ditchman Posted June 11, 2019 Report Share Posted June 11, 2019 soooooo vettle got a 5 sec penelty...giving hamilton the 1st place............ results... hamilton vettle le clerc but as leclerc was 4.6 secs behind...why isnt he now in 2nd place ?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
figgy Posted June 11, 2019 Report Share Posted June 11, 2019 If le clerc was 4.6 behind Vettel when the race ended then he should be second place. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon R Posted June 11, 2019 Report Share Posted June 11, 2019 (edited) Hamilton was 2 seconds behind Vettel, but the 5 points put him three ahead. Le Clerc was over 9 seconds behind Vettel. Edited June 11, 2019 by Gordon R Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B725 Posted June 11, 2019 Report Share Posted June 11, 2019 Wasn't he 4.6 behind Hamilton Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sprinter Posted June 11, 2019 Report Share Posted June 11, 2019 At the flag vet was 1.4 ahead of ham. Lec was 4.6 behind ham. Vet penalty dropped him 3.6 behind ham slotting him between ham and Lec....... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon R Posted June 11, 2019 Report Share Posted June 11, 2019 Yes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ditchman Posted June 11, 2019 Author Report Share Posted June 11, 2019 all confusing cause on the race results it states ..leclerc +4.6 secs.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pigeon Shredder. Posted June 11, 2019 Report Share Posted June 11, 2019 Does anyone really care 🙄 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShootingEgg Posted June 11, 2019 Report Share Posted June 11, 2019 Vetel lost control due to pressure from Hamilton, saved it but then got a penalty for something he had no control over, personally I don't think a penalty was needed Ditchman you are right though they explained it poorly as they said leclerc was 4.6sec behind, but as stated that was behind Hamilton, so over 5 seconds behind vetel. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Agriv8 Posted June 11, 2019 Report Share Posted June 11, 2019 My view The Stewards had to act. Vetel was either guilty of not rejoining the track safely after leaving the track or sqweezing Hamilton off so he could not get track position for next corner he knew Hamilton would have a higher exit speed as he had stopped on track. the stewards have virtually live data to driver inputs to the F1 car so they have a reasonably good idea What the driver is trying to get the car to do. even if it’s a 50 / 50 decision you can’t be pressured into making a mistake cut the corner rejoin then defend your racing line because the other driver has followed the track. watched Hamilton wet Donnington in formula Renault ( was a mechanic for Clio team ) love him or hate him the boy could drive. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hamster Posted June 11, 2019 Report Share Posted June 11, 2019 Margins are tight in F1, Vettel lost control under pressure and did what other "win at all cost drivers" do with zero regard to fairness or safety, think Schumacher winning the World Championship by deliberately running a broken car unto Hill's path (it paid off and he wasn't disqualified or even penalised - travesty), think Schumacher parking his beached Ferrari in the middle of Monaco during quali, think Schumacher almost killing Barrichelo by brushing him off the track, think Schumacher 1997 when leading by a single point he tried to do a "Damon 94" to Villeneuve (didn't pay off this time I'm happy to say) despite never being a Jacques fan. I'm no Lewis fan either and won't deny I hold Vettel in below average regard in sportsmanship and well shy of the label of a Great BUT as hard as this decision was on him I think it was right and just because he's got away with poor behaviour one too many times and in this particular incident he most definitely DID place his car in harms way on purpose, play the thing slomo and you'll see no attempt is made to guide the tyres off the racing line (as he's supposed to do following an off), the car had shed enough speed for the its momentum to be controllable enough to leave Lewis room. Win some lose some. None times out of ten I agree with Coulthard but not here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisjpainter Posted June 11, 2019 Report Share Posted June 11, 2019 My issues with it are that it killed 20 laps of racing and I'm not sure the punishment fitted the crime. The moment Vettel went onto the grass he had three options: Hard turn into the skid immediately, but that would have spun the car and probably taken Hamilton out as he came round the bend Do nothing, slam straight into the wall ruining his race, littering the track with debris and probably taking out Hamilton with something - bits of car or the car itself what he did, wait until the skid became controllable then pull out of it and pull away. This meant cutting Hamilton up unfairly (perhaps not so unsafely though) Out of the three, he was right in what he did. It was his mistake (although apparently what caused it was the back of the car not responding to the front - i.e. a tyre issue? anyone else hear that?) but a 5 second left for a fairly pointless end to an already dreadfully dull race. I think he should have been given the choice of giving the place to hamilton or a 5 second penalty at the end. At least then he could have had 15 laps to go full attack mode to try and get his win back, rather than Hamilton having nothing to do except mark Vettel and take an easy, tedious win. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hamster Posted June 11, 2019 Report Share Posted June 11, 2019 10 minutes ago, chrisjpainter said: My issues with it are that it killed 20 laps of racing and I'm not sure the punishment fitted the crime. The moment Vettel went onto the grass he had three options: Hard turn into the skid immediately, but that would have spun the car and probably taken Hamilton out as he came round the bend Do nothing, slam straight into the wall ruining his race, littering the track with debris and probably taking out Hamilton with something - bits of car or the car itself what he did, wait until the skid became controllable then pull out of it and pull away. This meant cutting Hamilton up unfairly (perhaps not so unsafely though) Out of the three, he was right in what he did. It was his mistake (although apparently what caused it was the back of the car not responding to the front - i.e. a tyre issue? anyone else hear that?) but a 5 second left for a fairly pointless end to an already dreadfully dull race. I think he should have been given the choice of giving the place to hamilton or a 5 second penalty at the end. At least then he could have had 15 laps to go full attack mode to try and get his win back, rather than Hamilton having nothing to do except mark Vettel and take an easy, tedious win. You have an interesting point about "forced lead swap" with Hamilton but I'm afraid I believe there was an easily doable option 4 - accept he'd made an error and at least leave Hamilton enough room, it is possible that had he done so Lewis may have still struggled to pass and keep his place but in physically guiding the entire car from one side of the track to the other he left the stewards no real option. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pistol p Posted June 11, 2019 Report Share Posted June 11, 2019 what would Niki Lauda have done/said? He used to have a foot in both camps. Jackie Stewart has passed verdict, correctly. The race was won before it finished, the stewards handed the victory to a man who stopped racing and happily took it. It was pathetic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisjpainter Posted June 11, 2019 Report Share Posted June 11, 2019 35 minutes ago, Pistol p said: what would Niki Lauda have done/said? He used to have a foot in both camps. Jackie Stewart has passed verdict, correctly. The race was won before it finished, the stewards handed the victory to a man who stopped racing and happily took it. It was pathetic. Yup. Once again F1 shooting itself in the foot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cuffy Posted June 13, 2019 Report Share Posted June 13, 2019 So , vettel made a mistake and in front of him was a wall . out of shape a bit , this could have ended badly . Hamilton was behind and could see it going a bit pete tong . he could of backed off a bit but chose to carry on , potentially driving straight into a crashing car . as it happens no one got hurt , some dummys got spat - crack on . It says on the ticket " motor sport is dangerous " Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hedge Posted June 13, 2019 Report Share Posted June 13, 2019 I think that anyone who tries to 2nd guess and/or criticise what happened on the track should stick to their armchair F1. As a non-expert, non-F1 driver with only my `intermediate motorway driving` rosette, my view is this: Vettel did what he did Lewis did what he did. The stewards did what they did. IMHO - if they can make the decision to give a 5 second penalty with 20 laps to go, why can't they just tell Vettel to give the place back and let them race on the track to the flag? Even if Lewis does pull off into the distance. At least they are stlil racing. Totally agree that it ruined the race and isn't good for the sport. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hamster Posted June 13, 2019 Report Share Posted June 13, 2019 Vettel made a clear and visible mistake and went off the track, he further compounded it by NOT staying off the racing line as he's supposed to do, it is not for the stewards to impose the penalty in such a way as to affect the outcome, they simply awarded the minimum 5 second penalty as they saw fit. To have done nothing would have been unfair. There was 20 laps left to run and anything could have happened, races have been won on the final lap on several occasions, Hamilton won his first Championship on the closing seconds of the final race ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisjpainter Posted June 13, 2019 Report Share Posted June 13, 2019 4 hours ago, Hamster said: Vettel made a clear and visible mistake and went off the track, he further compounded it by NOT staying off the racing line as he's supposed to do, it is not for the stewards to impose the penalty in such a way as to affect the outcome, they simply awarded the minimum 5 second penalty as they saw fit. To have done nothing would have been unfair. There was 20 laps left to run and anything could have happened, races have been won on the final lap on several occasions, Hamilton won his first Championship on the closing seconds of the final race ! True, but usually only when someone needed to do something, or someone was forced into a mistake. Hamilton didn't have to do anything, and didn't pressurise Vettel into making another mistake so he could pass him. All he had to do was not crash for 20 laps. It was hardly motorRACING, more like motorprocessioning, like so many races of late Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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