motty Posted July 22, 2019 Report Share Posted July 22, 2019 22 hours ago, JRDS said: Great idea posting that on Facebook after all the issues we have had with the GL and the fact it will be reviewed again for 2020, moronic madness. I completely disagree with you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harnser Posted July 22, 2019 Report Share Posted July 22, 2019 22 hours ago, JRDS said: Great idea posting that on Facebook after all the issues we have had with the GL and the fact it will be reviewed again for 2020, moronic madness. We are sometimes our own worst enemy’s . harnser Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motty Posted July 22, 2019 Report Share Posted July 22, 2019 34 minutes ago, Harnser said: We are sometimes our own worst enemy’s . harnser So you think that someone showing the huge amount of pigeons that are attacking crops is harmful to shooting? To my mind, this only strengthens our position. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JDog Posted July 22, 2019 Report Share Posted July 22, 2019 7 minutes ago, motty said: So you think that someone showing the huge amount of pigeons that are attacking crops is harmful to shooting? To my mind, this only strengthens our position. Agreed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hamster Posted July 22, 2019 Report Share Posted July 22, 2019 Blimey that's twice in one month we've agreed JDog. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JDog Posted July 22, 2019 Report Share Posted July 22, 2019 7 minutes ago, Hamster said: Blimey that's twice in one month we've agreed JDog. I know. Never again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harnser Posted July 22, 2019 Report Share Posted July 22, 2019 26 minutes ago, motty said: So you think that someone showing the huge amount of pigeons that are attacking crops is harmful to shooting? To my mind, this only strengthens our position. There are none so blind as those who don’t want to see . Any pictures of shot game and pests are not good for the future of shooting . The antis will pick up on the pictures and use them in their propagande war against us . Yes we are sometimes our own worst enemy’s . Harnser Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
old'un Posted July 22, 2019 Report Share Posted July 22, 2019 The problem is, we as shooters can see and understand why these birds need controlling, but I can see Harnser’s point. If the antis did get hold of this picture they would display it with the heading, ‘thousands of song birds murdered for sport’ we know its not true but joe public will believe anything. Mind you I think there’s so many pictures already out there, it would now be a case of bolting the stable door etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JRDS Posted July 22, 2019 Report Share Posted July 22, 2019 2 hours ago, motty said: So you think that someone showing the huge amount of pigeons that are attacking crops is harmful to shooting? To my mind, this only strengthens our position. They weren't shot attacking Crops though were they! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JRDS Posted July 22, 2019 Report Share Posted July 22, 2019 1 hour ago, Harnser said: There are none so blind as those who don’t want to see . Any pictures of shot game and pests are not good for the future of shooting . The antis will pick up on the pictures and use them in their propagande war against us . Yes we are sometimes our own worst enemy’s . Harnser Yes after our recent issues just pouring petrol on the fire, absolutely crazy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JDog Posted July 22, 2019 Report Share Posted July 22, 2019 5 minutes ago, JRDS said: They weren't shot attacking Crops though were they! I simply cannot take you seriously but before my views become entrenched could you please provide links to some of your posts reporting some of your shooting outings? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JRDS Posted July 22, 2019 Report Share Posted July 22, 2019 (edited) I don't post about my shooting outings, I don't feel the need or to post pictures. I really don't care whether you take me seriously or not but this is PR Heaven for Packhams brigade and the GL's are up for review again at year end. Anyone not involved with shooting would say as Laymen or women that these birds were not shot whilst damaging crops, something that would have been illegal under the NE Licences. That is a fact whether you like it or not. I fully intend to be shooting over stubbles shortly when they become available but I won't post about in on a Public Forum that anyone can join or post pictures. Edited July 22, 2019 by JRDS Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marsh man Posted July 22, 2019 Report Share Posted July 22, 2019 2 hours ago, Harnser said: There are none so blind as those who don’t want to see . Any pictures of shot game and pests are not good for the future of shooting . The antis will pick up on the pictures and use them in their propagande war against us . Yes we are sometimes our own worst enemy’s . Harnser I just wondered how some of us would feel if a photo was posted of a bag of 100 Canada Geese ( 1/10 th of the bag of pigeons ) that were shot on a grass field next to a golf course , with a title , shot before they coursed any damage to the golf greens , I don't think it would go down well with most members , more so with those involved with wild fowling . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motty Posted July 22, 2019 Report Share Posted July 22, 2019 2 hours ago, JRDS said: They weren't shot attacking Crops though were they! I reckon they had eaten their fair share over the last few weeks. Don't you? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motty Posted July 22, 2019 Report Share Posted July 22, 2019 2 hours ago, JRDS said: Yes after our recent issues just pouring petrol on the fire, absolutely crazy. This particular shooter killed over 20000 pigeons last year. I would say pigeons are a bit of a problem in his part of the country! In what way is showing how much of a problem they are, going to hurt us? Perhaps we should just shut this site down, just in case a few antis might get upset! Perhaps if we all pretend we have given up pigeon shooting, then all the antis will go away! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harnser Posted July 22, 2019 Report Share Posted July 22, 2019 1 hour ago, motty said: This particular shooter killed over 20000 pigeons last year. I would say pigeons are a bit of a problem in his part of the country! In what way is showing how much of a problem they are, going to hurt us? Perhaps we should just shut this site down, just in case a few antis might get upset! Perhaps if we all pretend we have given up pigeon shooting, then all the antis will go away! With comments like that you are not doing the shooting community any favours . harnser Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
243deer Posted July 23, 2019 Report Share Posted July 23, 2019 The day that we feel we should have to apologise in any way for shooting pigeons (or any other vermin) to protect crops is the day we should all pack up and go home. I was once part of a team culling a significant number of rabbits at harvest time. We had antis call the police and some local residents looking on in 'horror' at what we were doing along with the usual sound bites. The police only made a phone call to check who we were and once the minority of antis had left we then had a vast majority of folk coming out to say hi and ask if they could have some rabbits! We duly gutted a few for them, of course. We should not generalise about the gullibility of the public and assume that an image will suddenly sway a huge majority of them into becoming rabid antis. It will sway some, undoubtedly, those who struggle to have independent thoughts and love jumping on bandwagons in order to feel part of a gang. On the other hand there are tens of thousands of gardeners out there who are definitely not friends of the pigeon who will wholeheartedly agree with keeping numbers down. Now is not the time to hide ourselves behind a camo net. It is time to keep telling everyone what we do and importantly, keep educating folk as to why we do it. We need as much positive re-enforcement in as many places as possible on social media in order to counter the anti's. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JDog Posted July 23, 2019 Report Share Posted July 23, 2019 Good post 243deer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hamster Posted July 23, 2019 Report Share Posted July 23, 2019 24 minutes ago, JDog said: Good post 243deer. 👍 I thought you said never again. 😂 33 minutes ago, 243deer said: The day that we feel we should have to apologise in any way for shooting pigeons (or any other vermin) to protect crops is the day we should all pack up and go home. I was once part of a team culling a significant number of rabbits at harvest time. We had antis call the police and some local residents looking on in 'horror' at what we were doing along with the usual sound bites. The police only made a phone call to check who we were and once the minority of antis had left we then had a vast majority of folk coming out to say hi and ask if they could have some rabbits! We duly gutted a few for them, of course. We should not generalise about the gullibility of the public and assume that an image will suddenly sway a huge majority of them into becoming rabid antis. It will sway some, undoubtedly, those who struggle to have independent thoughts and love jumping on bandwagons in order to feel part of a gang. On the other hand there are tens of thousands of gardeners out there who are definitely not friends of the pigeon who will wholeheartedly agree with keeping numbers down. Now is not the time to hide ourselves behind a camo net. It is time to keep telling everyone what we do and importantly, keep educating folk as to why we do it. We need as much positive re-enforcement in as many places as possible on social media in order to counter the anti's. 👏 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JRDS Posted July 23, 2019 Report Share Posted July 23, 2019 (edited) 2 hours ago, 243deer said: The day that we feel we should have to apologise in any way for shooting pigeons (or any other vermin) to protect crops is the day we should all pack up and go home. I was once part of a team culling a significant number of rabbits at harvest time. We had antis call the police and some local residents looking on in 'horror' at what we were doing along with the usual sound bites. The police only made a phone call to check who we were and once the minority of antis had left we then had a vast majority of folk coming out to say hi and ask if they could have some rabbits! We duly gutted a few for them, of course. We should not generalise about the gullibility of the public and assume that an image will suddenly sway a huge majority of them into becoming rabid antis. It will sway some, undoubtedly, those who struggle to have independent thoughts and love jumping on bandwagons in order to feel part of a gang. On the other hand there are tens of thousands of gardeners out there who are definitely not friends of the pigeon who will wholeheartedly agree with keeping numbers down. Now is not the time to hide ourselves behind a camo net. It is time to keep telling everyone what we do and importantly, keep educating folk as to why we do it. We need as much positive re-enforcement in as many places as possible on social media in order to counter the anti's. Nobody has mentioned apologising just having the remotest bit off common sense might be a good start. The GL's are up for review again at the end of the year and posts like this on Facebook of all places that half the world looks at will do us no favours at all. If you think they will then I feel you are misguided to say the least. Don't think the GL's are set in stone in their current format, far from it I would imagine. Edited July 23, 2019 by JRDS Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rapid .25 Posted July 23, 2019 Report Share Posted July 23, 2019 2 hours ago, Hamster said: 👍 I thought you said never again. 😂 👏 2 hours ago, 243deer said: The day that we feel we should have to apologise in any way for shooting pigeons (or any other vermin) to protect crops is the day we should all pack up and go home. I was once part of a team culling a significant number of rabbits at harvest time. We had antis call the police and some local residents looking on in 'horror' at what we were doing along with the usual sound bites. The police only made a phone call to check who we were and once the minority of antis had left we then had a vast majority of folk coming out to say hi and ask if they could have some rabbits! We duly gutted a few for them, of course. We should not generalise about the gullibility of the public and assume that an image will suddenly sway a huge majority of them into becoming rabid antis. It will sway some, undoubtedly, those who struggle to have independent thoughts and love jumping on bandwagons in order to feel part of a gang. On the other hand there are tens of thousands of gardeners out there who are definitely not friends of the pigeon who will wholeheartedly agree with keeping numbers down. Now is not the time to hide ourselves behind a camo net. It is time to keep telling everyone what we do and importantly, keep educating folk as to why we do it. We need as much positive re-enforcement in as many places as possible on social media in order to counter the anti's. That just about says everything, excellent post,👏 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kitchrat Posted July 23, 2019 Report Share Posted July 23, 2019 Surely a picture or video of a grey horde lifting off a rape or pea field would be better PR than a heap of dead pigeons which are unlikely to all find their way into the food chain?? By the way, how would you move that many, must have a fleet of pick-up trucks.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motty Posted July 23, 2019 Report Share Posted July 23, 2019 5 hours ago, JRDS said: Nobody has mentioned apologising just having the remotest bit off common sense might be a good start. The GL's are up for review again at the end of the year and posts like this on Facebook of all places that half the world looks at will do us no favours at all. If you think they will then I feel you are misguided to say the least. Don't think the GL's are set in stone in their current format, far from it I would imagine. You do realise that the licenses are up for review every year! I shall ask again. In what way will a picture of 985 dead pigeons cause us harm? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JRDS Posted July 23, 2019 Report Share Posted July 23, 2019 (edited) Yes of course I do but I expect next years will be subject to potentially more change than usual. If you have to ask why posting a picture of a thousand dead Pigeons on Facebook is bad for shooting then I give up. Many Forums ban pictures of dead animals, Airgunbbs being one. Public opinion is important whether you like it or not, the public put Politicians in power and they will do anything legislation wise if they feel it a vote winner. Think hand gun ban. Many of the Public will find such pictures totally nauseous. Even if they agree pest control is a necessity there is no need to flaunt things or antagonise the many who sit on the fence or who don't agree with it. The likely scenario of it is increasing numbers of the Public writing to their MP's calling for action to ban it or Packhams crowd funding coffers being swelled to fund yet more legal action against our pastime. Edited July 23, 2019 by JRDS Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zipdog Posted July 23, 2019 Report Share Posted July 23, 2019 There is no point in bringing the wolf to the door though. We have to accept that people, and a lot of them, don't like shooting. Going out, doing what you like, and keeping your mouth shut is great, what the eye doesn't see the heart doesn't grieve. Posting it on social media can only attract negative attention. A photo of 1000 dead pigeons over a stubble field will not be effective in persuading anti shooters to understand our cause what so ever Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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