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Thomas Luke

Performance of 'traditional' vs 'eco' clays?

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    Hello,  

    I am undertaking some research into clay targets and in particular the performance of ‘traditional’ clay targets (i.e. those based on a mixture of coal tar pitch and limestone) and more modern ‘eco’ alternatives.

    I am very interested in the views of clay target shooters as to how the quality of both types of targets compare (e.g. do you tend to get more ‘no birds’ with eco-targets than traditional targets (or vice-versa), and is there a significant difference in how the targets ‘smoke’ when hit, or differences with other aspects of their performance?).  
     
    I thought it would be useful to post on this forum as I have undertaken literature review but there is a lot of conflicting information regarding the quality of the different target types.  Therefore it would be beneficial to have the views of the people on the ground, shooting the targets.
     
    Many thanks and I will very much appreciate any replies received.
     

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    From what I hear from a ground owner i know the new eco clays build up a coating on trap arms that causes issues if the arm isn't cleaned off pretty regularly with a wire brush ! 

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    5 minutes ago, salop sniper said:

    From what I hear from a ground owner i know the new eco clays build up a coating on trap arms that causes issues if the arm isn't cleaned off pretty regularly with a wire brush ! 

    Thanks for your reply. Is this a real nuisance or something quite easily dealt with? Are you able to provide more details on the types of issues (e.g. broken clays, damage to the trap etc..)?

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    We used them a little at my last ground the ones we where given couldn’t be driven at full spring as they broke.  Then another sample I was sent I dropped and it rolled on it’s rim down some stairs and didn’t break.  

    Seen some interesting testing that shows they are coming good slowly. 

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    There are a load of variations that need to be accounted for if trying to make an objective evaluation of an eco clay versus a traditional as there is already a load of variations in how traditional clays vary between manufacturer and even between the various ranges of clay targets from the same manufacturer.  As an example the Laporte 2004 (Grand Prix) range breaks better than the regular Laporte Competition range.

    However, the general consensus from most of the folk that I shoot with is that the eco clays seem to be a bit harder, they just don't break as well.

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    Tightchoke I was wondering the exact same thing reading it.

    even clays by the same company differ for the type of traps you have some need different mixtures so they don’t break on the arm as thrown. Never mind eco clays. 

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    Ah, NOW it makes sense, THIS will be the reason that all of the clays that shoot at remain intact. They are of course then easier to find and collect again,  'Eco Clays' eh  ? I shall be watching for them  !        :lol:

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    😂😂 unbreakable clays bit like the scotch video tapes of the 80’s use again and again. Very eco friendly. 

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    On 08/09/2018 at 08:12, TIGHTCHOKE said:

    What is the aim of your research?

     

    On 08/09/2018 at 18:56, figgy said:

    Tightchoke I was wondering the exact same thing reading it.

    even clays by the same company differ for the type of traps you have some need different mixtures so they don’t break on the arm as thrown. Never mind eco clays. 

    I wonder when Thomas will give us an answer?

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    So what was not eco friendly about a mix of coal tar and limestone? The manufacturing process?

    I'm always wary about people deciding XX product needs to be replaced, to replace it with something whose manufacturing process is way worse. A typical example is electronics, where the 'lead free solder' that is mandatory today requires a good 30% more energy to melt (that affects a LOT the price of the circuitboards) and make joints that are brittle and fail early&often -- forcing more landfill and wasting energy on recycling that wasn't needed in the first place.

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    Thanks to everyone who has commented, for your replies and interest.

    I noted a few comments asking about the purpose of the study. Essentially, there is a regulation at EU level which will mean that the manufacturing of targets which contain coal tar pitch will require a form of approval towards the end of 2020. To obtain this approval it is necessary to perform an assessment of whether alternatives are available or not – and whether they perform as well / are economical. I am undertaking research that will help with this assessment.

    As per my original post there is a lot of conflicting information regarding the quality of the different target types and I am now attempting to gather information from shooters. At the moment this is very generic (i.e. asking about ‘traditional’ versus ‘eco’ clays) but going forward I may put together an online questionnaire that is more detailed and specific.

    If this happens, I will provide further information on this forum so that anyone who is interested may participate.

    Kind regards

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    23 minutes ago, Thomas Luke said:

    Thanks to everyone who has commented, for your replies and interest.

    I noted a few comments asking about the purpose of the study. Essentially, there is a regulation at EU level which will mean that the manufacturing of targets which contain coal tar pitch will require a form of approval towards the end of 2020. To obtain this approval it is necessary to perform an assessment of whether alternatives are available or not – and whether they perform as well / are economical. I am undertaking research that will help with this assessment.

    As per my original post there is a lot of conflicting information regarding the quality of the different target types and I am now attempting to gather information from shooters. At the moment this is very generic (i.e. asking about ‘traditional’ versus ‘eco’ clays) but going forward I may put together an online questionnaire that is more detailed and specific.

    If this happens, I will provide further information on this forum so that anyone who is interested may participate.

    Kind regards

    Who are you conducting the research for?

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    2 hours ago, Thomas Luke said:

    Thanks to everyone who has commented, for your replies and interest.

    I noted a few comments asking about the purpose of the study. Essentially, there is a regulation at EU level which will mean that the manufacturing of targets which contain coal tar pitch will require a form of approval towards the end of 2020. To obtain this approval it is necessary to perform an assessment of whether alternatives are available or not – and whether they perform as well / are economical. I am undertaking research that will help with this assessment.

    As per my original post there is a lot of conflicting information regarding the quality of the different target types and I am now attempting to gather information from shooters. At the moment this is very generic (i.e. asking about ‘traditional’ versus ‘eco’ clays) but going forward I may put together an online questionnaire that is more detailed and specific.

    If this happens, I will provide further information on this forum so that anyone who is interested may participate.

    Kind regards

    I think you'd be far better placed to visit shooting grounds and get some facts .. different brands and versions of eco clays will really muddy the water.

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    My money's on some H&S dept looking for more stuff to write endless articles on🙄

    What's the betting that after spending thousands of pounds on research, we'll be told it's extemely hazardous to eat in excess of 52 clays in one sitting!

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    Standard clay can contaminate rape crop if they are used when it is in flower. This may seem unlikely but we have lost one of our ground because it really did happen to us. The land owner was threatened will a bill of millions by the mill because of it. On our current ground we are a lot more carefull where we throw the clays an what onto. 

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    On 16/09/2018 at 18:13, Harnser said:

    Maybe tin ones are the way to go . You listen for the ting if you hit them . They would last for ever . 

    Harnser

    Didn't webleys make a bean can launcher fired by a .22 blank for that very purpose? Id have one if i came across one. 

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