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F1 again


ditchman
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just watched and listened to the pre-amble for the qual'.................chandock...drove an F1 Willams 1983 around the monte track.................

the noise was aggressive ...sexual...exciting ...brutal...amazing.........

 

if modern F1 was a drink it would be a weak orange squash...................1983 F1 would be a cocktail of double gins pimms raw alchohol...rocket fuel and a couple of lines of coke all shook up together..............

 

why mess things up when it was right in the first place...

 

 

shame...

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It's called progress, something changes for each new season, less downforce next year so potentially we will have the fastest lap times this year for each circuit.

I agree the old cars are great to watch, all of the historique races are worth watching!

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I,m afraid your James Hunt ,Ayrton Senna,s ,Emmerson Fittipaldi ,Nikki Lauda,s and many other live fast ,die young drivers would have been as crippled by the elf n saffety over regulation of todays F1 .The merry go round today is a shadow of it,s former self, JPS lotus unchanged for many a season because it worked ,James Hunt on the pop and ladies all night then going out to race would have Ross Braun having kittens .We had a great youth seeing these men but todays racer has a rule book with more pages than the bible some changes are not always for the better 

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17 minutes ago, clakk said:

I,m afraid your James Hunt ,Ayrton Senna,s ,Emmerson Fittipaldi ,Nikki Lauda,s and many other live fast ,die young drivers would have been as crippled by the elf n saffety over regulation of todays F1 .The merry go round today is a shadow of it,s former self, JPS lotus unchanged for many a season because it worked ,James Hunt on the pop and ladies all night then going out to race would have Ross Braun having kittens .We had a great youth seeing these men but todays racer has a rule book with more pages than the bible some changes are not always for the better 

Absolutely right, the danger was the sport. People like Mike Hawthorne were the equivelent of WW2 Spitfire pilots, life was short. There are pictures of all the drivers drinking together in the Casino in  Monte Carlo late into the night before the race the following morning. All wearing dinner jackets and bow ties, it was a gentlemans club.

Next morning could very easily be their last, they didn't even wear seat belts.

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16 minutes ago, Pistol p said:

I just spent the weekend at Brands Hatch watching the Historic Masters meeting. It was a mighty impressive show of 70s and 80s F1, touring cars and GT racers. It's the noise that's so impressive.

yeah thats what my post was about............and now they have exhust pipes on 1600cc enjines.........

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Jeremy Clarkson once said that the two key ingredients for super cars is sex and violence. They've got to have looks, but there's got to be some kind of danger, some kind of aggression that thrills you - but is still intimidating. 

I just don't get that from the modern F1 cars. and Monaco this week was a complete farce. F1 should be the culmination of everything that's possible in motor racing. Instead it was like watching the traffic cameras on the M25. So tedious 

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12 hours ago, chrisjpainter said:

Jeremy Clarkson once said that the two key ingredients for super cars is sex and violence. They've got to have looks, but there's got to be some kind of danger, some kind of aggression that thrills you - but is still intimidating. 

I just don't get that from the modern F1 cars. and Monaco this week was a complete farce. F1 should be the culmination of everything that's possible in motor racing. Instead it was like watching the traffic cameras on the M25. So tedious 

How was Monaco a complete farce ? It happens to be my least favourite "race" as it happens but also if I'm honest the one I'd most like to win a free weekend to. All races on the calendar have their own unique character and Monaco is known for being nearly impossible to overtake, this then puts the onus on the drivers to make sure they qualify well and the teams need to work extra hard on tactics, it brings with it a different set of demands in other words, and the winner is invariably a deserving one (Olivier Panis 1996) perhaps a rare exception. 

It also perfectly demonstrated what many are slowly beginning to realise about Max Verstappen too, that he is a superb driver 95% of the time but fragile (with dire consequences) the other 5%, in fairness he did manage to pull a few passing moves albeit in a superior package/tyre condition. Hungary is another one on the calendar where overtaking is very hard. I thought the race overall was one of the best ones we have had in Monaco recently and it also again exposed the brilliance of Ricciardo who not only qualified well but didn't panic when the inevitable troubles came and raced well. To me F1 isn't about just the races themselves but noticing how for instance everyone raves about Max and Daniel goes on to quietly outrace and outscore him.

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I have been to Monaco few times in the days of 3ltr Cosworth V8s.  

The problem is the track is completely unsuitable for current car/tyre combinations. The cars are too wide and and too unstable in dirty air. 

The fact that the leaders were trundling along 5 seconds off of the pace and still there was no overtaking proves what a farce it was. 

Historic or not it shouldnt remain on the GP curcuit.  

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7 minutes ago, AVB said:

I have been to Monaco few times in the days of 3ltr Cosworth V8s.  

The problem is the track is completely unsuitable for current car/tyre combinations. The cars are too wide and and too unstable in dirty air. 

The fact that the leaders were trundling along 5 seconds off of the pace and still there was no overtaking proves what a farce it was. 

Historic or not it shouldnt remain on the GP curcuit.  

agree............

i do like Baku tho...:lol::drool:

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Last weekends race was the only one I’ve watched from start to finish for a long time. It wasn’t thrilling to be honest but I just wanted to see Ricardo win. If Vettel had passed him I’d have turned it off and got on with something else.

I often liken F1 to watching England play football; initial excitement turning to disappointment, and feeling afterwards I’ve just wasted 90 mins of my life, but F1 still has the edge. It’s just that from the tv, unless you’re ‘in car’, there’s just no sense of speed at all, at least with Monaco there is some. 

Touring car is more exciting to watch from a tv point of view. 

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I was struggling to get an F1 fan to understand the ballast system in Touring Cars.

He couldn't seem to get his head round the fact they adjust the odds to make the racing closer and even more spectacular.

I agree with most of the comments above, I just don't get how 20 odd cars going round and round a road circuit in complete procession for an hour or has anything to do with racing?

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15 minutes ago, Dunkield said:

I was struggling to get an F1 fan to understand the ballast system in Touring Cars.

He couldn't seem to get his head round the fact they adjust the odds to make the racing closer and even more spectacular.

I agree with most of the comments above, I just don't get how 20 odd cars going round and round a road circuit in complete procession for an hour or has anything to do with racing?

Fair point. Perhaps every now and then F1 should just throw in a reverse grid. Or they could just do it from the outset. The ten cars which qualify fastest occupy the last ten places on the grid; any car perceived to be qualifying 'off pace' incurs a time penalty. It would certainly go a long way to enthuse fans I would think, but would sponsors and manufacturers agree? ?

It's never going to happen but I'd certainly watch if it did. 

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The last race was terrible, but some of the earlier ones this season were better.

Unfortunatley I don't think we'll ever get back to the noise and adrenaline of days gone by. The first time I went to Silverstone we were a couple of miles away and the sounds were awesome at that distance. Next to the track was a full body experience that made you chest rumble .... especially the Bennetons. 

 

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49 minutes ago, Dunkield said:

I was struggling to get an F1 fan to understand the ballast system in Touring Cars.

He couldn't seem to get his head round the fact they adjust the odds to make the racing closer and even more spectacular.

I agree with most of the comments above, I just don't get how 20 odd cars going round and round a road circuit in complete procession for an hour or has anything to do with racing?

Not everything to do with cars has to involve constant overtaking and huge shunts, F1 "racing" is about the complete package, it's a Team sport where decisions made days earlier may make the difference between a win and coming 4th regardless of the intrinsic superiority of the car itself or indeed the driver. A Ross Brawn can make the right instantaneous decision to bring a car in to clear (unovertakeable) traffic in a pitstop, a Pat Symonds in your team can add several points to the years tally through sheer brain power, a driver who knows his car isn't capable of a Pole may sacrifice a futile attempt by playing the long game and keeping a fresh (or perfectly scrubbed) "unused" set of tyres for the race, perhaps even for the last 10 laps to at least secure 2nd, the teams do multiple strategy appraisals based on computer simulations before they've even left for that race destination and all that can change if circumstances dictate changing a 3 stop plan into only 2, the pit crew can affect the outcome with their speed under race pressure, Team politics (money) has been known to decide placings (even wins) on the last lap, Championships are won by getting the right designer to work for you (Newey) sometimes knowing you have to wait 3-4 years for it all to come together, the Team Principal has to manage his 2 drivers and suss their mentality, playing one against the other without demoralising either (this very phenomenon has cost McLaren not only a Championship but is perhaps responsible for their subsequent spiral into midfield obscurity), it's a fluid multi faceted orchestra, not a point to point race with equal equipment. 

I don't understand other types of races but I never ever knock them.

Edited by Hamster
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In my teen we used to walk over fields to the Charterhall track where the late Jim Clark cut his racing teeth.  It was all a pretty crude affair in the early 1950s with bands of us youths wandering around the ,'pits' on practice days.   On race days some of those cars were awesome the BRM.s Masaraties  etc the drivers elbows outside the cockpit hands locked on an enormous steering wheel.  Speeds were of course much slower but when you are 14 it was the bees knees.

 

Black powder

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On 30/05/2018 at 09:30, Hamster said:

Not everything to do with cars has to involve constant overtaking and huge shunts, F1 "racing" is about the complete package, it's a Team sport where decisions made days earlier may make the difference between a win and coming 4th regardless of the intrinsic superiority of the car itself or indeed the driver. A Ross Brawn can make the right instantaneous decision to bring a car in to clear (unovertakeable) traffic in a pitstop, a Pat Symonds in your team can add several points to the years tally through sheer brain power, a driver who knows his car isn't capable of a Pole may sacrifice a futile attempt by playing the long game and keeping a fresh (or perfectly scrubbed) "unused" set of tyres for the race, perhaps even for the last 10 laps to at least secure 2nd, the teams do multiple strategy appraisals based on computer simulations before they've even left for that race destination and all that can change if circumstances dictate changing a 3 stop plan into only 2, the pit crew can affect the outcome with their speed under race pressure, Team politics (money) has been known to decide placings (even wins) on the last lap, Championships are won by getting the right designer to work for you (Newey) sometimes knowing you have to wait 3-4 years for it all to come together, the Team Principal has to manage his 2 drivers and suss their mentality, playing one against the other without demoralising either (this very phenomenon has cost McLaren not only a Championship but is perhaps responsible for their subsequent spiral into midfield obscurity), it's a fluid multi faceted orchestra, not a point to point race with equal equipment. 

I don't understand other types of races but I never ever knock them.

Thats all well and good, but it can still be a bit tedious on the eye?

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i need my motor racing to be a viceral affair ...of burning fuel and rubber ..intense noise.....not full of big girly blouse drivers...bloody bores.....premerdona's and the like....i totally understand what Hamster says..........

but christ its soo boring

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I agree with Hamster on this, 

Its the whole package, yes Monaco is a tad tedious but you had keep watching it just to see if Ricciardo could take the win he deserved, 

a lot of races are boring but as said, following the strategy is good.

TT isn’t a race, it’s a time trial yet nobody says it’s boring, 

Having said that....

RIP Dan Kneen, another rider taken too young, will be interesting to see how many years the TT has left ?

:shaun:

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I don’t think the TT is boring because there is that sensation of speed, which is even apparent on screen, whereas MOTO GP lacks it, just like F1. 

As regards the TT’s longevity, as long as there are people wanting to participate it’ll happen. 

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If they are going to keep the Monaco GP they should have it a lot later in the year. Two reasons:

1) The weather is likely to be worse therefore increasing the probability of making the race more eventful.

2) It will be more likely that the result would have a major influence on the championship, resulting in drivers taking more of a chance. 

Sometimes I amaze myself with my brilliance! 

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The TT will not exist in it's current format for many more years to come - it just can't, it's just way to close to the edge.

Hopefully neither will F1 - but for entirely the opposite reasons ?

MotoGP is literally what it is all about. OK it lacks real depth of field but that is because it is so prohibitively expensive, it needs at least two more factories to get involved IMO

We watched the last race on the big screen at the Bike Shed and at times it was edge of seat stuff.

This was just the support race 

Oh and that thing where one vehicle goes past another is called 'overtaking' without that just you have, well you know.... 

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As much as I liked the 80s F1s. trying to compare the drivers of back then and now is ridiculous. The level of physical needed by the modern drivers *just to get into the frigging car* is amazing. I'm sure it was more 'manly' to drive back then, but the modern drivers get more out of their machine, for a longer time. There are WAY more extremely talented drivers on the front porch than there used to be, and you just can't drive along for 10 years being 'average' (like Button and a few others did) -- these days you seems to get 1/2 season and you're out.

The last 'party all night' driver is probably Raikonnen -- and I'm pretty sure he had to calm that down seriously in the last few years. Once he's gone, it'll just be super hungry kids like we already see at the back of the grid. Rearing to go, but ready to burnout quickly. I wonder if for example, Verstappen is going to have that burnout sooner than later.

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