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Side by Side not firing


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Hi all.

The Father in Law picked up an old SbS, looks like an AYA to me, says "St George Ejector" on the top. It was handed t me with the fore-end off saying "That won't fit back on".

I'm completely new to SbS, so I did a bit of googling and reckon it's a boxlock and the ejectors needed resetting. Sorted that with a bit of brute force, got it back together and now it won't fire.

Upon opening it the safety is set, closing seems to work as expected, all locks up fine but I'm not convinced it's cocking it. Taking the safety off allows the triggers to move freely, but there's no feel of any sear pressure.

Would it need to be cocked manually if someone's been messing with it in bits?

Any help appreciated.

 

 
 

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Can you push/roll them down one at a time against a bit of wood.

If it goes  down and you hear a click you have cocked one hammer, try the other. Then put a sturdy bit of wood up against the firing pins and pull the triggers to release.

If it goes down with you feeling spring pressure then won't stay down and comes back up against spring pressure its not cocking.

If it feels rough or you think you are forcing it stop.

44 minutes ago, ditchman said:

the firing pins look very badly domed.................

I'm with you on this .

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1 minute ago, Dibble said:

Can you push/roll them down one at a time against a bit of wood.

If it goes  down and you hear a click you have cocked one hammer, try the other. Then put a sturdy bit of wood up against the firing pins and pull the triggers to release.

If it goes down with you feeling spring pressure then won't stay down and comes back up against spring pressure its not cocking.

If it feels rough or you think you are forcing it stop.

I'll give it a go, cheers!

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Sounds like someone fired it without the forend on? As someone else said if the cocking dogs don’t move easily up and down...it’s not cocked.....the advice to use a piece of wood to force the cocking dogs (one at a time) up until you hear/feel a click, and cock the gun manually, is good! The strikers protruding beyond the breech face could also indicate the gun has been fired whilst dissembled! 

Forcing the forend on is not a good idea, it may be tight, but you shouldn’t have to force it! Once the gun is cocked it should click on easily!

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24 minutes ago, panoma1 said:

Sounds like someone fired it without the forend on? As someone else said if the cocking dogs don’t move easily up and down...it’s not cocked.....the advice to use a piece of wood to force the cocking dogs (one at a time) up until you hear/feel a click, and cock the gun manually, is good! The strikers protruding beyond the breech face could also indicate the gun has been fired whilst dissembled! 

Forcing the forend on is not a good idea, it may be tight, but you shouldn’t have to force it! Once the gun is cocked it should click on easily!

That's my guess too. Not sure what state it was in when the FiL picked it up but he's not usually one to go pulling triggers without snap caps.

Do the cocking dogs go up or down? 

The forend went on easily once the extractors were reset, is that not expected?

 

Cheers

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The cocking dogs are in the cocked position but the firing pins look like the gun as been fired try pushing the firing pin in, if its solid its possible someone as removed the cocking dogs and fired the gun then put the dogs back in, if that is the case the only way to get them back in the correct position is to take the gun apart.

Picture showing gun in fired position.

boxlock.jpg

Edited by old'un
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42 minutes ago, London Best said:

Yes that sounds right.

Cocking dogs cock downwards. Hold action upside down and press on the edge of a bench or similar. Don’t use a valuable table, considerable pressure is required.

 

Brilliant, thanks! 

41 minutes ago, arjimlad said:

Looks like a Ugartechea or similar to me. 

Just looked them up, certainly looks like one! 

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I've done that to a sxs, fired it without the forend and  barrels on. I'm sure I just put the barrels on open and the forend and then closed the gun to re cock it and click the forend latch closed.

Was years ago so I may have tried all sorts untill I got it cocked. I might have just used the forend to recock it.

Edited by figgy
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8 hours ago, Gordon R said:

It is actually a brand called St George. One for sale on the big site.

Yep, that looks exactly like it! Can't find anything about the brand. I know he paid nowhere near the £400-ish they're asking though!!!!!!!!!!!

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hello, are there any proof marks, i cannot see from your photo, in the Birmingham area there is a road called St George where gun makers were making shotguns, just a thought, although it does look a bit like of foreign manufacture

Edited by oldypigeonpopper
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hello, i found this on a Spanish Gunmakers web site ( Spanish trade marks on Guns) for the serial number prefix  J Z  ? 91655 , these 2 names used the J Z prefix, ARIZAGA FLORENTINO and ARMIS EGO, can you confirm they are J Z ?

Edited by oldypigeonpopper
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16 minutes ago, ditchman said:

those discs can be an absolute B tard to unscrew.....some of them have locking screws some dont...

Yep, seen a few botched attempts at removing these, seen a few gunsmiths with the proper tools struggle to get them out.

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