12gauge82 Posted June 9, 2020 Report Share Posted June 9, 2020 Farage summed it up for me during the EU Brexit referendum, "for democracy to work, the other side must accept defeat" that is not happening anymore. That coupled with a complete shutdown of freedom of speech unless your on the "right" side. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnphilip Posted June 9, 2020 Report Share Posted June 9, 2020 2 hours ago, Raja Clavata said: John's posts aside, which I agree with 100%, it would appear that we have more or less arrived at the usual old 'uns blaming the young 'uns, that's just so Pigeonwatch... Strange upto your post only one person only mentioned " young ' uns " . " youth is waisted on the young " ......" with age comes wisdom." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raja Clavata Posted June 9, 2020 Report Share Posted June 9, 2020 Just now, johnphilip said: Strange upto your post only one person only mentioned " young ' uns " . " youth is waisted on the young " ......" with age comes wisdom." It's a well trodden path though, that said it's just turned political and so is now heading towards apportioning blame on the lefties and / or Blair and Brown. I did also notice that you were the only one to pick up on my rose tinted glasses comments, which I believe affects all of us, and was certainly not any kind of a slight against the OP. I am aware of your views on wisdom of elders based on your posts in open fora and our discussion in PM. I'm stuck in no mans land on this age thing as I'm certainly not a young 'un but equally unlikely to ever be accepted into the fold of the learned PW elders. Seems a bit of a waste really... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnphilip Posted June 9, 2020 Report Share Posted June 9, 2020 8 minutes ago, Raja Clavata said: It's a well trodden path though, that said it's just turned political and so is now heading towards apportioning blame on the lefties and / or Blair and Brown. I did also notice that you were the only one to pick up on my rose tinted glasses comments, which I believe affects all of us, and was certainly not any kind of a slight against the OP. I am aware of your views on wisdom of elders based on your posts in open fora and our discussion in PM. I'm stuck in no mans land on this age thing as I'm certainly not a young 'un but equally unlikely to ever be accepted into the fold of the learned PW elders. Seems a bit of a waste really... But why would you want to be part of the PW elders , being elder has its drawbacks . The older you get . The younger you become , way beyond the youth .even back to the age of diapers and bibs. Do you still wish to join . 😀😀 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raja Clavata Posted June 9, 2020 Report Share Posted June 9, 2020 4 minutes ago, johnphilip said: But why would you want to be part of the PW elders , being elder has its drawbacks . The older you get . The younger you become , way beyond the youth .even back to the age of diapers and bibs. Do you still wish to join . 😀😀 Well I certainly qualify on the bib front, and I don't mean cycling shorts ;-), all to do with this lock-down belly I seem to have developed, lol. Hold on the diapers though please 😛 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
udderlyoffroad Posted June 9, 2020 Report Share Posted June 9, 2020 4 hours ago, Bobba said: More worryingly are the views of the Mayor of Bristol who regarded critics of what took place as showing an "absolute lack of understanding". Clearly he supports minority mob rule if it suits his personal agenda rather than the views of the majority of the people of Bristol. (Respondents to a newspaper poll showed a majority of Bristol people in favour of retaining the statue) An opportunist out of the same mould as Khan, only there because of a significant number of people would vote for the proverbial donkey with a red rosette. I predict he'll be gone come the next mayoral election, I don't think the good burgers of Bristol are aligned with his views Always assuming that is, one of the opposition parties can muster someone with a personality not surgically removed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yates Posted June 9, 2020 Report Share Posted June 9, 2020 Very thought provoking post island gun. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRINITY Posted June 9, 2020 Report Share Posted June 9, 2020 6 hours ago, matone said: I think that the problem is that the younger generations have realised that there is little chance of `law & order` affecting them,no matter what they get up to. It all stems from the gradual withdrawal of effective local policing ,ie the Police living in your village etc.Certainly my locale is now overun with feral lowlife who have no fear of a policeman!!! I guess inner city areas have been like this for many years. I have said this many times. Law and order has very little to do with the police. All they can do is arrest people and in most cases hold them in custody for 24 hrs but mostly far less , process them and then release them. Their job is then finished. The legal system after the police have done their bit is the real problem. You could increase our police by 10 fold, give them the finest training and equipment. However this would not make the slightest bit of difference while we have our totally pathetic criminal justice system. Tow rags, scumbags, hardened criminals know this and their time in the hands of the police is a very short term inconvenience. Because they know the criminal justice system is stacked welland truly in their favour. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Retsdon Posted June 9, 2020 Report Share Posted June 9, 2020 5 hours ago, JohnfromUK said: the outcome (where a 'one or the other' decision is needed) being decided by the majority view. The problem is that most of the time, it's not the majority view. What was the turnout at the last general election? 67%? And the Conservatives won the highest proportion of the vote in ages with 48%. 48% of 67% is not a majority. The same would go for any other other votes, including the referenda. This all or nothing way of conducting affairs is very damaging to the cohesion of the country. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnfromUK Posted June 9, 2020 Report Share Posted June 9, 2020 6 minutes ago, Retsdon said: The problem is that most of the time, it's not the majority view. What was the turnout at the last general election? 67%? And the Conservatives won the highest proportion of the vote in ages with 48%. 48% of 67% is not a majority. The same would go for any other other votes, including the referenda. This all or nothing way of conducting affairs is very damaging to the cohesion of the country. It 'reflects' the majority view of those who got off their backsi sofas and voted. Which is why in the post I went to some lengths to outline the whole process. It is how democracy works in practice; the lowest grade voter elects representatives - who vote on their behalf. If you can't be bothered to vote (which I assume is the main reason for low turnout as it isn't hard to get various postal etc. votes) then you don't have a say. If you want your voice heard - go and cast your vote. The 'all or nothing' aspect is what most decisions are made of. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
islandgun Posted June 9, 2020 Author Report Share Posted June 9, 2020 2 hours ago, yates said: Very thought provoking post island gun. Cheers yates... The irony for me is that those that seek to end democracy will be ruled without say by those they despise, the rich and powerful....same as it ever was.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Walker570 Posted June 9, 2020 Report Share Posted June 9, 2020 8 hours ago, JohnfromUK said: You are right - and look no further than the Chief Constables ........... who (in Bristol anyway) seem to think that maintaining a semblance of 'order' by allowing blatant law breaking ticks the box on their obsession with performance against targets as a 'success'. That is how and why violence is winning the day. Yep on the nail. Fast promotion for Uni grads back in 1974 and now we have a bunch of yes men just looking for their knighthood. Not real coppers at all and wouldn't know where to start. Saw it happening all the way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
harkom Posted June 9, 2020 Report Share Posted June 9, 2020 25 minutes ago, islandgun said: Cheers yates... The irony for me is that those that seek to end democracy will be ruled without say by those they despise, the rich and powerful....same as it ever was.. You hit the nail on the head right there..... the old double headed coin scenario..? Same rulers under a different logo....💩 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
henry d Posted June 9, 2020 Report Share Posted June 9, 2020 11 hours ago, islandgun said: Im not the sharpest but it seems to me that democracy in Britain is on the way out if you dont like something tear in down, obstruct, demonstrate ... votes for women? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AVB Posted June 9, 2020 Report Share Posted June 9, 2020 I think there are very dangerous times ahead. I previously predicted civil unrest once the economic depression set in. This has been compounded by the mob rule of the BLM movement. There was a nasty conflict in Hoddesdon, Herts, at the weekend where 200 BLM protesters faced off against 200 locals who wanted to protect the war memorials. This didn’t get much air time but you will see much more of this coming up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vince Green Posted June 9, 2020 Report Share Posted June 9, 2020 9 hours ago, clangerman said: democracy isn’t that the stuff where ALL opinions count and ALL views matter hmmmmm? No its where the opinions of the MAJORITY count. Go and look up democracy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
henry d Posted June 9, 2020 Report Share Posted June 9, 2020 8 minutes ago, Vince Green said: No its where the opinions of the MAJORITY count. Go and look up democracy I think you need to look up the different types of democracy there are. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clangerman Posted June 9, 2020 Report Share Posted June 9, 2020 5 minutes ago, Vince Green said: No its where the opinions of the MAJORITY count. Go and look up democracy that’s strange because if it’s the MAJORITY that count why are the MINORITY tearing the country down? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vince Green Posted June 9, 2020 Report Share Posted June 9, 2020 3 hours ago, Retsdon said: The problem is that most of the time, it's not the majority view. What was the turnout at the last general election? 67%? And the Conservatives won the highest proportion of the vote in ages with 48%. 48% of 67% is not a majority. The same would go for any other other votes, including the referenda. This all or nothing way of conducting affairs is very damaging to the cohesion of the country. What you say is true but totally and utterly irrelevant. The others had the chance to vote, that's all that matters 1 minute ago, clangerman said: that’s strange because if it’s the MAJORITY that count why are the MINORITY tearing the country down? Because they are criminals Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clangerman Posted June 9, 2020 Report Share Posted June 9, 2020 1 minute ago, Vince Green said: Because they are criminals you can’t hide who you are for long in this town most pulling colston to the ground were white middle class students probably why they don’t plan on prosecution now i’m amazed so many people could fall for the racist claim rubbish Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vince Green Posted June 9, 2020 Report Share Posted June 9, 2020 3 minutes ago, henry d said: I think you need to look up the different types of democracy there are. Henry, with your track record I think its probably you that should do that. Two hunters were walking through the bush in Africa when a lion roared very loudly and very close. Quietly one of the hunters took off his boots and slipped on a pair of running shoes "don't be silly" said his companion "you can't out run a lion" "I don't need to out run the lion" said the first hunter "I just need to out run you" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Retsdon Posted June 9, 2020 Report Share Posted June 9, 2020 2 minutes ago, Vince Green said: Two hunters were walking through the bush in Africa when a lion roared very loudly and very close. Quietly one of the hunters took off his boots and slipped on a pair of running shoes What did he do with his rifle? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vince Green Posted June 9, 2020 Report Share Posted June 9, 2020 4 minutes ago, clangerman said: you can’t hide who you are for long in this town most pulling colston to the ground were white middle class students probably why they don’t plan on prosecution now i’m amazed so many people could fall for the racist claim rubbish Bit garbled, you start on one line and end on another. Neither of which is actually relevant to the discussion taking place Strange that somebody takes a rope on a demo don't you think? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clangerman Posted June 9, 2020 Report Share Posted June 9, 2020 2 minutes ago, Vince Green said: Bit garbled, you start on one line and end on another. Neither of which is actually relevant to the discussion taking place Strange that somebody takes a rope on a demo don't you think? just the way i put it the misguided are always odd you never know what they carry around Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
captainhastings Posted June 9, 2020 Report Share Posted June 9, 2020 The country is going down the pan at an amazing rate. Take me back to the eighties we didn't have all this tech stuff but there were less rules and regs and more freedom and I know which I would rather. Dread to think were we will be in another 10 years Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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