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6 minutes ago, Salopian said:

Lancer is the above a statement issued by BASC ?

How come I haven't been emailed?

Reference your post that the Gun Trade and Cartridge Manufacturers WERE informed , are we now saying that they are Liars?

WHO do we believe?

Basc statement. as it says.

 

As for this? "Reference your post that the Gun Trade and Cartridge Manufacturers WERE informed , are we now saying that they are Liars?" point me to where i posted that exactly. Then we can take it from there.

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No, I don`t work for BASC - I wouldn`t want to! But I`ve been a member for 50 years and it pains me to see how these things can spin out of control for want of people actually reading and understanding whats been printed, rather than what they THINK it says.

If BASC are guilty of failing to communicate - and they certainly are - then many members are equally guilty of not listening to whats actually being said.

On the question of "consultation". Steel shot holds no terrors for wildfowlers who`ve used it for years, and for many other shooters who`ve taken the trouble to read up, experiment with it and understand it.

Why would BASC want to consult with the vast majority of it`s membership who, from the evidence of a huge number of online posts, absolutely do not understand it and have an ingrained and irrational fear of it.

There is no lead ban.

An observation. BASC is deeply flawed but seems to be attracting all the flack whilst the other associations get off scott free.

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Did anyone watch the new video on fieldsports tv with some guy from BASC defending their decision. An absolute out and out politician if I ever saw one. Basically saying it was your fault for voting for these people to represent you. It's like he's you allowed us here so we are now going to do what we want with your money. Glad I'm not in BASC! Absolute shower or ....!

Edited by Rob85
Small change
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5 minutes ago, mudpatten said:

No, I don`t work for BASC - I wouldn`t want to! But I`ve been a member for 50 years and it pains me to see how these things can spin out of control for want of people actually reading and understanding whats been printed, rather than what they THINK it says.

If BASC are guilty of failing to communicate - and they certainly are - then many members are equally guilty of not listening to whats actually being said.

On the question of "consultation". Steel shot holds no terrors for wildfowlers who`ve used it for years, and for many other shooters who`ve taken the trouble to read up, experiment with it and understand it.

Why would BASC want to consult with the vast majority of it`s membership who, from the evidence of a huge number of online posts, absolutely do not understand it and have an ingrained and irrational fear of it.

There is no lead ban.

An observation. BASC is deeply flawed but seems to be attracting all the flack whilst the other associations get off scott free.

there is nothing hard about understanding you explain your self to the people who pay your wages when they ask you to you don’t run of and hide and to offer no apology for the farce is beyond insulting 

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5 minutes ago, mudpatten said:

No, I don`t work for BASC - I wouldn`t want to! But I`ve been a member for 50 years and it pains me to see how these things can spin out of control for want of people actually reading and understanding whats been printed, rather than what they THINK it says.

If BASC are guilty of failing to communicate - and they certainly are - then many members are equally guilty of not listening to whats actually being said.

On the question of "consultation". Steel shot holds no terrors for wildfowlers who`ve used it for years, and for many other shooters who`ve taken the trouble to read up, experiment with it and understand it.

Why would BASC want to consult with the vast majority of it`s membership who, from the evidence of a huge number of online posts, absolutely do not understand it and have an ingrained and irrational fear of it.

There is no lead ban.

An observation. BASC is deeply flawed but seems to be attracting all the flack whilst the other associations get off scott free.

BASC is getting the flack on this thread because it’s titled Basc 

there is no lead or plastic ban ? It’s a voluntary transition period of 5 years ending with? 
I do my utmost to comply with all the regulations voluntary or otherwise  and would expect to see more from a organisation I’ve supported for almost as long as you 

moving forward would you care to share the non toxic load with degradable wad that you will be using for the forthcoming season 2.3/4 preferably and the chokes you will be shooting it through 

perhaps as a suggestion Basc could put on some affordable reloding courses to enable its members to develop the skills needed for development of unobtainable cartridges 

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2 hours ago, mudpatten said:

Before resigning from BASC can I ask you to wait for a couple of days. Recent events may not have been entirely as portrayed. I apologise if this sounds a bit cryptic but you`ll see what I mean as it unflods.

.........

No, I don`t work for BASC - I wouldn`t want to! But I`ve been a member for 50 years .....

It sounds as though BASC has a two-tier membership system.   mudpatten gets advance notice of what it to be revealed, but tells the lower class members to shut up and wait.

 

2 hours ago, mudpatten said:

Why would BASC want to consult with the vast majority of it`s membership .....

Just possibly because those are the people who pay for the organisation via their subscriptions.   You are sounding like an advocate of "mushroom management".

 

2 hours ago, mudpatten said:

..... vast majority of it`s membership who, from the evidence of a huge number of online posts, absolutely do not understand it and have an ingrained and irrational fear of it.

I am not sure what you would regard as "a huge number of online posts".   If there were 50 BASC members posting opinions on this subject, that would represent just 0.03% of the total membership.   Perhaps statistics is not your strongest subject?

Have you considered the possibility that some of those members, the ones you describe as irrational and incapable of understanding the situation, might actually be well qualified scientists with many decades of experience in environmental management?

Anybody who has actually read the various posts will have noticed that few, if any, are either pro-lead or anti-steel, but nearly all would like decisions to be based on actual scientific measurements (the stance that all the shooting organisation were pretending to take prior to last week's sudden pronouncement) rather than unverified mathematical models.

If you would like members to continue supporting the various shooting organisation, it might advisable to stop insulting them.

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5 hours ago, Old farrier said:

Why all this secret cryptic stuff 

either tell us the truth or keep quiet 

the leaking of this BEFORE THE MEMBERS  are notified is appalling 

as I see it I’m a member I should be told before every other non member as said previously I get email every week full of advertising 

a important issue like this and I hear from my gunmaker before the organisation that lm a member of thats proposed it 

down right disgraceful behaviour 

there’s more to all of this than we will probably find out 

and wager that there’s money and backhanders going on 

+1

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4 hours ago, clangerman said:

there is nothing hard about understanding you explain your self to the people who pay your wages when they ask you to you don’t run of and hide and to offer no apology for the farce is beyond insulting 

maybe they, like me, just do not see it as a farce.

 

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2 hours ago, scolopax said:

maybe they, like me, just do not see it as a farce.

 

if you don’t think this mess is a farce all i can say anyone making making a mistake this big at work when your asked to explain yourself refuse and see how fast your fired 

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40 minutes ago, clangerman said:

if you don’t think this mess is a farce all i can say anyone making making a mistake this big at work when your asked to explain yourself refuse and see how fast your fired 

I an with him i do not see it as a farce either.

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16 hours ago, mudpatten said:

No, I don`t work for BASC - I wouldn`t want to! But I`ve been a member for 50 years and it pains me to see how these things can spin out of control for want of people actually reading and understanding whats been printed, rather than what they THINK it says.

If BASC are guilty of failing to communicate - and they certainly are - then many members are equally guilty of not listening to whats actually being said.

On the question of "consultation". Steel shot holds no terrors for wildfowlers who`ve used it for years, and for many other shooters who`ve taken the trouble to read up, experiment with it and understand it.

Why would BASC want to consult with the vast majority of it`s membership who, from the evidence of a huge number of online posts, absolutely do not understand it and have an ingrained and irrational fear of it.

There is no lead ban.

An observation. BASC is deeply flawed but seems to be attracting all the flack whilst the other associations get off scott free.

I think the subsequent posts prove a few of your points!

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On 02/03/2020 at 16:57, mick miller said:

Country cover club does all you need. The rest is merely lip service and marketing.

Am somewhat torn to be honest. Over the decades I’ve been a member of most of the main orgs’ and some of the ‘fringe’ and short lived ones.

In what I came to realise was rather naive , I liked to think I was doing my bit by contributing, but disappointment and cynicism took over some time ago. 
A mate cancelled his subs to the GWCT and NGO some time ago, and is insured by CC. Two mates I was talking to over the weekend say they won’t be renewing with BASC and a third with the NGO. Really really annoyed by the way all this was released to be honest, and the contrary (mis) information. 
I have until August to decide. 

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On 02/03/2020 at 18:14, mudpatten said:

Why would BASC want to consult with the vast majority of it`s membership who, from the evidence of a huge number of online posts, absolutely do not understand it and have an ingrained and irrational fear of it.

There is no lead ban.

An observation. BASC is deeply flawed but seems to be attracting all the flack whilst the other associations get off scott free.

Couldnt agree more. Reading through some of the posts on here, I can totally understand why BASC et al released their statement without discussion. There is no lead ban or ban on plastic wads and yet we have people rushing off to get their chokes reamed out, calling for the resignation of the BASC management, packing in shooting and not renewing their shooting org memberships. Most rational people have known for a number of years that sooner or later both lead and plastic wads were going to be subject to legislation and yet a 5 year voluntary phasing out has got us attacking our organisations and each other like a pack of rabid dogs. The anti shooting brigade must be laughing themselves sick reading some of the posts on here; they wont have to protest and legally threaten the government to get their way. There is evidently a small percentage of the shooting fraternity who appear to be happy tearing itself to bits without any help from fat man and Packham.

Edited by JJsDad
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5 minutes ago, B725 said:

Isn't that cutting your nose off to spite your face.

Or standing by your principles. One or t'other.

1 minute ago, JJsDad said:

Couldnt agree more.Reading through some of the posts on here, I can totally understand why BASC et al released their statement without discussion. There is no lead ban or ban on plastic wads and yet we have people rushing off to get their chokes reamed out, calling for the resignation of the BASC management, packing in shooting and not renewing their shooting org memberships. Most rational people have known for a number of years that sooner or later both lead and plastic wads were going to be subject to legislation and yet a 5 year voluntary phasing out has got us attacking our organisations and each other like a pack of rabid dogs. The anti shooting brigade must be laughing themselves sick reading some of the posts on here; they wont have to protest and legally threaten the government to get their way. There appears to be a small percentage of the shooting fraternity who appear to be happy tearing itself to bits without any help from fat man and Packham.

Failing spectacularly to see the bigger picture. You'll fit right in with BASC.

Edited by mick miller
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11 minutes ago, B725 said:

Isn't that cutting your nose off to spite your face.

 

7 minutes ago, mick miller said:

Or standing by your principles. One or t'other.

Failing spectacularly to see the bigger picture. You'll fit right in with BASC.

:good:

and cant afford to throw money away:hmm:

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