

FEO’s are not medical or psychiatrically trained to give an opinion, this was also one of the reasons given by GP’s as to why they could not or wouldn’t  do it . 

If your FEO ruled against you , your legal representative would rip them to bits in a matter of moments as 100% unreliable . 

 

 

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3 minutes ago, CharlieT said:

And what special knowledge/training/qualification does a FEO have to decide if I am mentally fit to have a firearm. The thought certainly doesn't fill me with confidence.

Thats why I said "Along the lines of" :).  I'm inferring that someone linked specifically linked to Firearms/Certificate holders could be tasked with keeping up to date/tabs on peoples fitness to hold a license.  However, I would have thought he'd have more of a clue than a GP who doesn't get visited….

1 minute ago, stevo said:

FEO’s are not medical or psychiatrically trained to give an opinion, this was also one of the reasons given by GP’s as to why they could not or would do it . 

If your FEO ruled against you , your legal representative would rip them to bits in a matter of moments as 100% unreliable . 

I get all of that, but 'Somebody' has to keep an eye out for the nutters:hmm: So, who do you think should do it?

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6 minutes ago, KB1 said:

Thats why I said "Along the lines of" :).  I'm inferring that someone linked specifically linked to Firearms/Certificate holders could be tasked with keeping up to date/tabs on peoples fitness to hold a license.  However, I would have thought he'd have more of a clue than a GP who doesn't get visited….

I get all of that, but 'Somebody' has to keep an eye out for the nutters:hmm: So, who do you think should do it?

The referees

 

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Guest stevo
41 minutes ago, KB1 said:

A different slant on this if I may….

 Why don’t BASC and the like, consider being proactive, rather than reactive? 

 

 

 

This is what most of us having about for years , they won’t and don’t ! 

This is the bloody problem . 

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1 minute ago, Dave-G said:

The referees

 

 

1 minute ago, Dave-G said:

The referees

 

They're all biased towards Man City;)

Just now, stevo said:

This is what most of us having about for years , they won’t and don’t ! 

This is the bloody problem . 

Can't argue with that; and I'm a member...

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Guest stevo
18 minutes ago, KB1 said:

 

I get all of that, but 'Somebody' has to keep an eye out for the nutters:hmm: So, who do you think should do it?

Nothing . What’s wrong with just leaving things be , the FEO’ s do a pretty darn good job at sussing the nutters as you put it . 

Its not we have ticket holders gunning people down every other day , 

if someone’s intent on causing harm to someone else, there going to do it what ever . 

A marker put on a file and a thumbs up from a doctor 18 months prior is NOT going to stop anything . Someone’s mental state can change very rapidly and is pretty much impossible to spot until things are too late . 

Like has been said many many times, this is nothing more than PR kick in the spuds buy our so called peirs .

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13 minutes ago, stevo said:

Nothing . What’s wrong with just leaving things be , the FEO’ s do a pretty darn good job at sussing the nutters as you put it . 

Its not we have ticket holders gunning people down every other day , 

if someone’s intent on causing harm to someone else, there going to do it what ever . 

A marker put on a file and a thumbs up from a doctor 18 months prior is NOT going to stop anything . Someone’s mental state can change very rapidly and is pretty much impossible to spot until things are too late . 

Like has been said many many times, this is nothing more than PR kick in the spuds buy our so called peirs .

Essentially, I'm in agreement with everything you say, but the fact is that the powers to be won't just leave things be, and who better to judge our fitness to hold a licence than the persons who granted them in the first place?

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Does the Home Office or Lincoln Constabulary have any details of the shotgun certificate or Firearm licence holders that have committed 59 murders in London this year using firearms?

The whole thing is a total fiasco , not helped by lack of representation on behalf of legally owned shotgun owners .

 

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22 minutes ago, Salopian said:

Does the Home Office or Lincoln Constabulary have any details of the shotgun certificate or Firearm licence holders that have committed 59 murders in London this year using firearms?

The whole thing is a total fiasco , not helped by lack of representation on behalf of legally owned shotgun owners .

 

But it's the same old story. The gov go after the easy target US who already are the most law abiding so they can say they've brought in new laws to protect the public with out going after the crims who don't give a toss about the law that is in place already .

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On 27/04/2018 at 11:52, David BASC said:

 Lets stick together, regardless of which organisation we choose to support, we are all shooters and must stand together.

.

Not having a pop on a personal basis but please outline what efforts have been made by which organisation to achieve this situation? 

Where is the log jam and why?

It's precisely the situation you implore us all to avoid that is the problem and we as individuals don't seem to be able to define the root cause of the inability to be cohesive over this matter.

About time all organisations stood up to be counted so that members can decide who they wish to support?

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On 09/05/2018 at 16:50, old man said:

Not having a pop on a personal basis but please outline what efforts have been made by which organisation to achieve this situation? 

Where is the log jam and why?

It's precisely the situation you implore us all to avoid that is the problem and we as individuals don't seem to be able to define the root cause of the inability to be cohesive over this matter.

About time all organisations stood up to be counted so that members can decide who they wish to support?

Sadly the silence seems to say it all? Game over!

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Unfortunately all the different organisations have different agendas .

CA basicly look after the chinless wonders from the Hunt set .

NGO look after the Night Owlers after the Pubs have shut.

 CPSA look after the inanimate members ( sorry I meant targets)

BASC look after themselves .

All gainfully employed doing very little to sort these issues out and if we had a united Association it would mean redundancies .

Probably best to paddle your own canoe.??

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1 hour ago, ShootingEgg said:

Which is more like a bucket with holes in it due to all the internal nit picking done by the shooting community, its been said before, at times we are our own worst enemy. 

Maybe we should all stand together we could all join up to a organisation to speak on our behalf. Oh wait a minute

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Almost a month since this thread was started , no meaningful dialogue from Lincolnshire shooters who seem to be the ones affected , no worthwhile statements from Lincolnshire Constabulary or any shooting organisation to say that this has come to a meaningful conclusion.????

 

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Guest stevo
1 hour ago, Salopian said:

Almost a month since this thread was started , no meaningful dialogue from Lincolnshire shooters who seem to be the ones affected , no worthwhile statements from Lincolnshire Constabulary or any shooting organisation to say that this has come to a meaningful conclusion.????

 

What do you want  us Lincolnshire shooters to say ??

the problem is still there , the situation hasn’t changed . 

The world is now waiting for BASC to step up and take the floor .............. distant sound of that pin dropping again .

I have said more than enough on this whole drawn out  and to be totally honest tiresome subject.  

However there is one thing I am looking forward to, and that’s the example and the advice good people like yourself will be offering us simple folk ( along with BASC of course ) on how to deal with this problem when your county does the same. 

I personally know two people who Have had there applications sent back after nearly 5 months of waiting  due to GP problems and new paperwork needed to be compleated . ( I’m not discussing there medical situation on an open forum. But I will say it’s NOT a problem there end )

regarding linccolnshire police . What else do you want them to say ?

thay have been banging on about it for the last two years , they made a statement on country file , they even had a 5 min slot on evening news explaining what there going to do and there reasons for it  . What else do you want ? 

 lincs police are sticking to there word . 

Maybe time for others to do the same .

 

Edited by stevo
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BASC need to stop pussey footing about & trying to go down a political route. They should be taking Lincoln police to court over this, instead of trying there hardest to keep HOLD of the MEMBERS MONEY. Every time we let this happen is another nail in the coffin of the shooting public.

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As stevo has said what is it people want certificate holders in lincnshire do. I asked a fao here what happens if the doctor refuses to send a reply because they are anti shooting. The reply was we will cross that bridge when we come to it. I don't know the circumstances Steve has mentioned but perhaps this is that bridge. And lincs are dealing with it by not issuing a certificate in line with home office guidance. Basc have asked if you get a problem contact them. Maybe those mentioned are not members so gives basc the perfect reason to carry on at their incompetent best. My basc renewal is not far off and the way things are looking I may have to give it some consideration before putting it in the bin. Basc as the biggest need to get their backsides out of their comfy chairs and finally start to earn their keep. 

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