turbo33 Posted June 28, 2018 Report Share Posted June 28, 2018 I would imagine its only a matter of time before plastic wads are taboo. The recent drive to rid the world of plastic will not see us with a special dispensation to continue using them I'm sure. Plastic wads still seem to dominate the cartridge market, especially in 410. Most clay grounds round here are fibre only and its just common sense to me, to use fibre for shooting where livestock are likely to graze. Also, lets not forget, that shooting over farmland, is still some someones property and theres no excuse for leaving empty plastic shells behind and logically the same would apply to plastic wads. My point to this is, following on from Cookoff's post developing fibre loads. Great idea Cooky, and maybe something that reloaders should mull over. I load 12g,20g and 410 all fibre, and they never disappoint me with their performance. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TIGHTCHOKE Posted June 28, 2018 Report Share Posted June 28, 2018 I am sure you are quite correct, but will we as a sport self regulate and stop using plastic wads or will it be forced upon us? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
panoma1 Posted June 28, 2018 Report Share Posted June 28, 2018 Unless you homeload....you can only use what the manufacturers are prepared to make available! ....it is the manufacturers who need to get their act together, not the shooting public! Its about profit!....it's easier, cheaper, quicker and more profitable to bulk manufacture cartridges with one piece plastic wads.......it's business!"............Polluting the environment is unlikely to be much of a consideration for them!....so don't hold your breath, the government will probably ban plastic wads before the manufacturers develop a conscience? I have asked a manufacturer who sells his wares on this site at least three times about producing a quality 65mm, fibre wad, game cartridge........ain't even had the courtesy of a reply! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TIDES EDGE Posted June 28, 2018 Report Share Posted June 28, 2018 As I have said before on other posts on this subject the fibre cup that Gamebore use in some of their steel loads is the way forward in my opinion , it could be used in all cartridges but as panoma1 says the manufacturers don't seem in a hurry to develop it further. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lksopener Posted June 28, 2018 Report Share Posted June 28, 2018 1 hour ago, panoma1 said: Unless you homeload....you can only use what the manufacturers are prepared to make available! ....it is the manufacturers who need to get their act together, not the shooting public! Its about profit!....it's easier, cheaper, quicker and more profitable to bulk manufacture cartridges with one piece plastic wads.......it's business!"............Polluting the environment is unlikely to be much of a consideration for them!....so don't hold your breath, the government will probably ban plastic wads before the manufacturers develop a conscience? I have asked a manufacturer who sells his wares on this site at least three times about producing a quality 65mm, fibre wad, game cartridge........ain't even had the courtesy of a reply! They wont be interested because loading wise it’s not as straight forward as loading plastic wads, nor can you run them at the same speed. Therefore this effects commercial viability. With regards to 65mm most modern guns are 70mm so unless you order 10,000, no manafactuer is going to make you a bespoke loading. They need to make the fibre wads with a shot cup cheaper and make them with with the existing tooling. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motty Posted June 28, 2018 Report Share Posted June 28, 2018 3 hours ago, turbo33 said: I would imagine its only a matter of time before plastic wads are taboo. The recent drive to rid the world of plastic will not see us with a special dispensation to continue using them I'm sure. Plastic wads still seem to dominate the cartridge market, especially in 410. Most clay grounds round here are fibre only and its just common sense to me, to use fibre for shooting where livestock are likely to graze. Also, lets not forget, that shooting over farmland, is still some someones property and theres no excuse for leaving empty plastic shells behind and logically the same would apply to plastic wads. My point to this is, following on from Cookoff's post developing fibre loads. Great idea Cooky, and maybe something that reloaders should mull over. I load 12g,20g and 410 all fibre, and they never disappoint me with their performance. I understand what you are saying, but I am still to hear of one real example of livestock coming to harm after ingesting a plastic wad. None of my farmers have ever insisted that I use fibre either. I will not voluntarily use fibre. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stagboy Posted June 28, 2018 Report Share Posted June 28, 2018 Incredible attitude. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave at kelton Posted June 28, 2018 Report Share Posted June 28, 2018 By choice I only use fibre wads save my steel wildfowling loads. If I could have equivalent card or fibre wads I would use them. It is disheartening to see so many plastic wads on the foreshore. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dipper Posted June 28, 2018 Report Share Posted June 28, 2018 Don't think it's wad being eaten by livestock.More of a litter issue .I used Bio wads thay were fine until the sun got to them then thay crumbled.. Carn't see why a suitable wad carn't be developed..Dipper. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stagboy Posted June 28, 2018 Report Share Posted June 28, 2018 (edited) Gamebore make a fibre/cardboard fully biodegradable wad suitable for steel. Called Silversteel. However, it only comes in one load of no 4 shot. at the moment. The future? Edited June 28, 2018 by stagboy clarity Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
panoma1 Posted June 28, 2018 Report Share Posted June 28, 2018 45 minutes ago, lksopener said: They wont be interested because loading wise it’s not as straight forward as loading plastic wads, nor can you run them at the same speed. Therefore this effects commercial viability. With regards to 65mm most modern guns are 70mm so unless you order 10,000, no manafactuer is going to make you a bespoke loading. They need to make the fibre wads with a shot cup cheaper and make them with with the existing tooling. That is what I was driving at! The manufacturers won't be interested because loading eco friendly loads mean less profit! So they are just gonna churn out plastic wad cartridges, until the government ban plastic wads........there's no incentive to do otherwise!.....and for now non homeloaders will just have to use what they offer! And continue to pollute the countryside! The salient point in my reference to the cartridge manufacturer was fibre wads.....not the length of the case! But any answer/reply would have been nice! Surely it would not be impossible to make a card wadcup with an attached fibre/felt/cork/card etc wad.........and for the manufacturing process to load it as a one piece wad as per plastic? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stimo22 Posted June 28, 2018 Report Share Posted June 28, 2018 We use the Gamebore Silver steel load because our farmer only wants fibre loads. If it was my land I would want the same Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
panoma1 Posted June 28, 2018 Report Share Posted June 28, 2018 1 minute ago, Stimo22 said: If it was my land I would want the same Me too! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motty Posted June 28, 2018 Report Share Posted June 28, 2018 3 hours ago, stagboy said: Incredible attitude. Please explain why. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest stevo Posted June 28, 2018 Report Share Posted June 28, 2018 (edited) 3 hours ago, stagboy said: Incredible attitude. To be honest I find your attitude a little uninformed and a tad arrogant.. I think your find we’re the only country in the whole of Europe as well as other countries that actually use fibre wads , as there all non - toxic. There has also never been a credible report of livestock in any shape that has been caused harm from a Plaswad. and as for you gamebore biodegradable wads , they will still be on the floor we’re they wher left a year later , and longer if there not in the right conditions . I will shoot whatever works the best for what I’m doing at the time , be it fibre or plaswad . My Conscious is clear when I see all the chemicals sprayed over the countryside buy our good ol farmers , killing insects and other wildlife habitats all in the name of modern farming To worry about what my plastic wad is doing ? Edited June 28, 2018 by stevo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spot on Posted June 28, 2018 Report Share Posted June 28, 2018 ouch ..not pulling punchs are we Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PPP Posted June 28, 2018 Report Share Posted June 28, 2018 Deliberately littering the countryside with any plastic is unacceptable, end of. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KB1 Posted June 28, 2018 Report Share Posted June 28, 2018 Oh man, It'll be lead next, then exhaust fumes? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest stevo Posted June 28, 2018 Report Share Posted June 28, 2018 (edited) 30 minutes ago, PPP said: Deliberately littering the countryside with any plastic is unacceptable, end of. well its either lead or plastic , thems your choices mucker . edit to say , until we all get some better options . Edited June 28, 2018 by stevo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motty Posted June 28, 2018 Report Share Posted June 28, 2018 1 hour ago, PPP said: Deliberately littering the countryside with any plastic is unacceptable, end of. Do you fire off lead shot? Do you drive a car? Do you burn fuels to heat your house? Please, don't be a hypocrite. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stagboy Posted June 28, 2018 Report Share Posted June 28, 2018 (edited) I don't know how long a Gamebore Biowad takes to biodegrade, but I am assured that eventually it will, because it is made of organic materials which can be digested by microbes (and as such is not to be confused with a photodegradebale wad, which merely breaks into pieces). Anyway, the issue is not one of cosmetics. It's much, much more important than that. Plastic eventually physically breaks into micro-globules - ie tiny fragments - which may be extant for millions of years, causing widespread and irreversible pollution of living organisms and the environment. Arguing "other people pollute the planet so it doesn't matter if we do" is facile beyond belief. Littering the countryside with plastic unnecessarily, when cost-effective alternatives are available, is selfish and does the shooting community no favours. Most game shoots now ban plastic wads - and quite right, too. And now we have at least one commercially available wad for steel shot which is properly biodegradeable and costs little more than a plastic wad. No doubt more manufacturers would follow up is there was evidence of demand. As for Europe, Denmark, with the full support of its hunting organisations, is committed to banning all plastic shotgun wads within the next three years (just google it: Fieldsports Channel had a news item on this in March, and it was mentioned in Shooting Times a month or two ago). What do the Danes know that we don't? Plastic wads are no longer necessary for steel shot. Gamebore has shown that. Let's get rid of plastic wads (before they indirectly help to get rid of us). Edited June 28, 2018 by stagboy typo, clarity Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PPP Posted June 29, 2018 Report Share Posted June 29, 2018 7 hours ago, motty said: Do you fire off lead shot? Do you drive a car? Do you burn fuels to heat your house? Please, don't be a hypocrite. Not with plastic. You are choosing to miss the point to create a reaction because you think it’s cool to be the person advocating wanton littering. 8 hours ago, stevo said: well its either lead or plastic , thems your choices mucker . edit to say , until we all get some better options . Leads a given, plastic or fibre is a choice, choosing to use plastic mens purposefully littering Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest stevo Posted June 29, 2018 Report Share Posted June 29, 2018 16 minutes ago, PPP said: Leads a given, plastic or fibre is a choice, choosing to use plastic mens purposefully littering So you are against me using and other using plaswad in the field, but your ok to use plaswad over water when your fouling? Haha what a double standard joke . The dophins are not going to be happy with you are they ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motty Posted June 29, 2018 Report Share Posted June 29, 2018 1 hour ago, PPP said: Not with plastic. You are choosing to miss the point to create a reaction because you think it’s cool to be the person advocating wanton littering. Leads a given, plastic or fibre is a choice, choosing to use plastic mens purposefully littering Lead is a given? You mean you fire off lead shot against your own will? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stimo22 Posted June 29, 2018 Report Share Posted June 29, 2018 My point was that if it was my land I would not want plastic wads littering it. So I don't use them on my permission. On our clay shoot we have a fibre wad policy but we still get visitors trying to get away with using them. As some of the post have said they are not bothered and will do as they like. I believe it is the same with lead shot and duck and come back to bite us all on the backside Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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