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Disqualification of a CPSA Member at the World English Sporting Championships 2019 held at Northbrook SC IL USA

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12th March 2020

The CPSA Board reviewed information available with regard to the disqualification of an individual at the WESP 2019 Championships at Northbrook SC IL USA and can confirm that individual is no longer a member of the CPSA.

Under the ICTSC Amity agreement we advised the other member associations of the Boards decision and were informed on the 6th March 2020 that the ICTSA have accepted an application for membership. This means that member can shoot CPSA registered shoots, but scores will not be registered by the CPSA, nor classifications earned, & under our CPSA Championship T&Cs cannot shoot our CPSA Championships.

We the Board understand this matter is of interest to many of our members and we have dealt with a difficult and unfortunate situation for our association and our sport.

Board of Directors
12th March 2020

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I wonder whether that decision was based more on him totally slating them and their development and coaching methods?

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17 minutes ago, Rob85 said:

I wonder whether that decision was based more on him totally slating them and their development and coaching methods?

Or just maybe it has something to do with what happened in Northbrook :hmm:

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Just now, Newbie to this said:

Or just maybe it has something to do with what happened in Northbrook :hmm:

Of course, but that may just be the convenient excuse for them as he's been very critical of them and how they coach. Just an opinion as I don't follow everything that happens in the clay world but I do enjoy watching Ben's videos and to the point manner of shooting and how he breaks things down. It says they reviewed information available but that could be a one sided report because from what I remember he didn't bother challenging anything.

Please don't take this as an impassioned defence of him and alleged cheating, just an opinion as I've seen first hand how companies/bodies/organisations will shaft somebody for their own ends to show to people that they are the big boys.

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He did challenge the original NSCA decision as it was under appeal.

That appeal has been heard and it has subsequently been resolved  hence the decision from the CPSA.  

Everyone has an opinion on it but silence is golden from those involved so the official facts are what they are. If Ben wants to dispute them or set the record straight he can. 

The only people that defended him or offer alternative opinions on PW have never met him but seem to make a point about watching his videos. 🤔😜

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I'm fairly new to all this, so I just want to check on the known facts:

  • Shooter is DQ'd from WESP event by NCSA
  • Shooter appeals DQ
  • Appeal is heard and lost (original decision stands, shooter is DQ'd)
  • CPSA announce that Shooter is no longer a member of the association, but that Shooter has applied and been approved for membership of ICTSC

That is the end of the publicly know facts?

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Quote

The only people that defended him or offer alternative opinions on PW have never met him but seem to make a point about watching his videos. 🤔😜

An astute observation. 😀

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Posted (edited)
  • Shooter is DQ'd from WESP event by the ground not the NSCA (he had chance to appeal but whether he did or not is unknown however he had the chance) this DQ now stands and cannot be appealed.
  • Ground sends disqualification to NSCA with evidence so NSCA consider if any further action is needed, NSCA makes a decision on further action.
  • Shooter appeals this further action (what the further action is remains officially unstated).
  • Appeal is concluded the outcome to the great unwashed is not known .    
  • CPSA reviews the evidence from the NSCA and states he is no longer a member and cannot compete in CPSA championship events due to terms and conditions. The only terms and conditions that stop a current  ICTSC member competing in championship events are ““The CPSA reserve the right to refuse entry to any individual who is under suspension or ban by any other governing body or association. In such circumstances only entry fees will be refunded.”
  • Shooter can shoot normal registered shoots under his ICTSC membership but scores will not count to CPSA averages etc. No idea on prize money though.
Edited by timps

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1 hour ago, timps said:
  • Shooter is DQ'd from WESP event by the ground not the NSCA (he had chance to appeal but whether he did or not is unknown however he had the chance) this DQ now stands and cannot be appealed.
  • Ground sends disqualification to NSCA with evidence so NSCA consider if any further action is needed, NSCA makes a decision on further action.
  • Shooter appeals this further action (what the further action is remains officially unstated).
  • Appeal is concluded the outcome to the great unwashed is not known .    
  • CPSA reviews the evidence from the NSCA and states he is no longer a member and cannot compete in CPSA championship events due to terms and conditions. The only terms and conditions that stop a current  ICTSC member competing in championship events are ““The CPSA reserve the right to refuse entry to any individual who is under suspension or ban by any other governing body or association. In such circumstances only entry fees will be refunded.”
  • Shooter can shoot normal registered shoots under his ICTSC membership but scores will not count to CPSA averages etc. No idea on prize money though.

Thanks, there seems to be lots of nuance and unknowns in this whole thing.

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4 hours ago, timps said:

point about watching his videos.

And being members of the `Thursday` club !

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2 hours ago, akey said:

there seems to be lots of nuance and unknowns in this whole thing.

Perhaps you should read through the other 14 pages on this sordid little saga under "Oh Dear".  The unknowns may then be a little clearer to you !

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Posted (edited)
50 minutes ago, TIGHTCHOKE said:

Another member of the Thursday Club?

Aagh, but the original 2 founding members morphed into one you will recall, and that one found then found the dialogue to hot to handle; so it was more of a shell club, until they could recruit others ! 😂 With the CPSA statement we can probably expect some new members with something to say on the matter !

Edited by JJsDad

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I find it astonishing that some people on social media repeatedly keep asking for evidence of wrongdoing when the accused himself refuses to make a coherent statement about what took place. In the absence of such statement how on earth is anyone supposed to know what took place ? 

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Steve Lovatt as now decided that only competition entries can win High Gun prize at his shoots , so if you cannot shoot CPSA registered shoots because you are 'suspended'  you cannot win any prize money . I thought you had to be a resident of a country you shoot for?

This is a very sorry mess .

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There is plenty of evidence, it has been appealed against and lost. Most probably out of vision of the ordinary man due to NDAs and threats of litigation.

 

He can shoot within the ICTSA and can if allowed shoot CPSA shoots.

 

In 3 years time he will not have any averages or classifications and will have to start as an unclassified shot in whichever disciplines he chooses to shoot.

Just now, Salopian said:

Steve Lovatt as now decided that only competition entries can win High Gun prize at his shoots , so if you cannot shoot CPSA registered shoots because you are 'suspended'  you cannot win any prize money . I thought you had to be a resident of a country you shoot for?

This is a very sorry mess .

Of his own doing!

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Actually I have to disagree , this mess is not of his own doing .

He cheated , he altered his score card , someone in America complained , the Ground ( Northbrook SG Illinoi ) disqualified him and sent details to the NSCA ( the American governing body) NSCA have a track record for backing down when threatened with litigation . So a NDA , none disclosure agreement  was entered into .

This mess has been created because the correct procedure for cheating was not carried out by the Governing Associations  .

Cheating is cheating , no matter how you dress it up and cheats should not prosper .

I am actually amazed that his 'Fan boys ' are going on line and asking "What's happened?"

 

 

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20 minutes ago, Salopian said:

Actually I have to disagree , this mess is not of his own doing .

He cheated , he altered his score card , someone in America complained , the Ground ( Northbrook SG Illinoi ) disqualified him and sent details to the NSCA ( the American governing body) NSCA have a track record for backing down when threatened with litigation . So a NDA , none disclosure agreement  was entered into .

This mess has been created because the correct procedure for cheating was not carried out by the Governing Associations  .

Cheating is cheating , no matter how you dress it up and cheats should not prosper .

I am actually amazed that his 'Fan boys ' are going on line and asking "What's happened?"

Well then, I will disagree too.

He cheated and was caught, all of his own doing!

He has made a career of being the bad-boy of clay pigeon shooting and pushing the rules to the max.

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I think most people go through their clay shooting careers avoiding mess.

A few don’t.

What should we conclude?

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3 minutes ago, Smokersmith said:

What should we conclude?

He makes enjoyable videos 🤔🤔🤔😜😜

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1 hour ago, Salopian said:

Actually I have to disagree , this mess is not of his own doing .

He cheated , he altered his score card , someone in America complained , the Ground ( Northbrook SG Illinoi ) disqualified him and sent details to the NSCA ( the American governing body) NSCA have a track record for backing down when threatened with litigation . So a NDA , none disclosure agreement  was entered into .

This mess has been created because the correct procedure for cheating was not carried out by the Governing Associations  .

Cheating is cheating , no matter how you dress it up and cheats should not prosper .

I am actually amazed that his 'Fan boys ' are going on line and asking "What's happened?"

 

 

Would this NDA stop Ben becoming a NSCA member? or will it stop him competing at NSCA championships?

Only asking as Will Fennel (krieghoff shooter) stated on a previous post Ben is no longer a member which I find odd if Ben had the upper hand with litigation!! Or was there say a compromise...........They had something on Ben/Ben had them on procedure?

For one person that compromise hasn't worked!

Still doesn't explain his sponsors are distancing themselves 🤔🤔🤔🤔

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1 minute ago, Savage10FP said:

Would this NDA stop Ben becoming a NSCA member? or will it stop him competing at NSCA championships?

Only asking as Will Fennel (krieghoff shooter) stated on a previous post Ben is no longer a member which I find odd if Ben had the upper hand with litigation!! Or was there say a compromise...........They had something on Ben/Ben had them on procedure?

For one person that compromise hasn't worked!

Still doesn't explain his sponsors are distancing themselves 🤔🤔🤔🤔

I fully understand why sponsors are pulling away.

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9 minutes ago, TIGHTCHOKE said:

I fully understand why sponsors are pulling away.

Something is amiss! You only have to trawl through the threads on facebook and look at who's posting the "likes" on comments. None of it positive towards BH. But we are talking shooters who are predominantly in the magazines and are at the top winning trophies. Here and in the USA!

🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔

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3 minutes ago, Savage10FP said:

Something is amiss! You only have to trawl through the threads on facebook and look at who's posting the "likes" on comments. None of it positive towards BH. But we are talking shooters who are predominantly in the magazines and are at the top winning trophies. Here and in the USA!

🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔

As you know, I have absolutely nothing to do with Facebook or any of the other social media outlets.

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