Dave-G Posted October 20, 2018 Report Share Posted October 20, 2018 (edited) Shame our politians can't find the resolve to stop anyone preaching death in hellfire etc in public. I've sort of come to round to the idea there ought to be red lines about preaching killing and death in our freedom of speech laws without regard to who is speaking.... because it does seem to matter. There are many countries where he'd not be free to speak as he does here. Edited October 20, 2018 by Dave-G Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Delwint Posted October 20, 2018 Report Share Posted October 20, 2018 And that Dave, is because our country is full to the brim with do gooders and snowflakes!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eyefor Posted October 20, 2018 Report Share Posted October 20, 2018 (edited) Suggestion.. Send him to the Saudi Embassy in Istanbul? Except, I suppose, with freedom of speech that includes things most don't like? Edited October 20, 2018 by Eyefor Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yellow Bear Posted October 20, 2018 Report Share Posted October 20, 2018 (edited) 19 minutes ago, Delwint said: our country is full to the brim with do gooders and snowflakes!! Who are only too keen to push the "rights" of some minorities (which suit them) and pillory others (us for instance) Edited October 20, 2018 by Yellow Bear Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnfromUK Posted October 20, 2018 Report Share Posted October 20, 2018 29 minutes ago, Yellow Bear said: Who are only too keen to push the "rights" of some minorities (which suit them) and pillory others (us for instance) If you are; white, 'mainstream' religion, 'behaviours' and culture have a 'living', either from hard work, pension, or have savings speak and understand English adequately have pride and are uncomplaining are truthful then the state will do its best to extract as much as it can from you in return for nothing. If you are; an ethnic minority, minority 'group' or culture have (or pretend to have) limited funds, either from not working (or at least claiming you aren't), no pension, or no savings don't speak or understand English well (or at least give that appearance) have the brass neck to try it on and complain at every opportunity are either untruthful, or at least very economical with the truth then the state will do its best to shower you with benefits and handouts as much as it can to you in return for nothing. If you are straight and honest - you will loose out; if you are prepared to 'try it on' - you will very likely be rewarded. The state penalises those who do their best to look after themselves and rewards those who make no effort. Sad, but largely true. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
12gauge82 Posted October 20, 2018 Report Share Posted October 20, 2018 1 hour ago, JohnfromUK said: If you are; white, 'mainstream' religion, 'behaviours' and culture have a 'living', either from hard work, pension, or have savings speak and understand English adequately have pride and are uncomplaining are truthful then the state will do its best to extract as much as it can from you in return for nothing. If you are; an ethnic minority, minority 'group' or culture have (or pretend to have) limited funds, either from not working (or at least claiming you aren't), no pension, or no savings don't speak or understand English well (or at least give that appearance) have the brass neck to try it on and complain at every opportunity are either untruthful, or at least very economical with the truth then the state will do its best to shower you with benefits and handouts as much as it can to you in return for nothing. If you are straight and honest - you will loose out; if you are prepared to 'try it on' - you will very likely be rewarded. The state penalises those who do their best to look after themselves and rewards those who make no effort. Sad, but largely true. I agree with a fair bit of this, I think there is real anger growing in many Weston countrys due to the perception that if your an average citizen you'll get screwed and your rights are unimportant. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnfromUK Posted October 20, 2018 Report Share Posted October 20, 2018 Just now, 12gauge82 said: I agree with a fair bit of this It is difficult to put into words clearly - without seeming either racist, bigoted, or extreme - none of which I am. 2 minutes ago, 12gauge82 said: due to the perception that if your an average citizen you'll get screwed and your rights are unimportant. I don't think it is just a perception; it is a fact. Mr Choudray is living for 'free', probably never having contributed to NI or PAYE Tax systems. I believe Mrs Choudray and family live in a state supplied house and on benefits - in 2013 Mr Choudray took home more than £25,000 a year in benefits and lived in a £320,000 house in Leytonstone, East London - which is where I understand his family still live. He actually called benefits the "Jihadi's allowance". See this https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2279972/Anjem-Choudary-Hate-preacher-pocketing-25-000-year-benefits-calls-fanatics-live-state.html Mr Average, on the other hand pays his taxes - and this is how he sees them spent! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
henry d Posted October 20, 2018 Report Share Posted October 20, 2018 15 minutes ago, JohnfromUK said: It is difficult to put into words clearly - without seeming either racist, bigoted, or extreme - none of which I am. I don't think it is just a perception; it is a fact. Mr Choudray is living for 'free', probably never having contributed to NI or PAYE Tax systems. I believe Mrs Choudray and family live in a state supplied house and on benefits - in 2013 Mr Choudray took home more than £25,000 a year in benefits and lived in a £320,000 house in Leytonstone, East London - which is where I understand his family still live. He actually called benefits the "Jihadi's allowance". See this https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2279972/Anjem-Choudary-Hate-preacher-pocketing-25-000-year-benefits-calls-fanatics-live-state.html Mr Average, on the other hand pays his taxes - and this is how he sees them spent! Nice link, its 5 years out of date. AC is living in a bail hostel, he is being watched and has had his funds seized. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnfromUK Posted October 20, 2018 Report Share Posted October 20, 2018 1 minute ago, henry d said: Nice link, its 5 years out of date. It is 5 years out of date, but I believe Mrs Choudray is still living either there - or under similar state funded conditions (which is normal when the so called 'bread winner' is in prison) 3 minutes ago, henry d said: AC is living in a bail hostel, he is being watched and has had his funds seized. He is, and at the state's expense, and the watching doesn't come cheap either. I don't know what funds he had to seize, but as he seems to have been living on a large benefits package before his sentence, I assume he actually had little or no funds to seize. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
henry d Posted October 20, 2018 Report Share Posted October 20, 2018 (edited) So he isn`t still living there and he isn`t getting benefits then is he? He has to be restricted of some of his liberty as he is on license, so we fund it as we did when he was in jail. Edited October 20, 2018 by henry d typo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnfromUK Posted October 20, 2018 Report Share Posted October 20, 2018 1 minute ago, henry d said: So he isn`t still living there I assume he will be allowed to return there as his 'family home' when his 6 month bail hostel period has ended. 2 minutes ago, henry d said: he isn`t getting benefits then is he? He is living fully at the taxpayers expense - so is effectively on benefits. His family is (presumably) still on benefits. I have an objection - and a strong one, as I think many do - to funding from the state people who wish to see our state as it is now overthrown. Choudray has called for the ISIS black flag to be flown over Buckingham Palace and Downing Street, and for the Queen to have to wear an Islamic style veil. I object strongly to those sort of ideas and having to fund people (and their families who are of similar views) who expound those ideas. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lloyd90 Posted October 20, 2018 Report Share Posted October 20, 2018 5 hours ago, Rewulf said: And make him a martyr ? A figurehead for up and coming jihadis , a hero for radical islamists in the UK ? Even if he died in a real accident, or cancer , you would get plenty of people who look up to such scum, and believe the security services were to blame. Removing him could potentially cost this country much more. Exactly what I meant. He could disappear at any time, but we choose not to. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Delwint Posted October 20, 2018 Report Share Posted October 20, 2018 17 minutes ago, Lloyd90 said: He could disappear at any time, but we choose not to. Where’s Paul Daniels when you need him!! 😉 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muddy Funker Posted October 21, 2018 Report Share Posted October 21, 2018 He's a person they need to do some sort of black op on. As in he disappears, for good. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scully Posted October 21, 2018 Report Share Posted October 21, 2018 All those who think he should be bumped off; you do realise you’re advocating state sponsored assassination? Think about it. Like the Saudis? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave-G Posted October 21, 2018 Report Share Posted October 21, 2018 (edited) 1 hour ago, Scully said: All those who think he should be bumped off; you do realise you’re advocating state sponsored assassination? Think about it. Like the Saudis? I think all the acceptable alternatives have been exhausted to be fair. He is totally determined to abolish our beliefs and customs to convert our country into an Islamic cesspit. I think it would be acceptable to most as a very last resort because SOMETHING needs to be done about him - and playing nice isnt getting it done. We can't afford to throw millions at his kind. Edited October 21, 2018 by Dave-G Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scully Posted October 21, 2018 Report Share Posted October 21, 2018 4 hours ago, Dave-G said: I think all the acceptable alternatives have been exhausted to be fair. He is totally determined to abolish our beliefs and customs to convert our country into an Islamic cesspit. I think it would be acceptable to most as a very last resort because SOMETHING needs to be done about him - and playing nice isnt getting it done. We can't afford to throw millions at his kind. So what do you suggest? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TriBsa Posted October 21, 2018 Report Share Posted October 21, 2018 34 minutes ago, Scully said: So what do you suggest? Allow him his wished for Islamic Caliphate, on the island of Rockall. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scully Posted October 21, 2018 Report Share Posted October 21, 2018 3 minutes ago, TriBsa said: Allow him his wished for Islamic Caliphate, on the island of Rockall. Sorry, I thought we were being serious. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnfromUK Posted October 21, 2018 Report Share Posted October 21, 2018 39 minutes ago, Scully said: So what do you suggest? I don't know the details of his nationality/circumstances, but I assume he hold a British passport, and so can't easily be deported (unless requested by another nation to face charges there). I would like to see him removed from the present conditions where he is living at the expense of a state he wishes to see overthrown. I note that it is now reported that he is hoping to obtain legal aid to challenge the restrictions that have been placed on him in his current post release period. He is simply making a nonsense of our (admittedly dismal) legal system, and he and his family are freeloading on the state (taxpayers) here. I am not advocating state sponsored (or indeed vigilante actioned) assassination. I do think our laws need amending to ensure that these type of people who live as free loaders at the state's expense whilst advocating illegal action (including terrorism) against the state can be tackled and prevented from further actions against us - either by long term incarceration in a very austere and tough prison system or deportation to one of the countries that operate the regime they would like to introduce here. I do not believe this will ever be achieved, but it is what I would like to see happen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scully Posted October 21, 2018 Report Share Posted October 21, 2018 His nationality is British. He isn’t going anywhere. Freedom of speech is a very very complicated issue, and any suggestions we may have regarding his treatment have to be balanced against how that treatment could equally be applied to anyone, including you or I, or our children, once it becomes legitimate. We are better than them in every way conceivable, and we have to be seen to be so. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon R Posted October 21, 2018 Report Share Posted October 21, 2018 Scully - got to agree. I would like existing laws applied with the same zeal that Tommy Robinson found to his cost. Whilst he does talk sense, he also attracts trouble. We seem very slow to tackle hate preachers head on, for fear up upsetting someone. I don't care about colour, religion or origin, there is no excuse for what they are allowed to get away with. Before anyone points out that he has served time - it is a fraction of what I would advocate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave-G Posted October 21, 2018 Report Share Posted October 21, 2018 2 hours ago, Scully said: So what do you suggest? I did that earlier in this thread, with the knowledge that attempts to shut him up with acceptable methods have clearly not done the job. Significantly harsher methods to shutdown his subversive attempts to overthrow the country need to be deployed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnfromUK Posted October 21, 2018 Report Share Posted October 21, 2018 45 minutes ago, Scully said: Freedom of speech is a very very complicated issue, Sadly, in this case an issue that he is cleverly able to use against our best interests (in my opinion). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
guzzicat Posted October 22, 2018 Report Share Posted October 22, 2018 Well I for one think he should have been released earlier, nine months before his birth to be precise! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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