GOD BLESS AMERICA

[jonny705]

Okay, my posts are really long but hopefully worth your time

 

There have been numerous topics on this forum regarding our increasing worry of the way our society is becoming- this is simply my take on a possible reason.

Many years ago my Father emigrated to Florida, and I went over in 1989 I was nearly 21 back then-I always assumed as it was a primarily Christian English speaking country it would basically be the same as us culturally but hotter J

I had never seen so many fast-food places and how cheap it all was-a burger was 99c or 50p, when I went to Disney I was speechless at the size of the people there in the que’s -and the size of the seats to accommodate them, I had NEVER seen such big people in my life. I expected to them to be all ripped –but at Daytona Beach it was like a load of blubbery wales and the odd fit people, would you not want to be slim and fit and healthy when young where is your self-pride.

Every tool I seemed to pick up had loads of stickers on it about what not to do – what’s the crack with all these labels dad? He started laughing –‘basically the Americans’ seem to lack common sense and have to be told everything however obvious they cannot think for themselves’ he said.

Everyone had huge satellite dishes in the gardens and nearly 100 channels to choose from –WOW I thought we had like 3, after 3 months I trying to find anything with substance I realised they were all just well **** – take away the news and documentary’s and it was like 70 channels of brain dead content – else either trying to sell you something or convert you to Christianity

Obviously The gulf war filled the papers along with gun crime above  and LAWSUITS- everyone was suing everyone for anything, my dad wanted to run a boat fishing business but he could not afford the insurance required for the amount of permutations  of immense stupidity  you had to account for it was all farcical really.

ON a daily basis there were newspapers articles about shootings – it was so commonplace it didn’t warrant headlines, back here it would have been major news; people would have been shocked at the level of violence and gun crime-‘They still think they are living in the Wild West and are Cowboys’ was my dad’s take-life seemed cheap and taking one was accepted.

Compared to our reserved ‘hidden top shelf magazines’ Porn was like everywhere-on pay for view  TV , strip clubs , and videos and magazines in average type shops , nudity was really accessible  to see compared to back home  and kind of seedy.

Always been into shooting and fishing, so was blown away at the amount of sporting stuff available at say Walmart, so much total rubbish you didn’t need to have fun, camouflage bog roll in different patterns sticks in my head – I caught every type of course fish with 2 rods – there they had a rod for every species it seemed – ‘it’s to lure the suckers in and catch the angler more’ my dad used to say.

Watching Political/ Evangelical stuff on TV, its format  reminded me of our Pantomime shows, incredibly insincere crass people, spouting total baloney-yet could get people into mob frenzy at the slightest thing – unreserved belief in what they were being told – if it is on TV it must be True –Praise the Lord and donations number below –well gullible race of people.

I tried buying a beer but was asked ID , as was under 21, however if I had a driving license could have bought a .44 Automag with 3 different barrels in S/S with attached scope and a 9mm MAC10 when I visited a gun show – how messed up is that I thought.

Was reading a car magazine on way home it had corvette on front cover – an American started saying how they produced best sports cars in the world – ‘Yes I said if you don’t go round any bends your cars can only go in straight lines’- had a row basically quoting the 911 took USA by storm as first decent handling car they experienced –but don’t let the facts get away of your brainwashed belief mate.

 

So no thanks Dad- want to go home to my country that has seemly unlimited amount of history, culture,  education ,  creative TV/radio , free thinking, non-brainwashed, dignified,  heathy people that could think for themselves – I kissed the tarmac when I got back to old Blighty I missed it  so much .

Now 30 years later we have basically adopted there culture – WHY? Is my question, our country was once a proud nation with our own identity envied the world over – a lot of people died to achieve that – it makes me want to weep.

 

 

 

 

 

[The Burpster]

Whilst I share some of your thoughts (bearing in mind I am dual National as my dad was a GI), if you only visited Florida then it’s bit like a tourist visting the UK and only going to Skegness or Blackpool in the summer. Florida is the Skegness of America....? a huge number of decent Americans have never been to Florida and have little need or intention to go there. 

If you had visited some of my relations in the Mid-west you will see that whilst everything it seems, is bigger and louder they share the same worries for their country as we do ours. Where life is genuinely harder there are far more ‘normal’ people. 

Edited August 15, 2018 by The Burpster
Typo

[RockySpears]

  I think it just seems that way.  Yes there are a ton of mall and pointless shops, but they are attended only by a few, less well-off citizens.  All the Americans I know are pretty much OK, and I have worked for 2 American companies for 20 years.  I think what you saw was like walking round Stockton High St , lots of 3rd generation unemployed, all huddled in close proximity while most of us only go in when necessary and spend time "doing things" and visiting other places.  A good example is to walk through London, you could be in any 3rd world bazaar, Hookahs in the St., flowing robes in black, strange languages spoken.  You are in the UK, but it doesn't look or feel like it.

 

Try Durham or Carlisle, Keswick or Corbridge.  Britain still exists, but mostly it minds its own business, until it doesn't,

RS

Edited August 15, 2018 by RockySpears

[The Burpster]

.....and on the flip side of that we trust our country to be run by idiots with no grip on reality! ?

[Scully]

47 minutes ago, jonny705 said:

Okay, my posts are really long but hopefully worth your time

 

 

 

There have been numerous topics on this forum regarding our increasing worry of the way our society is becoming- this is simply my take on a possible reason.

 

Many years ago my Father emigrated to Florida, and I went over in 1989 I was nearly 21 back then-I always assumed as it was a primarily Christian English speaking country it would basically be the same as us culturally but hotter J

 

I had never seen so many fast-food places and how cheap it all was-a burger was 99c or 50p, when I went to Disney I was speechless at the size of the people there in the que’s -and the size of the seats to accommodate them, I had NEVER seen such big people in my life. I expected to them to be all ripped –but at Daytona Beach it was like a load of blubbery wales and the odd fit people, would you not want to be slim and fit and healthy when young where is your self-pride.

 

Every tool I seemed to pick up had loads of stickers on it about what not to do – what’s the crack with all these labels dad? He started laughing –‘basically the Americans’ seem to lack common sense and have to be told everything however obvious they cannot think for themselves’ he said.

 

Everyone had huge satellite dishes in the gardens and nearly 100 channels to choose from –WOW I thought we had like 3, after 3 months I trying to find anything with substance I realised they were all just well **** – take away the news and documentary’s and it was like 70 channels of brain dead content – else either trying to sell you something or convert you to Christianity

 

Obviously The gulf war filled the papers along with gun crime above  and LAWSUITS- everyone was suing everyone for anything, my dad wanted to run a boat fishing business but he could not afford the insurance required for the amount of permutations  of immense stupidity  you had to account for it was all farcical really.

 

ON a daily basis there were newspapers articles about shootings – it was so commonplace it didn’t warrant headlines, back here it would have been major news; people would have been shocked at the level of violence and gun crime-‘They still think they are living in the Wild West and are Cowboys’ was my dad’s take-life seemed cheap and taking one was accepted.

 

Compared to our reserved ‘hidden top shelf magazines’ Porn was like everywhere-on pay for view  TV , strip clubs , and videos and magazines in average type shops , nudity was really accessible  to see compared to back home  and kind of seedy.

 

Always been into shooting and fishing, so was blown away at the amount of sporting stuff available at say Walmart, so much total rubbish you didn’t need to have fun, camouflage bog roll in different patterns sticks in my head – I caught every type of course fish with 2 rods – there they had a rod for every species it seemed – ‘it’s to lure the suckers in and catch the angler more’ my dad used to say.

 

Watching Political/ Evangelical stuff on TV, its format  reminded me of our Pantomime shows, incredibly insincere crass people, spouting total baloney-yet could get people into mob frenzy at the slightest thing – unreserved belief in what they were being told – if it is on TV it must be True –Praise the Lord and donations number below –well gullible race of people.

 

I tried buying a beer but was asked ID , as was under 21, however if I had a driving license could have bought a .44 Automag with 3 different barrels in S/S with attached scope and a 9mm MAC10 when I visited a gun show – how messed up is that I thought.

 

Was reading a car magazine on way home it had corvette on front cover – an American started saying how they produced best sports cars in the world – ‘Yes I said if you don’t go round any bends your cars can only go in straight lines’- had a row basically quoting the 911 took USA by storm as first decent handling car they experienced –but don’t let the facts get away of your brainwashed belief mate.

 

 

 

So no thanks Dad- want to go home to my country that has seemly unlimited amount of history, culture,  education ,  creative TV/radio , free thinking, non-brainwashed, dignified,  heathy people that could think for themselves – I kissed the tarmac when I got back to old Blighty I missed it  so much .

 

Now 30 years later we have basically adopted there culture – WHY? Is my question, our country was once a proud nation with our own identity envied the world over – a lot of people died to achieve that – it makes me want to weep.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I dont see the UK like this at all. 

[rimfire4969]

I love America. The world moves on even if you don't like it.

Once my youngest goes to Uni and leaves home my Wife and I will spend every February and some of March there. (Obviously after the Pheasant season)

[Harnser]

Over the years I have spent a lot of time in the USA as the other half of my family are American . I have found the Americans to be hard working and law abiding . Their generosity and hospitality Is unrivalled . I have spent many a day deer stalking in upper New York State and many a day salmon and trout fishing on the Great Lakes and on the niagara river just above the falls .

  When family have visited me they have been overwhelmed by the tradition and history of the United Kingdom ,some thing that they thought the USA lacked . When you get to know the yanks properly they are loverly people .

yes god bless America .

harnser

[jonny705]

Totally appreciate I was only around the Florida region at the time and a pretty insular view of the pretty big country –but it was what I remember when I was 21 at the time.

The things I thought were great for example:

The cheapness and availability to do anything like hobbies pastimes I thought was incredible –you could learn to scuba dive and it was peanuts -flying a plane was like a third of the price and an average Joe could afford it not like here.

If you wanted to eat well, like a king in fact you could food was really cheap unlike here.

The encouragement to achieve success and people admired you for it – here people are often jealous – you won’t find keyed luxury cars in the USA for example.

And the press people love success and people who achieve it, our press seem to love slating anyone the first time they trip up.

And whenever I think it’s quite blinkered or not they are proud of their country – history /War success-here we are now taught to be ashamed and forget about it.

But IMO we haven’t adopted any of the above points- we seem to adopt the bad.

In my previous post –

 Obesity problems big is beautiful diabetic kids are great?– yes just a bit.

Violent crime gang gun culture – yes.

Stupid OTT red tape for the simplest tasks which years ago would be common sense? Check.

Violent crime common place and not often  even headline news – yes.

Social media culture which promotes young girls to ‘sex’ themselves up on their profile pictures for more superficial likes – sex everywhere really as it will always sell –I think so.

More and more materialistic society which promotes debt/spending on superficial stuff when most of the time it’s not needed- we are massively in debt.

People believing the papers social media whatever they seem to say – I really think so the general British public seem to be a lot more gullible I think.

Suing culture we have embraced- come on now do I even have to explain that?

Channels full of total banal **** – Love Island Anyone

Remember though! Not saying I am right just thought might make an interesting topic to discuss – which is what I like about forum- I will always change my opinions if someone shows me a better way or educates me on something don’t know so everyone opinion is 100% valid in my book even if I don’t agree – that is what a debate is all about – different people views.

Scully - always think you come across as sound so totallly respect your views on this forum

[Scully]

3 minutes ago, jonny705 said:

Scully - always think you come across as sound so totallly respect your views on this forum

Well thankyou, that comes as a surprise!  I'm not saying I'm right, I just don't see the UK like that. I've never been to the states, but there is a lot about it I like. Friends who know me well, and have spent lengthy amounts of time there have told me I'd like it. 

[Smokersmith]

Generalisation (or generalization) will create a lot of debate.

You get extremes everywhere.

I like stuff over there, and over here. I don't like other stuff over there, and over here.

Ed Ball's recent documentary about Trump was IMHO very well done .....

[BritishShooting]

Drop me in America anytime, so many different states with so many different ways of living.

Florida is a tourist hotspot, compare it to the lovely British countryside and I'd have to agree but compare it to some parts of London I'd take Florida.

Give me the chance to live in some of the beautiful places America has to offer along with their local way of living I'd be out there in a shot.

[jonny705]

Yes i watched the first one and would love to go to that Redneck rally - also yeah that programme was a lot better than I thought - some real interesting views regarding trump.

I guess rather unfairly I picked up all the bad points about the States, but do really feel we have for whatever reason adopted a lot of their culture-and I don't think we needed to .

Don't think for one moment its all bad , but we had our own - which IMO is being diluted.

[The Burpster]

We have adpoted a lot of many countries bad habits, drug based gangs is not a monopoly of the US. Many countries have tha5 problem and that originates from the drug producing countries..... we are just the end game for some serious bad players. 

Obesity is a first world epidemic not just the USA and UK..... 

Stupidity is also a global problem, as is a legal system without morals that is happy to make a fortune out of representing the stupid! Sadly it’s just the US got there first. 

[Cranfield]

I think you need to visit a lot more of the USA than Florida, I suspect that most of those people in Disney and the fast food outlets were not even Americans. Having spent an enormous amount of time in the USA over the last 50 odd years and as recently as last Autumn,  I don't recognise the place you describe.

 

[stumfelter]

5 hours ago, The Burpster said:

Whilst I share some of your thoughts (bearing in mind I am dual National as my dad was a GI), if you only visited Florida then it’s bit like a tourist visting the UK and only going to Skegness or Blackpool in the summer. Florida is the Skegness of America....? a huge number of decent Americans have never been to Florida and have little need or intention to go there. 

If you had visited some of my relations in the Mid-west you will see that whilst everything it seems, is bigger and louder they share the same worries for their country as we do ours. Where life is genuinely harder there are far more ‘normal’ people. 

I bet it's been nice in Skegness with all the hot weather we've been having.

[The Burpster]

15 minutes ago, stumfelter said:

I bet it's been nice in Skegness with all the hot weather we've been having.

Fight city apparently (according to former colleagues!)..... ?

[jonny705]

Sorry if I came across a severe American bashing , kind of  realised after first comment and thinking how big and diverse the states are (and thinking of many documentary’s I have seen ) Florida was probably not the best place to maybe work/stay for  months when I was so young and impressionable. – Maybe the fact Florida was more of an older persons place as well.

 Disney land was the only tourist place I actually went really- and only because my Dads wife had never been and he didn’t want to go.

I would Love to visit Alaska as the wilderness side appeals to me a lot, and maybe could relate to the people better, I certainly would have gone to the Southern 4 x4rally if I was there.

Blackpool if the only place someone visited, would I guess look pretty bad as well – my memory was everyone drunk loads of shell suits –pub/nightclub toilets that you needed wellies to visit and offered out to fight more times than any ware else in my life – so yes would not be too good for a overseas visitor.

I still was speechless at the size of the people –I genuinely had never seen people that big in Uk- but the fast-food is so cheap and quick and All you can eat restaurants’ were in abundance- I could understand why you might easy end up overweight cheap food and incredibly cheap booze.

But still think we have adapted a lot of bad stuff –certainly blame culture which leads to H&S madness and warning stickers everywhere telling you common sense stuff.

Rap and the glorifying of gang culture is 100% from over there IMO though.

[Seadog1408]

Interesting ramblings but no factual evidence of anything really.

 

 

mike

[Deker]

I love the USA, current favourites are the North East (Maine coast) and pretty much anywhere in the mid-west (i spent some time in Indiana and met some great people there), however as people have said Orlando is pretty much touristville but if you try you can find a bit of history (St. Augustine is one of the oldest settlements in the area).

Saying that Orlando has it's place and I'm happy to say work are sending me there for a week next month so hello BassPro

[pinfireman]

21 hours ago, The Burpster said:

Whilst I share some of your thoughts (bearing in mind I am dual National as my dad was a GI), if you only visited Florida then it’s bit like a tourist visting the UK and only going to Skegness or Blackpool in the summer. Florida is the Skegness of America....? a huge number of decent Americans have never been to Florida and have little need or intention to go there. 

If you had visited some of my relations in the Mid-west you will see that whilst everything it seems, is bigger and louder they share the same worries for their country as we do ours. Where life is genuinely harder there are far more ‘normal’ people. 

Correct! 6 long visits over there in the last 10 years. 14 different states, mostly in the West and South West. Helpful, friendly, polite people.  Going to Florida is like going to a giant Disney World!. 

As for our decline, try loooking across the English Channel....

21 hours ago, RockySpears said:

  I think it just seems that way.  Yes there are a ton of mall and pointless shops, but they are attended only by a few, less well-off citizens.  All the Americans I know are pretty much OK, and I have worked for 2 American companies for 20 years.  I think what you saw was like walking round Stockton High St , lots of 3rd generation unemployed, all huddled in close proximity while most of us only go in when necessary and spend time "doing things" and visiting other places.  A good example is to walk through London, you could be in any 3rd world bazaar, Hookahs in the St., flowing robes in black, strange languages spoken.  You are in the UK, but it doesn't look or feel like it.

 

Try Durham or Carlisle, Keswick or Corbridge.  Britain still exists, but mostly it minds its own business, until it doesn't,

RS

Spot on comment!

20 hours ago, Harnser said:

Over the years I have spent a lot of time in the USA as the other half of my family are American . I have found the Americans to be hard working and law abiding . Their generosity and hospitality Is unrivalled . I have spent many a day deer stalking in upper New York State and many a day salmon and trout fishing on the Great Lakes and on the niagara river just above the falls .

  When family have visited me they have been overwhelmed by the tradition and history of the United Kingdom ,some thing that they thought the USA lacked . When you get to know the yanks properly they are loverly people .

yes god bless America .

harnser

Good comment!

[pinfireman]

20 hours ago, jonny705 said:

Totally appreciate I was only around the Florida region at the time and a pretty insular view of the pretty big country –but it was what I remember when I was 21 at the time.

 

The things I thought were great for example:

 

The cheapness and availability to do anything like hobbies pastimes I thought was incredible –you could learn to scuba dive and it was peanuts -flying a plane was like a third of the price and an average Joe could afford it not like here.

 

If you wanted to eat well, like a king in fact you could food was really cheap unlike here.

 

The encouragement to achieve success and people admired you for it – here people are often jealous – you won’t find keyed luxury cars in the USA for example.

 

And the press people love success and people who achieve it, our press seem to love slating anyone the first time they trip up.

 

And whenever I think it’s quite blinkered or not they are proud of their country – history /War success-here we are now taught to be ashamed and forget about it.

 

But IMO we haven’t adopted any of the above points- we seem to adopt the bad.

 

In my previous post –

 

 Obesity problems big is beautiful diabetic kids are great?– yes just a bit.

 

Violent crime gang gun culture – yes.

 

Stupid OTT red tape for the simplest tasks which years ago would be common sense? Check.

 

Violent crime common place and not often  even headline news – yes.

 

Social media culture which promotes young girls to ‘sex’ themselves up on their profile pictures for more superficial likes – sex everywhere really as it will always sell –I think so.

 

More and more materialistic society which promotes debt/spending on superficial stuff when most of the time it’s not needed- we are massively in debt.

 

People believing the papers social media whatever they seem to say – I really think so the general British public seem to be a lot more gullible I think.

 

Suing culture we have embraced- come on now do I even have to explain that?

 

Channels full of total banal **** – Love Island Anyone

 

Remember though! Not saying I am right just thought might make an interesting topic to discuss – which is what I like about forum- I will always change my opinions if someone shows me a better way or educates me on something don’t know so everyone opinion is 100% valid in my book even if I don’t agree – that is what a debate is all about – different people views.

 

Scully - always think you come across as sound so totallly respect your views on this forum

Take violent crime, and gang culture....the Yanks did not export it.....our government ALLOWED it! Our laws are made in Parliament, not in Washington, and it,s the failure of our lawmakers to crack down on violent crime!  Typical rubbish......"criminals have Human Rights, too".....NO, they do not!

19 hours ago, BritishShooting said:

Drop me in America anytime, so many different states with so many different ways of living.

Florida is a tourist hotspot, compare it to the lovely British countryside and I'd have to agree but compare it to some parts of London I'd take Florida.

Give me the chance to live in some of the beautiful places America has to offer along with their local way of living I'd be out there in a shot.

Me too! Anything to get away from what is happening to this country, particularly the imposition of "Diversity!"

15 hours ago, stumfelter said:

I bet it's been nice in Skegness with all the hot weather we've been having.

It,s a resort......the Last!

[pinfireman]

14 hours ago, jonny705 said:

Sorry if I came across a severe American bashing , kind of  realised after first comment and thinking how big and diverse the states are (and thinking of many documentary’s I have seen ) Florida was probably not the best place to maybe work/stay for  months when I was so young and impressionable. – Maybe the fact Florida was more of an older persons place as well.

 

 Disney land was the only tourist place I actually went really- and only because my Dads wife had never been and he didn’t want to go.

 

I would Love to visit Alaska as the wilderness side appeals to me a lot, and maybe could relate to the people better, I certainly would have gone to the Southern 4 x4rally if I was there.

 

Blackpool if the only place someone visited, would I guess look pretty bad as well – my memory was everyone drunk loads of shell suits –pub/nightclub toilets that you needed wellies to visit and offered out to fight more times than any ware else in my life – so yes would not be too good for a overseas visitor.

 

I still was speechless at the size of the people –I genuinely had never seen people that big in Uk- but the fast-food is so cheap and quick and All you can eat restaurants’ were in abundance- I could understand why you might easy end up overweight cheap food and incredibly cheap booze.

 

But still think we have adapted a lot of bad stuff –certainly blame culture which leads to H&S madness and warning stickers everywhere telling you common sense stuff.

 

Rap and the glorifying of gang culture is 100% from over there IMO though.

 

Rap and gang culture are glorified by the electronic media.......blame our media moguls, not the USA !

[rimfire4969]

I have been to Florida many times. Florida is comparable in size to England, have I done and seen everything in England no.

If you have been to Florida and only done Disney you are missing out on so much it has to offer, from fantastic national parks with wild Bison, Bears and Panthers to amazing beaches and fishing, reat towns, restaurants and bars. One of my favorites is floating in a tube down in a gin clear spring fed river so peaceful.

I love many of the States but Florida is a very special place for us.

[ditchman]

i worked in Florida...........what i found there were 2 Florida's.........

1. The coastal florida
2. the internal florida

the coastal population was a right old mix of money....old folk....country clubs...golf coarses...crime....drugs....poverty...mariners.$million dollar boats....filthy streets ...prisitine areas....posers....tossers....you name it was all there.............

then you moved to the internal florida..........totally different....just really nice hardworking country folk...who didnt eat out of takeways...were quite religous...would give you their last penny...and just soooooooo laid back....and always a smile on their face...........and they spoke with a sort of cornish accent.....using words like "thither and yonder".....

it was a real wrench to leave there.........but the coastline...you can take it and stick it...not for me or the people

[Gordon R]

Only a small example, but on Monday, my wife and I were having a coffee in McDonalds. We were approached by an American lady, who wanted to know how to get to the Coronation Street Tour. We were in Whitefield, about 6 miles from Media City and she had no address to find it.

We invited her to sit down whilst I Googled the tour. I had just reached the page, when a neighbouring couple said that they had found the postcode. She was chatting to my wife, whilst I Googled - she had come over to visit relatives in Blackpool, but was a Coronation Street fan. Armed with the postcode, we went to her rental car - she struggled with the Sat Nav - it was poor. Incidentally, the car hire company strong-armed her into have an automatic car, which she found funny. She said she drove a manual at home. She pumped in the Postcode and off she went. She said people had been so friendly, that she was staying on for a few more weeks.

Really nice woman who was not awed by travelling through some heavy traffic on unfamiliar roads, driving on the other side.

I thanked the other couple afterwards. It's not all doom and gloom.