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Red letter day - Pigeon shooting


tulkyuk
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This debate has been going for 4 pages - must be time for some thread deleting and an early Closure by the MODS ?????????

 

 

Why there is nothing like a good debate (and this is nothing like a good debate)

I thought it was a good bit of shooting and pest control even if it was by the skinny man (magman) and his bald mate (you):good::lol: :lol: ???

Good day was had you did the right thing by not damageing the crops any more,

 

Catch you both at the next meet up with a bit of luck.... ??? ??? ??? ???

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injured birds :good:

 

when decoying at 25 yrds mate there's not many injured birds

 

 

Why there is nothing like a good debate (and this is nothing like a good debate)

I thought it was a good bit of shooting and pest control even if it was by the skinny man (magman) and his bald mate (you)

Good day was had you did the right thing by not damageing the crops any more,

 

Catch you both at the next meet up with a bit of luck....

 

cheers big man :lol:

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If the farmer insisted on me to be unhumane and leave the injured birds, i would just give him the finger and find another farm.

but then again... ppl are different..

Yes and every other local farm would tell you to **** off too ! , its hard enough to get permission to shoot here, never mind giving farmers the finger.

 

Honestly, some people have no idea about what goes on in the real world :good:

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If the farmer insisted on me to be unhumane and leave the injured birds, i would just give him the finger and find another farm.

but then again... ppl are different..

Yes and every other local farm would tell you to **** off too ! , its hard enough to get permission to shoot here, never mind giving farmers the finger.

 

Honestly, some people have no idea about what goes on in the real world :good:

 

 

100% correct!

 

But if its between beeing unhumane to animals or getting "baned" from local farms becasue you are not allowed to kill the injured pigeons, i would go for the baned part.

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I've been watching this thread for a couple of days now and thought I'd add my twopenneth.

 

I'm with Tulkyuk and Magman :blink: My farmers would be furious if I went walking around through the crops to find a few pigeons and I know the local fox/badger population are doing ok out of it because I've found the carcasses near their holes.

 

As has already been said, it's hard enough to get permission even without upsetting the farmer, (and they DO talk to their neighbours).

 

Still, the problem wont be there in a few weeks time anyway, I see they've already started on the barley and rape up near Colchester :blink:

 

P.

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Shooting pigeons over standing crops , where you can't pick up all the shot birds, has been a fact of life for pigeons shooters for ever.

 

Every attempt is made to ensure clean kills and birds are picked, but a percentage has to be left, or you end up causing more damage to the crop than the pigeons.

 

Foxes, badgers, rats, etc will clear up the left birds, probably that same night , thats the way it works.

 

Everybody is entitled to their opinion and can make their own choices.

Its good to debate and discuss these differences of opinions, as long as its kept respectful.

There is no right or wrong on a lot of these issues, just opinions.

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im afraid it is all part of nature that some birds will be lost, but from our loss fox's benefit, as far as possible i double barrel on birds that i can see are dead or not on the way down. admittedly meat damdge but id rather bite an extra lead shot or two then leave birds in the standing wheat suffering. i doubt any sportsman or countryman would just leave birds in a field without picking them up or attempting to do so, but at the end of the day if the farmer is phoning you up telling you he needs them shot, you can't turn around and say sorry, i cant pick them all u so no thanks. a farmer would rather see a bird left in the standing wheat than you trampling across to find it, and its the farmers laws we must abide to they give us the permission. the way i look at it is if im not there shooting someone else will be, im sure we all try to pick every bird but it just doesn't happen some will be wounded and lost.

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Slight aside but how many of us stop before the trigger is pulled to think if the bird is going to fall where it can be picked ?

There are many who shoot without a dog and even with one not every bird can be accounted for, at the end of the day we all strive to kill instantly and put the pigeons to good use.

Mark birds that are winged and its not too tricky to put the gun down and dispatch them.

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'Your' farmers sound like a pretty mercenary lot :blink: Get booted off for not killin 'em all!! Nearly all the farmers I shoot for could not give two hoots about how many I actually kill, the impression I get from the farmer is that its about keeping the birds off, permanently is preferable otherwise sending them off to pastures new will suffice. As an old boy said to me, they've got to eat something, just make sure its somebody elses not mine!

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'Your' farmers sound like a pretty mercenary lot :unsure: Get booted off for not killin 'em all!! Nearly all the farmers I shoot for could not give two hoots about how many I actually kill, the impression I get from the farmer is that its about keeping the birds off, permanently is preferable otherwise sending them off to pastures new will suffice. As an old boy said to me, they've got to eat something, just make sure its somebody elses not mine!

 

No doubt like a lot of others I have read the conflicting posts on this one with some interest, and try to see both sides of the argument.

 

I personally try to pick all of the birds that I shoot for various reasons - to me it just seems right that I would do so, but everyone to their own as long as it does not affect me or the sport in general.

 

I've just come back from a fortnight's holiday, and have been checking up on things whilst I have been away.

 

Two characters turned up at one of my farms and asked could they shoot the pigeons on some laid barley, and I am sure that some can guess what's coming next.

 

They set up a hide on the other side of a hedge next to a road, took out a plank and flattened a substantial area of barley 10- 20 yards from their hide so that they had a nice large area to set up their two magnets on, and any pigeons could clearly see them.

 

They then proceeded to shoot any pigeons that came near - they hadn't got any dogs so that nothing other than on the laid area could be retrieved. When they had finished shooting they packed up and went, having told the farmer that they had shot c. 400 pigeons.

 

Well, they certainly had a good time as a shooting buddy of mine went afterwards and sent his spaniel in to collect some of the birds that they couldn't be bothered to collect - after 30 birds (half of which were wounded) he didn't have any more time and so had to go. I went this afternoon to have a look and the place stank to high heaven, with pigeon carcases all over the place. They had had a cracking afternoon's shooting and beggared off.

 

I'm not having a go at anyone with this post - what I have just described is an extreme example, but the anti's love to latch onto these for their purposes. If a farmer is screaming at you to get something done then you have to do the best that you can under the circumstances.

 

I don't have a dog at the moment and I will be visiting the same field as often as I can to scare the beggars off (pigeons that is) until I can really thin the local numbers out after combining, which can't be far off.

 

At the end of the day you have to keep the farmer happy, and sometimes it isn't an easy decision.

 

Don

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  • 2 weeks later...

Just found this topic after the issue was raised in another thread.

 

Interesting reading, and over the 5 pages or so it appears the "shoot what you can to please the farmer even if it can't always be picked" camp seem to have the majority.

 

I don't think there are two clear sides to the argument. There will ALWAYS be birds that can't be retrieved, whether they be pigeons, crows, pheasants, grouse, partridge, whatever over standing crops, woodland, drillings, stubble, maize etc etc... It's more about what percentage of what you shoot is it acceptable to leave behind? The 1% that you or the dog simply can't find? Or the 50% that you shot over standing crops which you don't try to retrieve?

 

I know we all shoot pigeons under the general licence to prevent damage to crops etc, but I am still a sportsman and I take no pleasure from killing a lot of pigeons and not retrieving them. I don't think any of us would claim they shot pigeons ONLY to control the damage they do - if it wasn't good sport then we wouldn't do it. Farmers would have to pay "pigeon catchers" like they do molecatchers etc! But we (generally) do it for free (or WE pay)! That must say something...

 

I also support the comments that our case for shooting is strengthened by the fact that what we shoot enters the food chain. To the antis, the argument of pest control doesn't wash - look how much good it did fox hunting. They will just say there are better/alernative ways to control pigeon numbers and shooting is still about toffs killing things for pleasure. If we can demonstrate that what we shoot ends up a plate then this adds a further dimension to our argument. Time after time the media poorly represent field sports, so anyone who thinks a press release from LACS or similar with photos/video of the "50 pigeons left dead or dying by blood thirsty shooters" wouldn't do us all harm is kidding themselves. Would the public care if the anti's were trespassing or they'd flattened a bit of wheat to get their photos? Of course they wouldn't!

 

Every now and then you hit a 50 yarder you are convinced is a runner and you dash out to dispatch it or send the dog, only to find it stone dead. Conversely, everynow and then there's 25yd bird you would have bet your mortgage was a clean kill, but is still alive when you pick it. If I leave 1% behind then I reduce the risk of leaving a runner. If I leave 50% behind there is a fair chance some of those birds won't be dead. I don't personally find that acceptable, so I shoot accordingly.

That doesn't mean to say I'll not shoot over laid crops, I'm just a bit more selective about where I set up and what I shoot at so I can do my best to make sure I retrieve as many as I possibly can. Maybe I'd only shoot at 7 out of 10 birds, whereas some others may shoot at 10/10. I'm comfortable with how I shoot (and the bags I achieve) and the farmers and estate over which I shoot are comfortable with how I shoot. I guess as long as everyone can say the same, then that's how it should be.

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