Scully Posted April 16, 2020 Report Share Posted April 16, 2020 26 minutes ago, oldypigeonpopper said: hello, the way i see it Scully if your local police force has given the ok go ahead and do help the farmers with correct procedures, those that have said no i am afraid its just that Exactly. 👍 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
old'un Posted April 16, 2020 Report Share Posted April 16, 2020 1 hour ago, Scully said: This, but it is apparent some just can’t help themselves when it comes to telling others what to do. No doubt this post will be followed by more telling others what they should and shouldn’t be doing. Its fine and acceptable for governments to do this, but it’s not for keyboard warriors to do likewise. Some landowners have taken it upon themselves to try and block public footpaths and bridleways locally. This is not acceptable. It may only be rumour, but one confrontation between a couple of locals is said to have become extremely heated. Each to their own. We’re heading for yet another blocked thread as this is now treading an inevitable yet familiar path. There was something about it in a program I watched the other night, apparently with this lockdown there’s more people walking dogs in the countryside, some farmers have seen a 60% increase in dog attacks on lambs, I guess they have had a bad year with the floods, most were unable to-do any autumn sowing so everything was pushed to spring sowing just at the time when they have livestock birthing. If I was a farmer and I had inconsiderate dog owners on top of everything else, I think I might take the law into my own hands and block footpaths and bridleways. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scully Posted April 16, 2020 Report Share Posted April 16, 2020 13 minutes ago, old'un said: There was something about it in a program I watched the other night, apparently with this lockdown there’s more people walking dogs in the countryside, some farmers have seen a 60% increase in dog attacks on lambs, I guess they have had a bad year with the floods, most were unable to-do any autumn sowing so everything was pushed to spring sowing just at the time when they have livestock birthing. If I was a farmer and I had inconsiderate dog owners on top of everything else, I think I might take the law into my own hands and block footpaths and bridleways. I sympathise believe me, I have several friends whom are farmers; one even has a public footpath running at an angle right through his yard ( the father of one got into serious trouble many years ago when the corner of a bier cut across this footpath....the building still stands however ) and another got into trouble for leaving up a sign which stated there was a bull in the field, to deter walkers, when in fact there wasn’t a bull. It’s not up to farmers and landowners to take the land into their own hands; there are already more than enough folk who believe farmers are a law unto themselves as it is. It’s a belief which is understandable at times. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
old'un Posted April 16, 2020 Report Share Posted April 16, 2020 10 minutes ago, Scully said: I sympathise believe me, I have several friends whom are farmers; one even has a public footpath running at an angle right through his yard ( the father of one got into serious trouble many years ago when the corner of a bier cut across this footpath....the building still stands however ) and another got into trouble for leaving up a sign which stated there was a bull in the field, to deter walkers, when in fact there wasn’t a bull. It’s not up to farmers and landowners to take the land into their own hands; there are already more than enough folk who believe farmers are a law unto themselves as it is. It’s a belief which is understandable at times. I had to Google it just encase it was not a typo…..https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bier Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scully Posted April 16, 2020 Report Share Posted April 16, 2020 😂👍 It’s maybe local dialect for ‘cow shed’! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Konor Posted April 16, 2020 Report Share Posted April 16, 2020 4 hours ago, Scully said: This, but it is apparent some just can’t help themselves when it comes to telling others what to do. No doubt this post will be followed by more telling others what they should and shouldn’t be doing. Its fine and acceptable for governments to do this, but it’s not for keyboard warriors to do likewise. Some landowners have taken it upon themselves to try and block public footpaths and bridleways locally. This is not acceptable. It may only be rumour, but one confrontation between a couple of locals is said to have become extremely heated. Each to their own. We’re heading for yet another blocked thread as this is now treading an inevitable yet familiar path. Scully I am not telling clangerman what to do I am disagreeing with his choice to go out. Whether he goes out or not is of no concern to me but if it is alright for him to go out to sit in a field far from anyone shooting it is equally all right for climbers to go out climbing ,kayakers and fishers to go out on the rivers and lakes , mountain bikers to go out into the countryside and a host of other recreational countryside users to go out too. However angling association’s mountaineering associations and probably a host of other sporting governing bodies have come out in support of the lockdown which ,let us not forget, is in place to protect life . What makes Clangerman , not a professional pest controller being called on by the farming community, feel he should be entitled to his sport when so many others are being deprived of theirs. That’s the argument it’s not about dictating to an individual that he can’t go out it’s questioning whether he should and clangerman has made it clear in his posts that I have quoted that he is less concerned about crop protection and more reacting to perceived bullying on this forum. I fail to see how stating the above makes one a keyboard warrior. Clangerman has made statements which others have disagreed with and which he has a hard time countering. I don’t feel the point of the forum is to bully others round to your way of thinking, since when did that work, but I do believe we should be able to state a difference of opinion albeit with the understanding that if you criticise you leave yourself open for criticism. In that way you have a balanced Forum that reflects the range of opinions held by its users as I stated earlier its an open forum and I think it important it reflects a range of opinions especially clangermans as well as everyone else’s. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord v Posted April 16, 2020 Report Share Posted April 16, 2020 So are you saying the pigeon shooting you do is primarily for sport and that crop protection is a side benefit? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Newbie to this Posted April 16, 2020 Report Share Posted April 16, 2020 51 minutes ago, Konor said: if it is alright for him to go out to sit in a field far from anyone shooting it is equally all right for climbers to go out climbing ,kayakers and fishers to go out on the rivers and lakes , mountain bikers to go out into the countryside and a host of other recreational countryside users to go out too. He's not going clay pigeon shooting! He is shooting to protect crops/wildlife. Completely different from the other mentioned hobbies, which serve no benefit other than enjoyment. If he was advocating clay shooting, I'd agree, but you are comparing apples with carrots. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Konor Posted April 16, 2020 Report Share Posted April 16, 2020 45 minutes ago, Lord v said: So are you saying the pigeon shooting you do is primarily for sport and that crop protection is a side benefit? No I’m inferring that the pigeon shooting clangerman is doing is for sport with crop protection as a side benefit. He hasn’t been called out as a necessity he has solicited shooting by his own admission. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord v Posted April 16, 2020 Report Share Posted April 16, 2020 (edited) If he complies with the conditions of the GL (and it is up to him to satisfy himself - not you) then that is it. Doesn't matter who makes the first call. If it satisfies the conditions of the GL then by definition it is essential crop protection. Kayaking (or any other activity you mention) it is not as that is wholly a sport unless you argue all or a significant portion of pigeon shooting is undertaken for sport? Edited April 16, 2020 by Lord v Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Konor Posted April 16, 2020 Report Share Posted April 16, 2020 13 minutes ago, Newbie to this said: He's not going clay pigeon shooting! He is shooting to protect crops/wildlife. Completely different from the other mentioned hobbies, which serve no benefit other than enjoyment. If he was advocating clay shooting, I'd agree, but you are comparing apples with carrots. I don’t think so. I think his forays into the field are solicited and not as a result of a request to protect crops. I think his sole purpose is enjoyment and as such serves no more benefit than the other pastimes mentioned. I’m questioning the hypocrisy that shooting a few pigeon is sufficient reason ,under the guise of protecting the nations crops,to be out as opposed to any other sole sporting activity when the purpose of the lockdown is to prevent all but essential travel to control the spread of the virus. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Konor Posted April 16, 2020 Report Share Posted April 16, 2020 (edited) 33 minutes ago, Lord v said: If he complies with the conditions of the GL (and it is up to him to satisfy himself - not you) then that is it. Doesn't matter who makes the first call. If it satisfies the conditions of the GL then by definition it is essential crop protection. Kayaking (or any other activity you mention) it is not as that is wholly a sport unless you argue all or a significant portion of pigeon shooting is undertaken for sport? I am not asking him to satisfy me , what anyone does is their own business I thought I had made that clear in my previous posts. What I’m saying is that as we are in the grip of a pandemic and that that should override the conditions of the GL and the fact that we are in lockdown and being advised to stay at home seems to bear that out. I would say a significant portion of pigeon shooting is undertaken for sport why shouldn’t it be ,just as a significant amount of pigeon shooting carried out by guides is for income . Would you prefer that only professional pest controllers shot pigeons and that professional guides were not able to sell their services. The bottom line is that pigeon numbers are controlled and crop value maximised who does the shooting to me is immaterial but when we are in the unprecedented grip of a pandemic it behoves us all to act in a manner which restricts the spread of the virus Edited April 16, 2020 by Konor Addition Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JKD Posted April 16, 2020 Report Share Posted April 16, 2020 5 minutes ago, Konor said: I am not asking him to satisfy me , what anyone does is their own business I thought I had made that clear in my previous posts. I have deliberately removed the rest of your post as you keep repeating yourself, and I don't want to keep repeating what others keep on repeating....... This bit of your post you keep ignoring yourself,,,, so why do you keep on and on about,,,,, well, I don't need to say it do I ?! I personally think you love the sound of your own voice ? 😏 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clangerman Posted April 16, 2020 Report Share Posted April 16, 2020 44 minutes ago, Konor said: No I’m inferring that the pigeon shooting clangerman is doing is for sport with crop protection as a side benefit. He hasn’t been called out as a necessity he has solicited shooting by his own admission. that is a outright lie i clearly stated i ASK my perms if help is required i do NOT ask to go out and if you insist on embarrassing your self further i have numerous farmers who HAVE called me to turn out so get your story straight others can also read my comments Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
London Best Posted April 16, 2020 Report Share Posted April 16, 2020 ***, give it a rest lads, PLEASE. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scully Posted April 16, 2020 Report Share Posted April 16, 2020 2 hours ago, Konor said: Scully I am not telling clangerman what to do I am disagreeing with his choice to go out. Whether he goes out or not is of no concern to me but if it is alright for him to go out to sit in a field far from anyone shooting it is equally all right for climbers to go out climbing ,kayakers and fishers to go out on the rivers and lakes , mountain bikers to go out into the countryside and a host of other recreational countryside users to go out too. However angling association’s mountaineering associations and probably a host of other sporting governing bodies have come out in support of the lockdown which ,let us not forget, is in place to protect life . What makes Clangerman , not a professional pest controller being called on by the farming community, feel he should be entitled to his sport when so many others are being deprived of theirs. That’s the argument it’s not about dictating to an individual that he can’t go out it’s questioning whether he should and clangerman has made it clear in his posts that I have quoted that he is less concerned about crop protection and more reacting to perceived bullying on this forum. I fail to see how stating the above makes one a keyboard warrior. Clangerman has made statements which others have disagreed with and which he has a hard time countering. I don’t feel the point of the forum is to bully others round to your way of thinking, since when did that work, but I do believe we should be able to state a difference of opinion albeit with the understanding that if you criticise you leave yourself open for criticism. In that way you have a balanced Forum that reflects the range of opinions held by its users as I stated earlier its an open forum and I think it important it reflects a range of opinions especially clangermans as well as everyone else’s. Fair enough. I didn’t think my response was in response to you personally, to be honest. There has been so many now in various threads I could be wrong though, and in all honesty I can’t be bothered to trawl back through them to find out. In my admittedly limited knowledge of mountaineering , don’t they often set off at base from a popular place, frequented by many other like minded people? If so then it wouldn’t be long before more people showed up, and then you have a group. I may well be wrong. One kayaker on Lake Windermere is fine, but if you allow one then others will follow, and then you’re no longer isolated. A popular fell walk locally is a wonderful way to spend a day, but it’s so popular you’re rarely on your own. Im not suggesting shooters are a special case, but decoying is a genuinely solitary undertaking, well away from prying eyes ( usually ) and local beauty spots. The isolation procedure isn’t a one size fits all procedure, and I’m aware my points of view aren’t convincing, but There has to be a modicum of common sense applied, and if you can satisfy required criteria, then who am I to say nay? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zapp Posted April 16, 2020 Report Share Posted April 16, 2020 This thread is pretty much the same argument going round and round with the same handful of people. Some people are going to go out, some people are going to disagree. At the end of the day its down to peoples conscience and willingness to interpret the current regulations as to what they do. Probably best that those who want to debate this take it up on a personal message group if they wish to, as it's clear many are getting fed up with the constant return to it on thread after thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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