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Mongrels .....

Well that's what they were called when I was a lad and you had 1 of 3 options to getting rid of them ... 1 was give them away ..... 2 was keep them  ..... 3 was euthanasia...

Now they cost more than pedigree dog ... 

I've just been looking on gumtree and I'd say out of about 100+ ads apart from around 8-10 all the ads were for bloody "crossbreeds" at crazy £1k+ up to £3k+ prices 

Flamin poodle x every other breed going ... jack russels x Chihuahua x pugs x ****zu and so on .

People making £20k+ per litter

When will idiots stop forking out ££££s for mongrels

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Heh, if there are pathetically stupid people out there willing to pay the price, can you blame them and there again they will make super pets. I have seen a few cross breeds over the years, most unplanned with some more recent planned and they have been brilliant little dogs. Bear in mind that the 'pedigree' dogs you all own where once bred from a variety of breeds, HPRs in particular, look at the history of viszlas for instance.  Most labradors today bear no resemblance from the original dogs brought across from the USA. You only have to look at the gait and the coat of many.  Yes, I agree crazy what some people will pay for a dog but it is their money to spend and they are passing it around.

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  • 3 weeks later...

Using spaniels as an example the show Springer and the working Springer  are nothing like each other. I don't care for Crufts they take the dog around the arena with its head pulled high with the lead, hardly how the  dog should walk naturally.

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46 minutes ago, B725 said:

Using spaniels as an example the show Springer and the working Springer  are nothing like each other. I don't care for Crufts they take the dog around the arena with its head pulled high with the lead, hardly how the  dog should walk naturally.

As an out and out ‘dog man’, I don’t care for people who show dogs.

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9 hours ago, B725 said:

Using spaniels as an example the show Springer and the working Springer  are nothing like each other. I don't care for Crufts they take the dog around the arena with its head pulled high with the lead, hardly how the  dog should walk naturally.

Absolutely agreed, I have a working spaniel who is also a much loved pet, but my point is that for the vast majority of the population who don't need a working dog, there's absolutely nothing wrong with a mongrel. 

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10 hours ago, London Best said:

As an out and out ‘dog man’, I don’t care for people who show dogs.

 

I'd say that's a bit harsh when u see the state modern FT bred dogs are in.

Atleast show folk generally think about there matings, not saying I free with some off there ideas.

Labs, skinny whippet looking things, no double coat and no otter tail they wouldn't pass the the breed standard.

Not unusual to she a modern bred lab sitting shivering on a peg or tip toeing round thistles as coat so thin

 

Modern spaniels are no better springers tiny and pure white, cockers even smaller and severely inbred, apart from the many sprockers that still have KC papers as cockers

 

Bizarely ur pure working lines will be nearer breed standards that wot most folk would call ur well bred lines, wether FT or show bred

 

A bloke in my village only just weaned pups off his bitch, she's came in season and trying to get her lined again.

His dogs are rubbish too, lucky if work more than a few days a year and no training/control

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1 hour ago, scotslad said:

 

I'd say that's a bit harsh when u see the state modern FT bred dogs are in.

Atleast show folk generally think about there matings, not saying I free with some off there ideas.

Labs, skinny whippet looking things, no double coat and no otter tail they wouldn't pass the the breed standard.

Not unusual to she a modern bred lab sitting shivering on a peg or tip toeing round thistles as coat so thin

 

Modern spaniels are no better springers tiny and pure white, cockers even smaller and severely inbred, apart from the many sprockers that still have KC papers as cockers

 

Bizarely ur pure working lines will be nearer breed standards that wot most folk would call ur well bred lines, wether FT or show bred

 

A bloke in my village only just weaned pups off his bitch, she's came in season and trying to get her lined again.

His dogs are rubbish too, lucky if work more than a few days a year and no training 


 

I don’t agree that all trial bred dogs have gone that way. There is a fair bit of variance between different lines these days. 

 

Whilst there are absolutely some lines that have gone that way, there are plenty that are what you’d call traditional working types. 
 

I watched the lab champs dvd the other day, didn’t see many dogs that were too small or snipey. 
 

Woman on my shoot has a trial bred lab and it’s massive, not fat just huge frame, would easily carry a goose all day long. 
 

 

 

Same with springers and cockers. Some lines are very small and others are big chunky things. I’ve seen some monster cockers from recent breedings where they are almost 20kg+ and others that are under 10kg.
 

My trial bred springer is a big size, he’s almost the size of a small Labrador just not as heavily boned. Plenty of other dogs like that about as well. Trial bred but just the other week one of the lads in the fowling club said how it’s good he can just sit still calm on the foreshore and not be bouncing around like lots of springers... I thought the stereotype was that trial bred dogs are the ones that can’t sit still? 🤷‍♂️, and on the flip side I saw a very small and skinny springer at a trial a while back, I mentioned it and the judges and other field trial competitors i was with said they thought it was wrong and they didn’t like to see them like that at all.

On that day a solid well built bitch won the day. 

 

 

People need to pay more attention to the type of dog they buy. It’s horses for courses and not all dogs are alike. I wouldn’t buy a deer hound type lurcher for ferreting, just as I wouldn’t buy a whippet Lurcher for running the hills. 

The whole point of breeding certain lines, line breeding and keeping pedigrees is so you can look at good and bad points and try to enhance the good points. Don’t just assume if two people buy a springer they will be exactly alike. This pup I have in now is very different to my older dog. 
 

How many people when looking for a pup really look into the lines of their dog? Find out what the parents, grandparents and even further back were like? 
 

Or how many people who wants to breed their bitch that’s just used on the local farm shoot, look really hard into which stud dog to use? Most I have seen just seem to use a stud dog that is a convenient drive away (the closest) or the latest FTCH without any thought of it marrying up well with their own dogs lines. 
 

 

As I have said before as well, most people pay little attention to the type of ground and shooting they have access to, and go out and buy the dog they like the look of... often making life difficult for themselves. 
 

If I wanted a small dog to hunt bushes and wet ground for snipe, woodcock and small game I would look at the smaller type cockers all day long. I wouldn’t look at them for working on huge patches of hard going ground, or for wildfowling as personally feel they’d struggle. I know people have cockers that they take fowling even but it’s not the dog I would chose for the job myself. 
 

James Flynn is breeding hard going springers to hunt in Ireland, I saw he tried a cocker recently, when I asked him how he was getting n he said he hunts for 2-3 hours minimum on the side of mountains hunting woodcock and despite going into cover the small cockers size couldn’t cope with getting over the cover and ground for hours on end and he ended up rehoming it to someone who didn’t have such hard going work.

I imagine a small cocker like that would have an easy time beating on some smaller pheasant and partridge shoots here in the U.K.  
 


End of the day it’s down to the buyer to do their homework. 

 

 

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Must admit not really bothered by the above, I have a bigger problem with the show types actually breeding and promoting dogs with genetic defects and that will create health's problems in the future.

 

Got it squashed nose/face breeds with breathing issues yet still want faces flatter.

Droopy eyelid breeds

Or others with excessively long/short legs/back or anything else causing movement issues.

Is the pronounced ridge on a Ridgeback not a genetic flaw to?

 

But modern FT are no better springers pure white and smaller to make them look flashier when working, and cockers smaller again to look as if hunting harder.

Whereas if ur working a dog all day u want it talker so covering the ground easier making its day easier

 

Like modern FT modern show and the money in breeding has ruined most dog breeds, bet very few meet the original bred standard now.

Both great ideas originally trying to find best dogs for breeding but became far to specific and veered from the original idea.

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6 hours ago, scotslad said:

But modern FT are no better springers pure white and smaller to make them look flashier when working, and cockers smaller again to look as if hunting harder.

Whereas if ur working a dog all day u want it talker so covering the ground easier making its day easier

 

Like modern FT modern show and the money in breeding has ruined most dog breeds, bet very few meet the original bred standard now.

Both great ideas originally trying to find best dogs for breeding but became far to specific and veered from the original id


Is modern shooting anything like old time shooting though?  
 

Weren’t they small shoots back in the day? Not many people shot game and there was a lot more rough shooting, rabbits galore all across the country, and people shooting for the pot. 
 

Does that sound like game shooting these days?

 

I can only see what I’ve personally seen but a lot of these modern dogs on shoots these days seem to have the drive taken out of them.
 

Dogs that are expected to walk to heel or flush one bush after the next very slowly, working through woods that might have had 10,000 birds put down in it. 
 

Was that the original job of these dogs?
 

I was just under the impression that they would have hard going hunting dogs, that had to go fast and hard because there was hardly any game on the ground. 
 

Hard to find a real hard go’er these days. 
 

 

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My first two shooting dogs where welsh corgis which also doubled as our cattle dogs.  They would work hedgerows as good as any spaniel and knew when I walked out of the kitchen with the shotgun that it was hunting time. If I whistled them and din't have a gun on my arm they knew it was time to fetch the cows from half a mile away.

Most of my shooting back then was rabbiting with a few wild pheasants and a good show of grey partridge and these two little dogs just loved those days.

Our keeper back in the early 80s had a rough haired Jack Russell which would work hedgerows and retrieve a pheasant without a mark, having learned the best place to hold it was at the wing joint.  Smart litle dog.   We all have our favorites and to me it is just a joy to see any well trained dog working the field. There are very few idot dogs, many more idiot owners.

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