CORBYN's Leaders Speech

[JohnfromUK]

1 hour ago, blackbird said:

The last two elections I did not even bother to vote & I will never vote again, no matter what party is in power they are all as corrupt as each other.

 

[SpringDon]

1 hour ago, Newbie to this said:

We're already bankrupt and have been for a considerable amout of time.

http://www.nationaldebtclock.co.uk

But Comrade Corbyn will probably triple that debt figure, he and his supporters seem to have an attitude of 'but who do we owe the money to?' Oh it's those pesky Jews, sorry, Zionists  is the word that Corbyn and his followers hide behind.

This says it all for me. It’s almost comical to talk of a few million extra for education or investing in infrastructure when 150 million a week disappears on interest payments.

It makes a nonsense of most political pronouncements on a looming financial crisis. The crisis is now and the fiat currencies are toast, they just haven’t stopped twitching yet.

[pinfireman]

7 hours ago, Vince Green said:

The thing is if Labour gets in they will bankrupt the country, everybody knows that, but they can blame it all on Brexit - and they will!

Brexit Blamers will be next big thing, its the perfect scapegoat for anything that ever goes badly in the future

How very true!

20 hours ago, JohnfromUK said:

Quote is from oowee not 12guage82 which has been automatically inserted wrongly

I am only happy to pay more taxes if it is more wisely spent - such as Health, Transport, Defence, the genuine disabled/injured.

It also means less on overseas 'aid' to nuclear and space capable countries, less on payments to the feckless and idle, less on super delux prisons, less on subsidies to 'so called green' energy and MUCH less on overpaid MPs and their 'expenses'.

 

Correct!

[pinfireman]

6 hours ago, blackbird said:

You can blame the Conservative Labour etc governments for everything under the sun it’s we the people that elect these party’s into power we voted into Europe many moons ago now we have voted to leave, many people still harp on about Enoch Powel & the speech he made about sending the foreigners back if you look back who brought then to these lands in the first place, I am afraid if Brexit goes tits up, Labour get in so be it, only thing I am grateful of I am not a youngster starting out in life as I think they are in for a rough old ride.

Enoch Powell NEVER made a speech about sending people back! That is total rubbish! He made a speech, much of which had  been taken out of context, regarding the alarming rate of immigration from the Third World.....and he was right to do so!  You can get ALL his speeches in a book, "Reflections of a Statesman - The speeches of Enoch Powell" which give a full and accurate account of what he said, NOT what his enemies implied he said. He also wrote a couple of books as to why we should not enter the Common Market, and when we did, a book on re-negotaiting our membership.....You can hear his "Rivers of Blood Speech" on You Tube.

5 hours ago, 12gauge82 said:

I agree and I think people need to get out of the thought process of you've got to choose between con or labour, I'd rather the monster raving loony party than those two if they won't listen to the public and deliver brexit for instance.

Then vote for the Raving Loonies..................BUT vote!  It took centuries of blood, sweat and tears to get universal suffrage.

4 hours ago, Newbie to this said:

The problem is that most Labour supporters have had it drummed into them from birth and reinforced through joining unions. I had a conversation during the week with my pub landlord, who was during his working life a member of a union and later a representative of the same union. The conversation started with no political party representing the ordinary working man anymore (not sure I can use that terminology), now I know he is Labour, so I said Labour may have used to when he was younger but now under Corbyn they are more a party for the student and those who wish not to work, a far cry from the working man's party, to which he agreed and then proceed to say he would never vote for Corbyn. I then asked who he would be voting for come the next general election as he obviously wouldn't be voting Labour as he did support Corbyn, I think you may have guessed it, he said he would be voting for his local Labour candidate, when I explained he would then in effect be voting for Corbyn, he couldn't see it.

I think most staunch Labour supporters think the same way, for them it is Labour or nothing.

The blind leading the blind!

[pinfireman]

4 hours ago, oowee said:

You have to love this forum at times. So 12g are you happy to pay more taxes or not 🤣

 

"I see no hope for the future of our people if they are dependent on frivolous youth of today, for certainly all youth are reckless beyond words... When I was young, we were taught to be discreet and respectful of elders, but the present youth are exceedingly wise [disrespectful] and impatient of restraint".

(Hesiod, 8th century BC)

"The world is passing through troublous times. The young people of today think of nothing but themselves. They have no reverence for parents or old age. They are impatient of all restraint. They talk as if they knew everything, and what passes for wisdom with us is foolishness with them. As for the girls, they are forward, immodest and unladylike in speech, behavior and dress."

(From a sermon preached by Peter the Hermit in A.D. 1274)

'The children now love luxury; they show disrespect for elders and love chatter in place of exercise. Children are tyrants, not servants of the households. They no longer rise when their elders enter the room. They contradict their parents, chatter before company, gobble up dainties at the table, cross their legs, and tyrannize over their teachers.'

(Commonly attributed to SOCRATES by Plato, according to William L. Patty and Louise S. Johnson, Personality and Adjustment, p. 277 (1953), but the NY Times (April 3, 1966, p16) only found a reference to the Mayor of Amsterdam, Gijsbert van Hall, following a street demonstration in 1966).

 

 

Vote for chaos and don't be surprised that chaos is what you get? 

So a vote for Corbyn is a vote for chaos? I thought so.............!

[oowee]

Hopefully a vote for Brexit was not a vote for Corbyn. 

[yod dropper]

19 minutes ago, oowee said:

Hopefully a vote for Brexit was not a vote for Corbyn. 

A tenuous link.  If anything the commentary about Corbyn's rise is that this is the follow on from the financial crisis and ensuing spending cuts.  

A vote for Blair was a vote for Brexit though.  Without trying to take us to the heart of Europe and opening up our borders to the new entrants and the mass migration that followed I doubt the referendum would have been won, let alone taken place; one of his best achievements even if it was an unintended consequence.

[TIGHTCHOKE]

2 minutes ago, yod dropper said:

A tenuous link.  If anything the commentary about Corbyn's rise is that this is the follow on from the financial crisis and ensuing spending cuts.  

A vote for Blair was a vote for Brexit though.  Without trying to take us to the heart of Europe and opening up our borders to the new entrants and the mass migration that followed I doubt the referendum would have been won, let alone taken place; one of his best achievements even if it was an unintended consequence.

Really?

[Gordon R]

Quote

If Corbyn gets in I will of course accept the result of democracy but i will look at the Brexit supporters as the cause.

This year's prize for a quantum leap in logic  - goes to …. You guessed right. I would blame the Remoaners, as they deserve something for all their ramblings.

Corbyn will never get in, unless the electorate take out their brain and declare Di Abbott as Miss UK in the World's most beautiful woman competition. It has nothing to do with Brexit, but still people blame Brexit for just about anything.

[oowee]

22 minutes ago, Gordon R said:

This year's prize for a quantum leap in logic  - goes to …. You guessed right. I would blame the Remoaners, as they deserve something for all their ramblings.

Corbyn will never get in, unless the electorate take out their brain and declare Di Abbott as Miss UK in the World's most beautiful woman competition. It has nothing to do with Brexit, but still people blame Brexit for just about anything.

Brexit is a leap to chaos. Corbyn is a leap to even more chaos. Quite simple even for those with brain disengaged. 

 

Edited September 28, 2018 by oowee

[oowee]

33 minutes ago, yod dropper said:

A tenuous link.  If anything the commentary about Corbyn's rise is that this is the follow on from the financial crisis and ensuing spending cuts.  

There is a similarity between the back lash of the disenfranchised turning to Corbyn and those trying to hold back the tide of globalism turning to Brexit. They are both a rejection of the status quo and a vote for change even where that change is not defined or does not stand upto scrutiny. 

[Gordon R]

Quote

Brexit is a leap to chaos.

Thanks for that valuable insight. Sadly, I cannot take your views seriously.

[norfolk dumpling]

The other dimension not explored to any great degree is Press intervention! They love chaos and fuel it at every opportunity. Especially BBC. A labour government is probably their top priority as Brexit will run out of steam soon but Corbyn and his lot will keep them going for another few years. God help us. My old dad always said never trust politicians, police and the Press - I would add priests to that list.

[oowee]

14 hours ago, Gordon R said:

Thanks for that valuable insight. Sadly, I cannot take your views seriously.

Your welcome. Thanks for your valued contribution.

[12gauge82]

17 hours ago, oowee said:

There is a similarity between the back lash of the disenfranchised turning to Corbyn and those trying to hold back the tide of globalism turning to Brexit. They are both a rejection of the status quo and a vote for change even where that change is not defined or does not stand upto scrutiny. 

How is brexit trying to hold back globalisum? The EU is the slowest growing major trade block in the world and only accounts for approximately 25% of world trade, being a member stops us trading with anyone else, getting rid of the EU leach opens the rest of the world to trade with, us Brexiteers are just little Englanders though!

[oowee]

4 hours ago, 12gauge82 said:

How is brexit trying to hold back globalisum? The EU is the slowest growing major trade block in the world and only accounts for approximately 25% of world trade, being a member stops us trading with anyone else, getting rid of the EU leach opens the rest of the world to trade with, us Brexiteers are just little Englanders though!

? we can trade with anyone we want except maybe North Korea, and the like. I am struggling to think of anywhere that we don't trade with. 

[12gauge82]

11 minutes ago, oowee said:

? we can trade with anyone we want except maybe North Korea, and the like. I am struggling to think of anywhere that we don't trade with. 

Any trade deals have to be negotiated on our behalf by the EU, we are not free to negotiate any ourselves, any negotiated by the EU are obviously going to be negotiated with the intention of being good for the EU as a whole and not necessarily for us. Once we leave, (if we really do) all that will change and we can strike deals with the whole world, including the EU if the want. EU membership is very small minded really.

[yod dropper]

40 minutes ago, oowee said:

? we can trade with anyone we want except maybe North Korea,

 

25 minutes ago, 12gauge82 said:

Any trade deals have to be negotiated on our behalf by the EU, we are not free to negotiate any ourselves, any negotiated by the EU are obviously going to be negotiated with the intention of being good for the EU as a whole and not necessarily for us.

Exactly, they won't be tailored to what we want.  Even in the EU there's no free market in services which I believe we're the second largest provider of in the world - even our own trade area doesn't favour us.

 

5 hours ago, 12gauge82 said:

us Brexiteers are just little Englanders though!

 

11 minutes ago, 12gauge82 said:

EU membership is very small minded really.

In the Victorian era Little Englanders were those who didn't think we could successfully project our power, that we were rather small and weak and who were in fact rather inward looking.  Now of course changing semantics gives it another meaning, often used as an insult dished out by some Remainers.  The irony is that they themselves would have been the Little Englanders in Victorian times.

 

What I fear is that we leave the EU, Corbyn's Labour comes to power and the economy crashes.  Just as it's been argued that we didn't in fact vote to leave, it's then successfully argued that it was Brexit and not their policies that were to blame and we re-join the EU.

[The Heron]

This is so old labour I have friends who have worked all there lives from scratch and have  built up a good company employing hundreds  of people and become very successful people and corbyn wants to punish people like this the labour party is the party of the bone idle and the work shy.

[panoma1]

If Corbins Labour Party do get into power, they will not have won it, the present Conservative government will have handed it to them by default!..........Their past record of governance, such as the imposing years of austerity on the people, the obscene redistribution of wealth,  the state of the NHS, The police service, Schools etc, the breakdown of law and order...........and with May as their leader, the Conservatives are now pretty much, for the ordinary voter, unelectable!............And there is no one else in a position to win a general election, let alone form a government! So perhaps we should "gird our loins" and prepare for the inevitable!

As an aside....I reckon Corbin and his hard left followers will not come out in support of remaining in the EU because when we're out, it gives them the freedom to implement policies that if the UK remained in, the EU/ECJ wouldn't allow them to!

[JohnfromUK]

1 hour ago, The Heron said:

This is so old labour I have friends who have worked all there lives from scratch and have  built up a good company employing hundreds  of people and become very successful people and corbyn wants to punish people like this the labour party is the party of the bone idle and the work shy.

Exactly

[Mice!]

I'm behind again, I certainly think the younger generation have got it harder, look at house prices theses days a three bed semi i bought twenty years ago for £43k is over a £100k now but wages in the area are pretty much the same?? Watching location location location last week maybe before, a couple had £700k and didn't think they would be able to afford a detached house 😯😯

I like a lot of others grew up making do, not many folk now a days seem to want to make do so pile up the debt , this made me my brother and sister aim higher and want more, i simply don't understand the folk who are happy making do on benefits rather than working, but these are the people who will happily vote for Comrad Corbyn.

[oowee]

3 hours ago, 12gauge82 said:

Any trade deals have to be negotiated on our behalf by the EU, we are not free to negotiate any ourselves, any negotiated by the EU are obviously going to be negotiated with the intention of being good for the EU as a whole and not necessarily for us. Once we leave, (if we really do) all that will change and we can strike deals with the whole world, including the EU if the want. EU membership is very small minded really.

So we agree that we can currently trade with anyone we want. The next bit is a trade deal. Of course the EU will negotiate such a deal for the benefit of all of it's members and we alone may well be able to negotiate a better deal independently and in quicker time than being part of the EU. Trade deals made by the EU are subject to veto by any member. All good so far.

The tough bit is what sort of trade deal we might want to agree with whom when we can currently buy and sell most things now. The things that we dont import or are currently import restricted are restricted for a reason. Those reasons will be standards, public and market protection. The larger our market the stronger our negotiating hand. The UK market is not as large as the EU so we start with a weaker negotiating position.

If we want to do trade deals we have to give to receive. What are we prepared to give? Want standards will we be prepared to relax? What home markets will we afford less protection? The restrictions are there for our benefit and I would argue that they are not far away from the existing rules put in place by the EU. Some would argue that we take a much more open market position but if we compete on price what will that do to the living standards in the UK? This will be good for business owners or investors but for workers? Far better to compete on quality standards and these are easier to enforce in a larger block. 

 

 

[Newbie to this]

6 minutes ago, oowee said:

So we agree that we can currently trade with anyone we want. The next bit is a trade deal. Of course the EU will negotiate such a deal for the benefit of all of it's members and we alone may well be able to negotiate a better deal independently and in quicker time than being part of the EU. Trade deals made by the EU are subject to veto by any member. All good so far.

The tough bit is what sort of trade deal we might want to agree with whom when we can currently buy and sell most things now. The things that we dont import or are currently import restricted are restricted for a reason. Those reasons will be standards, public and market protection. The larger our market the stronger our negotiating hand. The UK market is not as large as the EU so we start with a weaker negotiating position.

If we want to do trade deals we have to give to receive. What are we prepared to give? Want standards will we be prepared to relax? What home markets will we afford less protection? The restrictions are there for our benefit and I would argue that they are not far away from the existing rules put in place by the EU. Some would argue that we take a much more open market position but if we compete on price what will that do to the living standards in the UK? This will be good for business owners or investors but for workers? Far better to compete on quality standards and these are easier to enforce in a larger block. 

 

 

Just one question. Will it cost us £350 million a week to do these trade deals?

[oowee]

13 minutes ago, Newbie to this said:

Just one question. Will it cost us £350 million a week to do these trade deals?

No but it will cost us that in paper work.