Coronavirus: 38 days when Britain sleepwalked into disaster

[Dave at kelton]

Just now, islandgun said:

Kind  of agree, its hard to see how most of us arn't going to get it over the course of the next few years, it behoves us to try and stay fit as best we can in order to fight it off

 

1 minute ago, islandgun said:

Kind  of agree, its hard to see how most of us arn't going to get it over the course of the next few years, it behoves us to try and stay fit as best we can in order to fight it off

Yep it has never been about us not getting it rather keep the pressure off NHS until it can cope when we do. Then ride it out until we get a vaccine, assuming we ever do.

[islandgun]

1 minute ago, Dave at kelton said:

 

Yep it has never been about us not getting it rather keep the pressure off NHS until it can cope when we do. Then ride it out until we get a vaccine, assuming we ever do.

agreed. Im rapidly advancing in years, with 3 children in higher education, surely one or all of them will bring it home eventually. the best hope is being as fit as i can be and stay out of hospital until they have a surfeit of ventilators and or a vaccine..🙃

[Dave at kelton]

5 minutes ago, islandgun said:

agreed. Im rapidly advancing in years, with 3 children in higher education, surely one or all of them will bring it home eventually. the best hope is being as fit as i can be and stay out of hospital until they have a surfeit of ventilators and or a vaccine..🙃

Yep just keep fit. You are probably fitter than me but I reckoned on being pretty fit with the amount of hill work I do but knocked the carp out of me.

stay safe as best you can. At least we are in rural communities which makes life easier

[islandgun]

1 minute ago, Dave at kelton said:

Yep just keep fit. You are probably fitter than me but I reckoned on being pretty fit with the amount of hill work I do but knocked the carp out of me.

stay safe as best you can. At least we are in rural communities which makes life easier

Cheers TBH I consider myself as fortunate as its possible to get, I have been able to get on with farming and growing without interference..I dont even have to talk to anyone...👍 ...... look after yourselves  

[DoolinDalton]

For what it's worth, I read somewhere that certain people in the Lombardy region of Italy were going to the doctors with similar symptoms to this virus...but this was late last year, if I remember correctly.  The doctors didn't (obviously) know what it was, as the symptoms were not as straightforward as the flu virus. As Lombardy has a large Chinese population, it's possible that the virus was brought to Italy from China earlier than thought. 

[old man]

46 minutes ago, Dave at kelton said:

As always analysis after the event that assumes those with responsibility had full hindsight. Even then I question if it was always going to be a case of too late due to Chinese being less than transparent in the early stages.

On 30 December my wife and I were staying over in a hotel the only other guests being Far Eastern nationals. On 1 January my wife was very ill with raging temperature and severe cough lasting several days. On 4 January I too started with similar symptoms plus difficulty breathing. On 7 January I was rushed into hospital with breathing difficulties, raging temperature, cough and low blood oxygen levels. I was put on oxygen and IV antibiotics, subsequently found to have liver function problems. A week in hospital and two months to fully recover. 
of course there was no testing for Corvid 19, I just had pneumonia. One day I may find if I had it but until then you will not convince me UK did not already have the problem by early January. Interestingly I was also told in hospital that they were struggling to understand why people who had the flu jag were still being hospitalised.

In short no amount of blame after the event makes a jot of difference as far as I am concerned. The whole world was caught napping we are doing the best we can in the circumstances and thank God it is not Corby  and Abbot giving the daily briefing.

 

Maybe the downside of easy global travel?

Pathogens arrive before their existence is known?

 

[Dave at kelton]

2 minutes ago, old man said:

Maybe the downside of easy global travel?

Pathogens arrive before their existence is known?

 

Yep I think the world will be a very different place when this is sorted. If it rejuvenates British manufacturing and engineering it will be real plus. I hope that there will be a very careful analysis of supply chains and with us out of EEC more contracts retained in the UK.

[Scully]

1 hour ago, TIGHTCHOKE said:

Hindsight is a wonderful thing!

This. Italy was also caught on the back foot considering it has a growing population of Chinese, all flitting back and forth over the Chinese New Year. 
I’ve no doubt each government could have done better when scrutinised in hindsight. 

[TRINITY]

16 minutes ago, Dave at kelton said:

Yep I think the world will be a very different place when this is sorted. If it rejuvenates British manufacturing and engineering it will be real plus. I hope that there will be a very careful analysis of supply chains and with us out of EEC more contracts retained in the UK.

Totally agree, the thing that seems to have caught us out the most is the nations total lack of self independence. Seems like we have to rely on other countries for most things. Let's hope that now we are not constrained by the eu that we put our house in order and back our own industries.

[loriusgarrulus]

One thing they know for next time. Get plenty of stocks of hand sanitizer,  toilet paper, rice, pasta, flour and yeast in.

How a virus will spread is anybodies guess.

Edited April 19, 2020 by loriusgarrulus

[lancer425]

I just watched the German video in this thread. Why does that approach not fill me with confidence. And why do i still think we are have been doing the right thing. 

[JohnfromUK]

4 minutes ago, lancer425 said:

And why do i still think we are have been doing the right thing.

We are said to be 'following the science'.  The scientists may make mistakes because this is new ground for them - but they have the right minds, mindset, training and knowledge, and so I agree - it is the right thing to do to follow the science - and we hope that they get it (mainly) right.  I am pleased that 'so far' it looks as if they were right - in that we have NOT overwhelmed the NHS.  The economic situation is however - a worry ........

[lancer425]

23 minutes ago, JohnfromUK said:

We are said to be 'following the science'.  The scientists may make mistakes because this is new ground for them - but they have the right minds, mindset, training and knowledge, and so I agree - it is the right thing to do to follow the science - and we hope that they get it (mainly) right.  I am pleased that 'so far' it looks as if they were right - in that we have NOT overwhelmed the NHS.  The economic situation is however - a worry ........

I agree with that and how i feel. The economy we are just going to have to cope with it, i am sure we are in for a tough time of it as is the rest of the world.

[panoma1]

The article is just too good a chance for the usual suspect critics of BJ, the Government and UK detractors, not to capitalise on it!........As others have said, with hindsight and early warnings from China.......it may have had a lesser impact, not just on the UK, but on the world?

[lancer425]

6 minutes ago, panoma1 said:

The article is just too good a chance for the usual suspect critics of BJ, the Government and UK detractors, not to capitalise on it!........As others have said, with hindsight and early warnings from China.......it may have had a lesser impact, not just on the UK, but on the world?

[henry d]

3 hours ago, islandgun said:

One thing though, just who in the world was prepared ?

No one, all just guesstimates things like this are too difficult to prepare for.

[Retsdon]

33 minutes ago, panoma1 said:

.As others have said, with hindsight and early warnings from China....

26 January 2020 China coronavirus spread is accelerating, Xi Jinping warns....Meanwhile, UK-based researchers have warned of a real possibility that China will not be able to contain the virus..  https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-china-51249208 

And 2 weeks later- here was the man himself.  He wasn't listening...too busy blowing smoke up his own....

 

Edited April 19, 2020 by Retsdon

[oowee]

1 minute ago, Retsdon said:

26 January 2020 China coronavirus spread is accelerating, Xi Jinping warns....Meanwhile, UK-based researchers have warned of a real possibility that China will not be able to contain the virus..  https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-china-51249208 

And 4 days later- here was the man himself.  He wasn't listening...too busy blowing smoke up his own....

 

^^^^^ This. You prepare for these things by making sure the NHS is not running to the max capacity as a matter of routine before a pandemic arrives.

[Yellow Bear]

42 minutes ago, panoma1 said:

The article is just too good a chance for the usual suspect critics of BJ, the Government and UK detractors, not to capitalise on it!........As others have said, with hindsight and early warnings from China.......it may have had a lesser impact, not just on the UK, but on the world?

👍  Got it in one

[lancer425]

Dont think he could do any other but keep it going keep the nhs staff in work with kids in school, locked it down after end of term, the schools seemed slow to lock down but i think it worked out ok. I certainly dont agree with the German blokes take on it lets put it that way.

[Mice!]

16 minutes ago, oowee said:

^^^^^ This. You prepare for these things by making sure the NHS is not running to the max capacity as a matter of routine before a pandemic arrives.

I'd say the response has been far better than I'd expected,  look at the nightingale hospitals,  I doubt they'll be needed but there ready if they are.

Hopefully some people will be able to go back to work after this latest 3 week lockdown which will ease the pressure on some people out there.

[JohnfromUK]

8 minutes ago, Mice! said:

I'd say the response has been far better than I'd expected,  look at the nightingale hospitals,  I doubt they'll be needed but there ready if they are.

/\ This

[Jim Neal]

4 hours ago, Dave at kelton said:

One day I may find if I had it but until then you will not convince me UK did not already have the problem by early January. Interestingly I was also told in hospital that they were struggling to understand why people who had the flu jag were still being hospitalised.

Sorry to hear of your troubles Dave, and I'm glad you and your wife seem to have recovered OK. 

I'd also be really interested to find out as and when you can get tested if it was C19 or not.  I honestly don't think it would have been.  I've heard a few similar stories - I worked in an office building in early March and the boss said they reckon they'd all had it the same time as you, however it didn't spread to their wider family and circle of friends.  Think how many people you were in close contact with during the time you would have been infectious with whatever suspected virus you had.  If it was C19 you'd have been hearing of many other people you know falling victim.

Ultimately, the way C19 has shown itself to rapidly take off when it invades a country indicates that it really isn't likely it was here as early as some people are insisting, otherwise all this lockdown and people dying would have been happening in Jan/Feb and not March/April.

Regarding the flu jab, it's my understanding that seems as the flu virus mutates constantly, they can only immunise against the most recently prevalent one or several viruses so there is still a chance you'll get flu, just much less chance of getting the version you've been immunised against.  I don't know the figures but I'd guess it must be an overwhelming advantage to have the flu jab than not have it, to prevent the illness.  There will always be folk who've had the jab and still get flu, maybe there has been a strain that has come in under the radar and is making its presence felt!

[enfieldspares]

Quote

We are said to be 'following the science'.  The scientists may make mistakes because this is new ground for them - but they have the right minds, mindset, training and knowledge, and so I agree.

That's not wise. Read R V Jones's book about his role in WWII and how it was only at Churchill's insistence that other scientists' dismissal of Jones's ideas was overruled. Just as there a scientists who "use science" to prove or disprove global warming. Scientists are not error free. But regardless when this finally is done there must be no return to "business as usual" with China.

Edited April 19, 2020 by enfieldspares

[JohnfromUK]

2 minutes ago, enfieldspares said:

That's not wise. Read R V Jones's book about his role in WWII and how it was only at Churchill's insistence that other scientists' dismissal of Jones's ideas was overruled. Just as there a scientists who "use science" to prove or disprove global warming. Scientists are not error free. But regardless when this finally is done there must be no return to "business as usual" with China.

I have read (and have a copy of) R.V Jones's book.  He was also a scientist (physicist) himself.  You can usually find a wide range of opinions from scientists.  You have to hope you pick the right ones.

If you don't follow 'the science' - what other policy do you suggest? (Genuine question)