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Mice!

New gun day 😁

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Completely agree Ultrastu. Flat head paper punching pellets are extremely accurate to a set dusty then go all over, great for rats and pigeon in barns. 

My old BSA was more accurate at range with a heavier pellet, but under 30 yards a lighter pellet was better. Like you say maybe the stabalisation times for twist rate. 

In my FX twist barrel twist rate of 1-19" I've only tried a few different at distance. So I'll take the samples with me next time to the range and test at longer. Apart from the ones giving a group that looked like I used a fishing catty with a handful in the bait cup.

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If a BSA barrel is more accurate at 50 yards than an FX tube - how, on earth can the reverse be true at a greater range? Are you suggesting that a pellet fired from the FX is re aligning itself with the target  as the range increases - is it equipped with a guidance system that I am unaware of or does the pellet fired from a BSA reach 50 yards in tight formation then does something akin to the Red Arrows "Vixen break" as it sees the 50 yard marker?

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 So Glad you asked bruno ..

So the spin given to a pellet , is there to try and equal out any slight weight anomilies inside the pellet . Different pellet different anomily .the spin masks the weight /  size/ length   variations and helps pellets to group roughly in the same place .this spin has another effect .it makes the pellet want to fly in a straight line (and i do mean straight , both up down left right ) the problem is that gravity and wind have a tendancy to pull the pellet down and sideways  .Now the faster  u spin this pellet the more it wants to just go straight .which is great for short range shots  (tight groups ) but at long range this fast spin starts to work against you .it means although the pellet is dropping in an arch the spin is trying to keep the pellet still pointing straight  (along your x hairs if you will ) 

This means that at long range the pellet is now travelling slighlty side ways and wobble sets in .and once it does it quickly gets out of hand  and accuracy goes out the window .There are barrels designed for ling range shooting . They have slower twist rates .they spin the pellet just enough to iron out the weight variations etc .but slow enough to allow the pellet to follow a natural arch all the way to the target .

Equally there are barrels designed to spin a pellet very fast and are used for 10 m or 25 yd competition. 

So with this in mind a bsa barrel designed for up to 50 yds accuracy  (.177) will group very well at that 50 yds  and fx designed for 100 yds will group well at that range ..

Bruno what im getting at is say your fx shoots a 30 mm group at 75 yds .that would be just about acceptable  for hunting pigeons (given u have enough energy of course ) .

And the same gun shoots 25mm groups at 50 yds still acceptable .

And 20 mm at 30 yds .yep that fine too .

But the  bsa shoots 8 mm at 30 .

15 mm 50 yds     but 70 mm at 75 yds 

At 50 yds the bsa holds a better group than the fx  but at 75 the fx wins .

You choose the correct gun for the range and discipline your shooting .

Hope some of this makes sense  .

im hungry  .

 

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You never mentioned the term spin drift as the term for them moving sideways like the spin on a football causing curve in the direction of rotation.

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Not to mention a degree of lift or dip in side winds depending on the direction of rotation and ratio of the twist. 

And then there's corscrewing..... 

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So glad you answered Stu - BUT if you are comparing accuracy twixt one gun and another then you simply cannot include wind because it's an unknown, therefore only gravity effects the flight of a projectile where we are concerned,and, as we all know gravity has zero effect on sideways movement. So if you shoot 2 different barrels down the exact same axis, how is one projectile managing to alter course as it travels further away - it is also constantly losing it's rpm. Let's take a Gyroscope, for example, spin one at 200 rpm and the other at 500 rpm - in the context that we are discussing flight time is waaaay less than a 10 seconds - but does the  slower spinning Gyro veer off course?

 

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All I know is I've broken my gun 😭😭😭

Probably an easy fix, I imagine I've shot more pellets yesterday and today than the old boy i bought the gun off did last year, bolt wasnt feeling great but I carried on and now the bolt wont open.

I've put it away while I have some tea and a Google 😭😭

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The bolt was feeling graunchy if that's a word, using the same pellets as yesterday, the bolt isn't one piece, you lift the bolt and something releases sort of, then pull back to index mag and cock the gun.

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The banjo on you bolt has probably come loose . (It did it on one of my scorpions last year  ) take the breach apart and tighten it back up .dont  keep forcing  it as you will create more damage  

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It may have been the mag was jammed??

I've applied pressure a little forwards and backwards on the magazine while trying to open the bolt and click, bolt opened so I've got the magazine out.

I was expecting the bolt to be free then but it doesn't want to open, so I'm leaving it alone for tonight. 

20200125_205614.jpg.3b17c6e29d55196c77ed2051b9980529.jpg

You can't see in the picture but where my finger is something wants to move but isn't doing. 

1 hour ago, Ultrastu said:

The banjo on you bolt has probably come loose . (It did it on one of my scorpions last year  ) take the breach apart and tighten it back up .dont  keep forcing  it as you will create more damage  

Tell me more stu??

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So the little bar with a ring on the end fastened by a screw fits on the side of the bolt roughly where my blue line finishes  .if it comes loose it starts to spin around rhe bolt and stops u from pulling it backwards  

IMG_20200125_214005.jpg

If its very loose, you might be able to hold the gun upside down , ie scope down instead of up  , and jiggle the bolt back wards .if it does  dont push it back farwards again .cos its way way easier to strip the gun with it backwards  .

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Cheers Stu, I'll have a look on YouTube tomorrow how to get at it, see if I'm up for it😭😭

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hello, i had a R10 in 22 for many years, used  pellet lube,  with a spray in the mags, drop of oil on the bolt and breach seal, never had any problems, for barrel cleaning, cigarette  filters and white spirit or a wool mop, never used a brush

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Did it get fixed Mice? Walk in the park for an engineer such as yourself - don't keep us in suspense - we don't need a blow by blow account, just let us know how many times the other half warned you about "using language like that" and we can paint our own picture.

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9 minutes ago, bruno22rf said:

Did it get fixed Mice? Walk in the park for an engineer such as yourself - don't keep us in suspense - we don't need a blow by blow account, just let us know how many times the other half warned you about "using language like that" and we can paint our own picture.

I haven't touched it.

I watched a video by xtx last night, he makes stripping it look very easy, lots of little springs and ball bearings and pins!!

He also says to empty out the air by dry firing which I cant do at the moment.

I torn between having a go and making things worse or just saying screw fix send it for a tune.

Then my better half will let me have it with the language. 

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Isn't it a case of unscrewing the buddy bottle a turn or so then just firing off into a towel or something - should only take a minute and be pretty quiet? On the other hand the vast majority of victims, sorry, owners of the R10 seem to swear by a Bowkett fettle. I am beginning to think that there may be too many days at the end of your Pay Packet.

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Problem is the bolt doesn't want to cock to fire the air off. Probably no loctite on the bolt when the seals were done. I've got all week to mull it over and watch YouTube videos. 

42 minutes ago, figgy said:

Send it Bowkett.

Looking likely or Ratworks or xtx. Thankfully I didn't buy new and have this happen so another few hundred quid looking likely. 

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You can either unscrew the bottle VERY gently till you get a slight hiss and leave it to empty .or .wind out the air gauge in the same way . (The gauge is probably safer ) the issue with getting the breech block off is that u need the bolt to come backwards to get to a screw that is just infront of where  the mag locates  .

Did you try the upside down wiggle ? 

Edited by Ultrastu

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42 minutes ago, Ultrastu said:

You can either unscrew the bottle VERY gently till you get a slight hiss and leave it to empty .or .wind out the air gauge in the same way . (The gauge is probably safer ) the issue with getting the breech block off is that u need the bolt to come backwards to get to a screw that is just infront of where  the mag locates  .

Did you try the upside down wiggle ? 

I did have a quick look thanks stu, I'd taken the scope off yesterday to get at the mag which I thought was causing the jam,  I had it upside down gave it a shake but there was no rattle. 

We were in and out today so I thought it best to just leave it alone.

45 minutes ago, Ultrastu said:

You can either unscrew the bottle VERY gently till you get a slight hiss and leave it to empty .or .wind out the air gauge in the same way . (The gauge is probably safer

Thanks for that 👍

Most of the strip down looks straightforward apart from a couple of bits to do with the bolt.

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Hi Mice ,  just gently unscrew the gauge a couple of half turns at  time, to empty the air res.  It only takes a couple of minutes.

Edited by Longbower
punctuation.

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If you release the bottle and let the air escape, when you start to disassemble the gun won't the  pressure in the reg make life a little,er, exiting?

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