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Steel Cartridges for Pigeons


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I have been asked to supply some birds of prey guys with pigeons. Not having used many steel shells for pigeons, can I ask the PW massive what their preferred brand and shot size of steel cartridges are? I will be using a Browning Maxus auto, mostly over decoys. My thinking was for a 32g No4 but I will listen to advice.  

TIA

 

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If shooting over decoys, 32g 4's are overkill, the shot will frequently pass right through the bird and you will tend to get more runners and pricked birds that will often fly a long way before dropping dead.

My preference is to use a 28g 7.5 Gamebore Supersteel, or equivalent, through no more than half choke.

Cat.

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On 11/05/2020 at 17:31, Catamong said:

My preference is to use a 28g 7.5 Gamebore Supersteel, or equivalent, through no more than half choke

I have half a slab of 7.5s 28g SS left that my pal bought us by accident, my experience is that they are great if you place a head shot on a crosser but poor if you are hitting a going away bird or at range. They resulted in an increased numbers of runners (bad shooting on my side plays a part) and so once they are shot through I will not be getting more.

 

I had to say hitting head shots with them is great, the birds are dead in the air...but my shooting is not accurate enough to use on a going away or distant bird so they are just being used for clays when things ease up. 

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 Any steels work pigeons, Super steels are in many shops, and the 32 grams in 4s and 5s work fine. Even the cheaper 7.5s by gamebore"super steels" work. but found the 28s hit harder than the 24s. They are acctualy faster when you chrono them.

  Use in any choke. I use full or much more than full in any multi choked guns i use where i gan get Good after market options.

Reloading is an option i tend to load most of the time.

 Try other brands besides Gamebore  if available to you in your area. I used to shoot a lot of NSI steels in 4s , but not seen any for about 10 months in any shops i go in.

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On 11/05/2020 at 14:08, kippylawkid said:

I have been asked to supply some birds of prey guys with pigeons. Not having used many steel shells for pigeons, can I ask the PW massive what their preferred brand and shot size of steel cartridges are? I will be using a Browning Maxus auto, mostly over decoys. My thinking was for a 32g No4 but I will listen to advice.  

TIA

 

As small a size as you can obtain. Using #4 for pigeon is overkill and pattern in any case fails before penetration. Get a 30 gram load or 32 gram load of whatever is equivalent to English #6 or English #7 and take your birds at thirty yards or less.

On 12/05/2020 at 10:15, kippylawkid said:

Thanks for the replies folks. I think I'll go with the Super Steel 32g No 5

 

That's good 32 grams is more than enough payload. If you can get English #6 in the same payload it'd be even better though.

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I've been underwhelmed by the Eley 32 no 5 eco wad, the Gamebore dissolvable wad thingies (no3?) are less rubbish but seem to perforate rather than stop, take the dog or you are in for a long walk/run after pigeons.. according to fitbit, last nights flighting accounted for 27,700 steps which is impressive as its less than a mile walk from home but the zoo has asked for steel shot pigeons.

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1 hour ago, PPP said:

I've been underwhelmed by the Eley 32 no 5 eco wad, the Gamebore dissolvable wad thingies (no3?) are less rubbish but seem to perforate rather than stop, take the dog or you are in for a long walk/run after pigeons.. according to fitbit, last nights flighting accounted for 27,700 steps which is impressive as its less than a mile walk from home but the zoo has asked for steel shot pigeons.

I can not coment on the newer degradable wad ammo, Perhaps they are loading them tame, is possible if the wads are less than robust compared to tyical steel type plaswads or reloaded felt and wrapped steel.

Be interesting to see the velocity of these degradable offerings to draw a comparison to perhaps shed some light on performance.

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1 hour ago, lancer425 said:

I can not coment on the newer degradable wad ammo, Perhaps they are loading them tame, is possible if the wads are less than robust compared to tyical steel type plaswads or reloaded felt and wrapped steel.

Be interesting to see the velocity of these degradable offerings to draw a comparison to perhaps shed some light on performance.

As I have mentioned here before, one of the most prolific pigeon shooters in the country rates these new cartridges pretty highly. If others are struggling with them, I would suggest they check their aim.

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3 hours ago, motty said:

As I have mentioned here before, one of the most prolific pigeon shooters in the country rates these new cartridges pretty highly. If others are struggling with them, I would suggest they check their aim.

I can not argue with nor do i want to. :good:

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10 hours ago, motty said:

As I have mentioned here before, one of the most prolific pigeon shooters in the country rates these new cartridges pretty highly. If others are struggling with them, I would suggest they check their aim.

Nothing wrong with aim, read post 

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1 hour ago, PPP said:

Nothing wrong with aim, read post 

I did read it. I have used plenty of steel to good effect. I have no reason to believe that these Eleys would do anything other than a good job. Having read testimony from accomplished shots, they seem capable at good ranges. 

People can all have an off day, and it is perhaps easier to blame the cartridges, rather than suboptimal aiming. 

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Not wanting to quote old retoric, But the old its a poor workman blames his tools statement rings true here. Steel is sharp enough to cut it it is a fact.

 Posted this here more times than i care to remember. But its good research. Ok doves not quite wood pigeons. but still valid i feel.

 

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2 hours ago, lancer425 said:

Not wanting to quote old retoric, But the old its a poor workman blames his tools statement rings true here. Steel is sharp enough to cut it it is a fact.

 Posted this here more times than i care to remember. But its good research. Ok doves not quite wood pigeons. but still valid i feel.

 

Weight for weight that is exactly the same as saying you would shoot a woodcock with the same shot size as you would a snipe. It really doesn't matter how many times you say something as repetition won't make it right if it's wrong.

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7 hours ago, motty said:

I did read it. I have used plenty of steel to good effect. I have no reason to believe that these Eleys would do anything other than a good job. Having read testimony from accomplished shots, they seem capable at good ranges. 

People can all have an off day, and it is perhaps easier to blame the cartridges, rather than suboptimal aiming. 

Agreed, plenty of offdayes here but for once my issue wasn't missing it was hitting and then having to run after the flipping things or watching them flinch and carry on, i was using the 5s (7 or 8 equivalent in lead) and I was flighting rather than decoying so i guess maybe too far for the cartridge, i think they do a 3, maybe ill try those.  

The Gamebore did knock down better (3s) but the shot doesn't seem to dump energy in the bird and goes straight through meaning they 'bleed out' rather than die the same as lead, i guess just something to get used to... the meat was pretty trashed though..

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2 hours ago, London Best said:

Why would you want to shoot snipe and woodcock with different shot sizes?

Don’t get too hung up on theories, just get ‘em shot.

Exactly. :good:Just do it its RIGHT.

2 hours ago, wymberley said:

Weight for weight that is exactly the same as saying you would shoot a woodcock with the same shot size as you would a snipe. It really doesn't matter how many times you say something as repetition won't make it right if it's wrong.

 

1 hour ago, PPP said:

Agreed, plenty of offdayes here but for once my issue wasn't missing it was hitting and then having to run after the flipping things or watching them flinch and carry on, i was using the 5s (7 or 8 equivalent in lead) and I was flighting rather than decoying so i guess maybe too far for the cartridge, i think they do a 3, maybe ill try those.  

The Gamebore did knock down better (3s) but the shot doesn't seem to dump energy in the bird and goes straight through meaning they 'bleed out' rather than die the same as lead, i guess just something to get used to... the meat was pretty trashed though..

Steel kills great , could be its just a poor pattern in your choice of gun, . I have a rule if in doubt add more choke. Works sometimes.

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In view of tightness of steel pattern allegedly  i have 1/4 and cyl through beretta optima hp (which apparently are tight for given constriction) apparently equates to 1/2 and 3/4 which is what i usually use on game and vermin.

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10 minutes ago, PPP said:

In view of tightness of steel pattern allegedly  i have 1/4 and cyl through beretta optima hp (which apparently are tight for given constriction) apparently equates to 1/2 and 3/4 which is what i usually use on game and vermin.

It depends how3 they pattern, if your using 1/2 3/4 normally use that i suppose. A lot of miss info out there on chokes and steel. It simply boils down to what A load does in your gun. Sometimes you got a fixed skeet gun , Easy just find a load that works and whatever that does is that guns ability/ range if you like. You can mess with Velocity and shot sizes sometimes get them doing a good job. But When you got more choke it can help. Multi chokes you can screw in what you want gives any load a few more bites of the patterning cheery.   I like over full Designed and profiled for steel chokes, Many use Ported chokes which can work as wad checking but this depends on the style of porting. Some are straight fluted and work very differently to normal ported choke tubes. The wad stripper chokes like wad wizards and patter masters , again work differently. Steel and steel chokes have come a long way from the aprox 20 though equates to an 1/2 or a mod ish choke constriction in a 12.

It never meant very much in the lead days, it means even less now.

 Try your 1/2 and 3/4 , not guaranteeing anything but i think you will like that steel more with that constriction.

I have a old favourate SxS magnum 12 that  gun is 1/2 and 3/4 choke, and the choking was arrived at by adjustment a few though at a time for a 36 gram BB load it has a broad range of uses as a duck and goose gun. Its all i think you can expect from a general purpose steel shot double on conventional choking.  Put your normal chokes in i think you have a decent chance of choking for that steel.

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44 minutes ago, PPP said:

In view of tightness of steel pattern allegedly  i have 1/4 and cyl through beretta optima hp (which apparently are tight for given constriction) apparently equates to 1/2 and 3/4 which is what i usually use on game and vermin.

I'm always amazed that many people never try tighter chokes with Steel. I have had loads of guns over the years using steel and I can honestly say I've never used a choke under 3/8 choke ,when I move the gun on the chokes you are using haven't even been opened. Try half choke you will be pleasantly surprised how better it kills.

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