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Back bored 12bore - Fibre Game Cartridge.


Salop Matt
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Back to the OP's point ..

It's playing on your mind so beg/borrow a few shells and do some patterning.

I've just spent quite some time patterning my game gun (18.4mm), and found that 3/8 choke gives fantastic dense even patterns at 40 yards ... (average 220 pellets in the CSP 28g 6.5'!!, and 155 pellets from Golden Pheasant 32g 5's). This was consistently the best choice (better than 1/2 or 1/4)  across 4 brands, and gave me great confidence and results in the valleys of Yorkshire yesterday. 

When you KNOW the sweetspot of your gun/cartridge combo .. it's all then down to you ..

As for those who say just go and shoot .. I accept that getting the shot in the right place is the main priority, but having seen some gappy patterns through some of the combo's I would have used in the past, I'd rather know than leave it to chance.

 

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4 hours ago, Smokersmith said:

Back to the OP's point ..

It's playing on your mind so beg/borrow a few shells and do some patterning.

I've just spent quite some time patterning my game gun (18.4mm), and found that 3/8 choke gives fantastic dense even patterns at 40 yards ... (average 220 pellets in the CSP 28g 6.5'!!, and 155 pellets from Golden Pheasant 32g 5's). This was consistently the best choice (better than 1/2 or 1/4)  across 4 brands, and gave me great confidence and results in the valleys of Yorkshire yesterday. 

When you KNOW the sweetspot of your gun/cartridge combo .. it's all then down to you ..

As for those who say just go and shoot .. I accept that getting the shot in the right place is the main priority, but having seen some gappy patterns through some of the combo's I would have used in the past, I'd rather know than leave it to chance.

 

It's amazing just how much having the confidence in your equipment generates confidence in oneself to do it right. It's a shame if for the want of a couple of quid and a couple of hours at a pattern plate this is lacking.

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9 minutes ago, JRDS said:

Just out of interest which Beretta & Brownings are not Back Bored?

Neither of my (older) Berettas are.  In fact they are bored quite 'tight'.  The dimensions (inches) 9" forward of the breech face are;

  • SO6 made circa 1998.  Bottom .725, top .724
  • S57EL made circa 1975.  Original game barrels; Bottom .724, Top .723.  Skeet barrels; Bottom .725, Top .726
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Guest cookoff013

the wad is fireformed at the peak pressure, the peak pressure is measured at 1" in the chamber, 
a 12gauge chamber is around 800 tho or 810 (i forgot), but thats fireformed while in the shell held by the crimp.

so bore diameter unless silly a slight moot point.

i know some guns had problems with fibre wadded shells.

Edited by cookoff013
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4 hours ago, figgy said:

The new Browning Crown is nominal bore for fiberwads.

Hang on, back-boring is supposed to reduce recoil and improve patterns, etc, etc. Is someone now saying it's not such a good idea after all? What's going to happen to all these guns when some bright spark says you WILL use fibre - but excluding the clay range perhaps.

3 hours ago, cookoff013 said:

the wad is fireformed at the peak pressure, the peak pressure is measured at 1" in the chamber, 
a 12gauge chamber is around 800 tho or 810 (i forgot), but thats fireformed while in the shell held by the crimp.

so bore diameter unless silly a slight moot point.

i know some guns had problems with fibre wadded shells.

Less c.050" for the case. Both, c.810 at the back and c.800 at the front.

Edited by wymberley
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I have a lanber 12g and a Beretta al390 12 gauge. The lanber is tighter bored. I use both fibre and felt versions of the same cart and cannot tell any difference whatsoever in actual performance between fibre and plastic in either gun.

My observation is not from a pattern plate but from thousands of rounds fired at clays and pigeons   

No more birds are winged with fibre than plastic and clays break just as well out past 40 yards regardless. 

That said - each to their own. 

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8 hours ago, Smokersmith said:

Could you explain what that means please?

The wad does not stay the same shape upon firing. It is severely squashed, at circa normal pressures the wad gets totally squashed up to the shot and seals inside the hull/ chamber. Then when enough force has built up to pop the crimp, (enough force to move the shot). Then all the package, squashed up wad, shot charge is forced into the forcing cone, then into the tight barrel. Where the shot continues to be pushed out. The fibre wad takes a beating, 

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4 minutes ago, Smokersmith said:

Thanks Cookie ... my understanding is that the process with a plastic wad is similar, but with a 'flexible skirt' the base of a plaswad can act as a better 'gas seal', and give advantages that have led to it's widespread use.

Possibly the biggest advantage of the plastic wad is that it reduces damage to the shot and tends to both tighten the main pattern and reduce the number of 'fliers' that are well wide of the main pattern, often due to being misshapen due to contact with the barrel walls.

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2 minutes ago, figgy said:

As for better patterns yes less fliers but how much difference it makes in real world shooting im not sure.

I suspect most of us wouldn't notice the difference.  I have occasionally used plastic and fibre of the same type (in the case I remember Hull Comp X 21g) when I have been unable to get more fibre - and I have never noticed any difference.  I use fibre because the clays ground 'prefers' fibre where possible, and my game shooting insists on fibre.  I don't reload.

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10 minutes ago, Scully said:

Does any of this make a difference in practicalities? After all, if you put the pattern in the wrong place you'll miss. 

Having already been mentioned, I think we could take your latter point as a given. Regarding the first one, if you've just bought a shedful of  fibre cartridges and it turns out that they're an absolute disaster when shot through your gun which is back-bored, then, probably, the answer is yes.

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49 minutes ago, wymberley said:

Having already been mentioned, I think we could take your latter point as a given. Regarding the first one, if you've just bought a shedful of  fibre cartridges and it turns out that they're an absolute disaster when shot through your gun which is back-bored, then, probably, the answer is yes.

Not having read the rest of the thread, what constitutes a disaster? 

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9 minutes ago, Scully said:

Not having read the rest of the thread, what constitutes a disaster? 

I've just looked again to make sure and, yes, unfortunately I have deleted the photo's. If you've gone up through the chokes until you get to X full and you can't get tighter than an absolutely abysmal slightly open IC which shows both balling and crypto balling owing to the gas escape and you've just bought 2,000 of the cartridges in question, then I figure that this qualifies as a disaster.

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