discobob Posted September 5, 2019 Report Share Posted September 5, 2019 (edited) The trouble is that if "brexiters" walked on Parliament/big cities that it wouldn't be reported. This can be seen by the veterans marches that have been going on over the past several months with very little coverage. There is far more coverage given to the remain vote, be it in the percentage/bias of news coverage or to the split of opinions of the guests/panels on shows This is a strategy that is repeated time and time again within the EU when something goes against them. - added link - please read between the lines and the comments https://blogs.lse.ac.uk/europpblog/2015/10/19/asking-the-public-twice-why-do-voters-change-their-minds-in-second-referendums-on-eu-treaties/ 15 minutes ago, oowee said: He was brilliant taking interruptions, flack and parying questions at speed. Most impressive. Then I see him leave home with the family in his Bentley all dressed like they have come out of a 30's film set and i think, 'what a ****'. but that is his right Oowee Edited September 5, 2019 by discobob added a link for reference Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnfromUK Posted September 5, 2019 Author Report Share Posted September 5, 2019 2 minutes ago, Mice! said: Boris isn't going to get any votes through. Which is exactly why the Fixed Term Parliament Act is a complete nonsense. It is quite ridiculous that a Government that has lost it's majority (for whatever reason) cannot go to the polls, whereas the Opposition have full (near enough full anyway) control of the votes in Parliament and the calling/timing of any election. It was dreamt up (in a very hasty and ill considered manner) to keep Clegg happy in the coalition. The consequences under other (i.e. non coalition) circumstances were either not considered properly, or deliberately ignored when it all got a bit hard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
discobob Posted September 5, 2019 Report Share Posted September 5, 2019 2 minutes ago, JohnfromUK said: Which is exactly why the Fixed Term Parliament Act is a complete nonsense. It is quite ridiculous that a Government that has lost it's majority (for whatever reason) cannot go to the polls, whereas the Opposition have full (near enough full anyway) control of the votes in Parliament and the calling/timing of any election. It was dreamt up (in a very hasty and ill considered manner) to keep Clegg happy in the coalition. The consequences under other (i.e. non coalition) circumstances were either not considered properly, or deliberately ignored when it all got a bit hard. I would like to draw your attention to my earlier comment - the whole thing now isn't fit for purpose Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TIGHTCHOKE Posted September 5, 2019 Report Share Posted September 5, 2019 Just now, discobob said: I would like to draw your attention to my earlier comment - the whole thing now isn't fit for purpose Hence our earlier comments about Guy fawkes and Oliver cromwell. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
discobob Posted September 5, 2019 Report Share Posted September 5, 2019 1 minute ago, TIGHTCHOKE said: Hence our earlier comments about Guy fawkes and Oliver cromwell. I saw yours - I was just making the point to JohnfromUK about what it is now Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TIGHTCHOKE Posted September 5, 2019 Report Share Posted September 5, 2019 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rewulf Posted September 5, 2019 Report Share Posted September 5, 2019 30 minutes ago, oowee said: and certainly looked more like a PM in waiting. 😂😄 Why, had he had a wash ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raja Clavata Posted September 5, 2019 Report Share Posted September 5, 2019 1 hour ago, Rewulf said: Yes they do, so are they just prolonging the inevitable ? The remainer MPs have been trying to outlaw no deal for some time now, can you no see that this severely inhibits a negotiating stance with Brussels ? It has to stay on the table , or we might as well just bend over ... Yes absolutely but where is the evidence that negotiations were happening. The problem here recently is that Boris was lying about negotiations and has proved he can’t be trusted over no deal. I do believe blocking no deal is the right thing to do. Boris has no majority and therefore mandate to take us out on no deal, in fact even with a majority it can be reasonably claimed he never had a no deal mandate. Even if it’s the default legal position it’s not credible to claim it’s the true will of the people. OK , in what way ? IF , they have large remainer majorities in their constituency, then they could at least use that as an excuse. However, I suspect they are really not interested in what their constituents want, even if they could show some kind of evidence of local polling to support their position ? Its the whole 'I know whats best for you' mentality that grates on many people. Soubry tried to do a walk around in Nottinghams market square to 'show' how much people disliked the idea of leaving, not her own constituency mind, as its not safe for her to walk the streets there. Very few people supported her, and there was considerable hostility (this is before the Goddard incident) Yet the 'rebels' talk about Boris's mandate for no deal ? Where is their mandate for remain ? They have been accused of being self serving, that’s put to bed with them rebelling. They have shown integrity and should be applauded for it even if their actions don’t serve your desires. If someone is employed to do a job, a very well paid job at that, one would expect them to do that job for their employer (us) If they decide that they are going to do a completely different job to that which they were employed for, perhaps even at detriment to their employer, can you honestly say they are acting with integrity ? Not an apples to apples comparison in my view. They clearly believe they are doing what is right and in the national interest. Thats a good question. Arrogance, superiority complex, the prospect of financial or some other reward ? Its not really rational is it? Do they think history will judge them as some kind of saviour of the UK , I should think at least some of them think that ! Personally I dont think they CARE enough about what people think of them, which makes them, really the wrong people for the job. History will show them to have demonstrated integrity and stood for what they believe in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Capt Christopher Jones Posted September 5, 2019 Report Share Posted September 5, 2019 1 hour ago, TIGHTCHOKE said: But he did speek so eliquently! Its all about Boris ( Cummings Puppet )saving face Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welsh1 Posted September 5, 2019 Report Share Posted September 5, 2019 8 minutes ago, Capt Christopher Jones said: Its all about Boris ( Cummings Puppet )saving face If you are happy that we will be on our third date to leave , and with the opposition tying the hands of anyone trying to negotiate a deal with a group that has stated they won't change the deal offered, then your right it's all about saving face.😣 Please tell me how you would negotiate with someone who knows that you won't actually leave because you have told them, and they are not going to change their offer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rewulf Posted September 5, 2019 Report Share Posted September 5, 2019 14 minutes ago, Raja Clavata said: Yes absolutely but where is the evidence that negotiations were happening. The problem here recently is that Boris was lying about negotiations and has proved he can’t be trusted over no deal. I do believe blocking no deal is the right thing to do. Boris has no majority and therefore mandate to take us out on no deal, in fact even with a majority it can be reasonably claimed he never had a no deal mandate. Even if it’s the default legal position it’s not credible to claim it’s the true will of the people. I think youre missing the elephant in the room here. The EU will hinder us in any way to prevent Brexit, ANY Brexit. So have they EVER negotiated in good faith ? Look at it this way, they put forward 'Mays' deal (WA written by them , for them) which was roundly thrown out of the commons 3 times, mostly by the same people who have put the remove no deal vote through now. The EU have flatly refused to change any aspect of that deal. So by removing no deal, and not voting for the only deal available, they hope to usurp the vote for leaving entirely. Now tell me the EU want to negotiate, now tell me these people, whos wages we pay , are acting with integrity. 24 minutes ago, Raja Clavata said: They have been accused of being self serving, that’s put to bed with them rebelling. They have shown integrity and should be applauded for it even if their actions don’t serve your desires. Who are they serving then, their constituents ? The country ? The minority who wanted to remain, where is THEIR mandate ? They have took it upon themselves to decide whats best for us ? The evidence points squarely toward it being THEIR decision , therefore they are serving themselves. 27 minutes ago, Raja Clavata said: Not an apples to apples comparison in my view. They clearly believe they are doing what is right and in the national interest. As above, for who ? Where is the evidence to say they are serving those who voted for them ? 28 minutes ago, Raja Clavata said: History will show them to have demonstrated integrity and stood for what they believe in. That really depends on who wins. If Brexit is a success , they will go down as turncoats, traitors. Or if in 20 years time, and we are a minor backwater of the EUSS, they will be heroes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TIGHTCHOKE Posted September 5, 2019 Report Share Posted September 5, 2019 Heroes my ****! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rewulf Posted September 5, 2019 Report Share Posted September 5, 2019 Just now, TIGHTCHOKE said: Heroes my ****! You vill be sent to ze camps for ze re education for such blasphemy citizen, Report to camp Abbott on Monday for indoctrination, and German lessons, the language of the EUSS IS DEUTSCHE ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TIGHTCHOKE Posted September 5, 2019 Report Share Posted September 5, 2019 I've heard talk of the 4th Reich! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnfromUK Posted September 5, 2019 Author Report Share Posted September 5, 2019 13 minutes ago, welsh1 said: If you are happy that we will be on our third date to leave , and with the opposition tying the hands of anyone trying to negotiate a deal with a group that has stated they won't change the deal offered, then your right it's all about saving face.😣 Please tell me how you would negotiate with someone who knows that you won't actually leave because you have told them, and they are not going to change their offer. Exactly. 2 minutes ago, Rewulf said: Report to camp Abbott on Monday for indoctrination, Ermmm - I think you will find Camp Abbott specialises in Mathematics and Arithmetic, not indoctrination. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rewulf Posted September 5, 2019 Report Share Posted September 5, 2019 2 minutes ago, JohnfromUK said: Ermmm - I think you will find Camp Abbott specialises in Mathematics and Arithmetic, not indoctrination. Of course, that famous economist from the early 21st century, inventor of the Abbotcus, a hero of the New World Order, her IQ of 175 was much appreciated by her party. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oowee Posted September 5, 2019 Report Share Posted September 5, 2019 16 minutes ago, welsh1 said: If you are happy that we will be on our third date to leave , and with the opposition tying the hands of anyone trying to negotiate a deal with a group that has stated they won't change the deal offered, then your right it's all about saving face.😣 Please tell me how you would negotiate with someone who knows that you won't actually leave because you have told them, and they are not going to change their offer. Are you happy that the Tories brought in the most ill considered referendum in history. Are you happy that the whole sorry affair has been created by this government. Well strangely enough neither are the other 34m voters in this country. First you have to get serious with the proposal and set out what you want from it working within the trading framework that the EU has. Then you might stand a chance of sorting it out. It seems like Norway, Canada, Switzerland et al brokered deals that they are happy with but that the UK with its clear understanding of all things EU is unable to. Why do you think that is? Do you think it might be because we have a rather stupid government that is caught between the ridiculous promises it made to voters and the reality of life? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnfromUK Posted September 5, 2019 Author Report Share Posted September 5, 2019 1 minute ago, Rewulf said: Of course, that famous economist from the early 21st century, inventor of the Abbotcus, a hero of the New World Order, her IQ of 175 was much appreciated by her party. And she would tell you that you used to be able to have "indoctrination" done by the NHS, but the Tory Austerity ended that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnfromUK Posted September 5, 2019 Author Report Share Posted September 5, 2019 2 minutes ago, oowee said: Are you happy that the Tories brought in the most ill considered referendum in history It was introduced by the Tory government - to much popular acclaim and had a massive majority (all parties other than SNP) passing the referendum bill in Parliament; Results below. "On the bill's second reading, on 9 June 2015, MPs voted by 544 to 53 in favour of the principle of holding a referendum with only the Scottish National Party opposing the Bill, and by 316 votes to 53 on its third reading in the Commons on 7 September 2015." The same Parliament who are now preventing it's outcome being carried through. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rewulf Posted September 5, 2019 Report Share Posted September 5, 2019 1 minute ago, oowee said: Are you happy that the Tories brought in the most ill considered referendum in history. Are you happy that the whole sorry affair has been created by this government. Well strangely enough neither are the other 34m voters in this country. First you have to get serious with the proposal and set out what you want from it working within the trading framework that the EU has. Then you might stand a chance of sorting it out. It seems like Norway, Canada, Switzerland et al brokered deals that they are happy with but that the UK with its clear understanding of all things EU is unable to. Why do you think that is? Do you think it might be because we have a rather stupid government that is caught between the ridiculous promises it made to voters and the reality of life? What an extremely naive comment, some very strange thinking going on there. We lost the referendum and we shouldnt have = Blame the tories for giving us one. The EU dont want us to leave = Blame the tories. May capitulated to the EU straight away = Blame the tory party as a whole, even though half of them quit the cabinet in disgust. Corbyn whips the labour party into rejecting Mays horrific deal 3 times = Blame the tories. Bojo tries to bluff the EU into removing 1 tiny aspect of the May deal, EU refuses = Bojo is the worst PM in living history. The remainers in the house re write constitutional law to keep us in the EU = Blame the tories ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon R Posted September 5, 2019 Report Share Posted September 5, 2019 Quote Interesting at PMQ's faced with the Kipper in a tail spin that he kept his cool and certainly looked more like a PM in waiting. Among all the differing opinions, we find this comic gem. He looked shell shocked. A rabbit caught in the headlights. He is the best election canpaign material the Tories have ever had. Di Abbott is a bonus. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rewulf Posted September 5, 2019 Report Share Posted September 5, 2019 3 minutes ago, Gordon R said: He looked shell shocked. A rabbit caught in the headlights He always looks a bit spaced out to me , isnt he a weed head ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TIGHTCHOKE Posted September 5, 2019 Report Share Posted September 5, 2019 15 minutes ago, Rewulf said: Of course, that famous economist from the early 21st century, inventor of the Abbotcus, a hero of the New World Order, her IQ of 175 was much appreciated by her party. If she really warrants an Intelligence Quotient of 175 it must have been established after multiple visits! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnfromUK Posted September 5, 2019 Author Report Share Posted September 5, 2019 Just now, TIGHTCHOKE said: it must have been established after multiple visits! One multiple visit I expect., mind you on reflection, it could have been 17.5? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rewulf Posted September 5, 2019 Report Share Posted September 5, 2019 1 minute ago, TIGHTCHOKE said: If she really warrants an Intelligence Quotient of 175 it must have been established after multiple visits! History is written by the victors. Lets just hope these things never come to pass. 1 minute ago, JohnfromUK said: One multiple visit I expect., mind you on reflection, it could have been 17.5? More like it ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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