No7 s ?

[Ultrastu]

I picked up a box of bouraghni 

20b  28 grm no7.5 s 

On Friday and shot them today at some pige over wheat ..

I decided to put my cylinder choke on the bottom barrel and 1/4 on top .

The idea that the 320 pellets of 2.4 mm would fill the open pattern out to 25 / 30 yds .they certainly did .i shot some lovely birds crossing and going over the top  pretty close in and fast .

I even had a crow at about 35 yds and killed him clean .

By contrast some 28 grm hull 7.5s 2.3 mm or so idnt kill as well around 30 yds .

Those italians certainly know how to load a fast punchy cartridge .

Think i might by a slab im impressed .

 

So 2.4 mm is a uk no7.

With around 340 pellets per 28 grm 

Anyone else shoot a no7 ? 

[wymberley]

Yep, both 12 and 20 using 28 and 25g respectively. What just might pay - out of interest if nothing else perhaps - is to count the number of pellets in the load. In my preferred 20 cartridge there are 373 to the ounce - c330 in the load - and I'm happy with that for good reason.

[Walker570]

Shoot 7s all season out of the 410 for partridge and pheasant and also for any pigeon decoying I get and if I do my job then they do theirs.

[figgy]

I use 7.5 on decoyed pigeon.

Used lots of 7 shot game carts in past on partridges and pheasant. It was standard game load years ago before the high bird shooting became so popular.

[Perazzishot]

I think you are better buying a 1000 and shooting a 1000 to make a true judgement.

[Hamster]

I have used 7's since the days you could buy 32g Winchester Trap 1/200 in 7.5's (which were true English 7's), my reasonings were :

1) that Archie Coates recommended the shot size for decoyed birds, having changed his original assessment and even altered the wording on his pigeon shooting books reprint - I own the latter as proof.

2) because my own experimentations for decoyed birds showed me that they were easily up to the job and offered better density, especially through open chokes.

I tend to order clay shooting 7's when I run out, Express World Cup and Eley Superbs among others. 

Edited July 22, 2019 by Hamster

[Ultrastu]

Thanks hamster .

That makes sense .

I think if i could find some no 6.5  / 2.5 mm would be about perfect. But for now these bornaghi carts come pretty close to it .and they are cheap also which is nice .they certainly shot where i expected them to which is half the battle .

[Walker570]

1 hour ago, Hamster said:

I have used 7's since the days you could buy 32g Winchester Trap 1/200 in 7.5's (which were true English 7's), my reasonings were :

1) that Archie Coates recommended the shot size for decoyed birds, having changed his original assessment and even altered the wording on his pigeon shooting books reprint - I own the latter as proof.

2) because my own experimentations for decoyed birds showed me that they were easily up to the job and offered better density, especially through open chokes.

I tend to order clay shooting 7's when I run out, Express World Cup and Eley Superbs among others. 

100%   Just spend a bit more brain power on putting them in the pattern than worring about how another few bits of lead will make the difference to your performance. No apologies for being blunt.

Had a couple of boxes of Bornaghi 410s and they did the job no problem.  Load all of my own now.

Edited July 22, 2019 by Walker570

[figgy]

Bornaghi were the best carts in 28 bore too.

[wymberley]

1 hour ago, Walker570 said:

100%   Just spend a bit more brain power on putting them in the pattern than worring about how another few bits of lead will make the difference to your performance. No apologies for being blunt.

Had a couple of boxes of Bornaghi 410s and they did the job no problem.  Load all of my own now.

I can pick up two different but reasonable quality cartridges from besides where I'm sat, both in 25g and 7 shot - both boxes annotated as 2.4mm. One has a 280 count load and the other 330. If that qualifies as as is highlighted above, then those few bits are going to make a difference -  quite an appreciable one as we're talking pigeon. Still, as is said, ignorance is bliss - what is hit is history and what is missed is mystery.

[Ultrastu]

Thats interesting .

Id guess that the 280 pellet count comes from an italian brand and is 2.4 mm .

And the other an english brand at 2.3 mm for 330 pellets 

?? 

Im probably wrong tho 

[Smokersmith]

10 minutes ago, Ultrastu said:

Thats interesting .

Id guess that the 280 pellet count comes from an italian brand and is 2.4 mm .

And the other an english brand at 2.3 mm for 330 pellets 

?? 

Im probably wrong tho 

I don't think you're too far out.

[wymberley]

50%, both English. Just be patient with the 6.5s, there's nothing new under the sun and what goes round comes round. There are a few about, but now not recently too popular. Used them for many years, but age has caught up and I've downsized from 32g of those (Rottweil) to lighter guns and the 7s.

[GingerCat]

I used some jocker 7.5 that are an English 7 and killed them just as well as with no6 out to 40 yards. It's finding 7 in fibre that I find awkward as I prefer it to plastic. 

[London Best]

I invariably use 12/28/7s.  Always fibre wad, I won’t buy plastic. Try either Express Supreme Game or Hull Imperial Game. Neither are cheap. In the game season I shoot mostly partridges but with a fair smattering of pheasants. I find 28/7s effective out to 45 yards on both. 

[PhilR]

I've been pretty happy using Cheddite Universal Trap 28gm 7.5 (Italian) with fibre wads on pigeon and early season pheasants. 

[London Best]

Yeah, 7’s are deadly on pigeon. Far more clean kills than if you use 5’s where half the birds are walking about with broken wings.

[Walker570]

4 hours ago, wymberley said:

I can pick up two different but reasonable quality cartridges from besides where I'm sat, both in 25g and 7 shot - both boxes annotated as 2.4mm. One has a 280 count load and the other 330. If that qualifies as as is highlighted above, then those few bits are going to make a difference -  quite an appreciable one as we're talking pigeon. Still, as is said, ignorance is bliss - what is hit is history and what is missed is mystery.

Last season...23 days driven...my average with the 410 and 18.7g of 7s was 2.7 and the year before same load was 2.4  ....that's 10gs less than you are talking about.

Head head head...dead dead dead...put them in the pattern

[wymberley]

4 minutes ago, Walker570 said:

Last season...23 days driven...my average with the 410 and 18.7g of 7s was 2.7 and the year before same load was 2.4  ....that's 10gs less than you are talking about.

Head head head...dead dead dead...put them in the pattern

Yep, that 10g can be made up to a degree by more choke.

You have an advantage over me - well, 2 actually - I'm not good enough to rely solely on making head shots - but mainly, I know virtually nothing about 410s. With the 20 and 12 I know that it's only the central 20" of the pattern that is effective when considering the vulnerable area of the quarry.

Purely for debate - should you feel so inclined - and I'm content to accept your thoughts on what the effective 410 central diameter is - what would you say that figure is as it applies to accurate shooting for a head shot and to complement it, how many pellets would you deem necessary on average in order to achieve a minimum strike level for a head shot - pigeons here -  of how many in order to be reasonably certain of achieving a clean kill by a truly aimed shot at an effective range?

As said, not being good enough for purely head shots, I have to rely on taking into account the vulnerable area. My answer to the above is 20" (as said), 5.5 (this is just an average figure and the actual figure for the 20" is 110) and 3. Expressed simply, I need to put 110 pellets in a 20" circle which gives an average strike of 5.5 on the vulnerable area of a pigeon in order to achieve a minimum strike of 3 for each shot in order to be reasonably certain of a clean kill.

[Walker570]

Yes, my pattern testing indicated at 35yrds my full choke in the Yilditz gave a nice tidy pattern about 12 to 14 inches where a snipe would not escape for another 2 inches outside that the pattern was certainly pigeon, partridge, pheasant adequate.  The poor results of of my two seasons are purely down to my poor ability, non of us can be perfect.

[oldypigeonpopper]

3 minutes ago, Walker570 said:

Yes, my pattern testing indicated at 35yrds my full choke in the Yilditz gave a nice tidy pattern about 12 to 14 inches where a snipe would not escape for another 2 inches outside that the pattern was certainly pigeon, partridge, pheasant adequate.  The poor results of of my two seasons are purely down to my poor ability, non of us can be perfect.

hello, i have gone from improved/1/4 to 3/4 full in my Yildiz 12g using 28g 7.5s seems to pattern better with no large holes out to 30/35 yards, 

[Walker570]

Yes, o.p.p but have you counted them all ?

[oldypigeonpopper]

1 minute ago, Walker570 said:

Yes, o.p.p but have you counted them all ?

hello, its not so much a count on a pattern plate but watching where  the shot pellets hit the birds 

[motty]

19 hours ago, Ultrastu said:

I picked up a box of bouraghni 

20b  28 grm no7.5 s 

On Friday and shot them today at some pige over wheat ..

I decided to put my cylinder choke on the bottom barrel and 1/4 on top .

The idea that the 320 pellets of 2.4 mm would fill the open pattern out to 25 / 30 yds .they certainly did .i shot some lovely birds crossing and going over the top  pretty close in and fast .

I even had a crow at about 35 yds and killed him clean .

By contrast some 28 grm hull 7.5s 2.3 mm or so idnt kill as well around 30 yds .

Those italians certainly know how to load a fast punchy cartridge .

Think i might by a slab im impressed .

 

So 2.4 mm is a uk no7.

With around 340 pellets per 28 grm 

Anyone else shoot a no7 ? 

Of course they do the job. At 25-30 yards you could just as easily use an ounce of nines.

[London Best]

Trust me, at 25-30 yards a half ounce of nines works just fine!