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If you shoot over stubble surely it can be argued that by shooting them over stubble you are trying to keep the population in check therefore keeping future damage down to a degree? Especially if there is a roost nearby

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37 minutes ago, Jacko3275 said:

But are you not allowed to prevent for

future Crops if said fields had been attacked and caused serious damage throughout the year before they where harvested ..... the OP never stated what bird were flying over either 

You are allowed to use lethal control if it is reasonable to believe that serious damage may occur.

You would have to also comply with the other conditions of the licence. 

Proof of damage proof of non lethal methods. 

"Future damage" doesn't mean you don't have to comply with the terms of the licence. 

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42 minutes ago, Rob85 said:

If you shoot over stubble surely it can be argued that by shooting them over stubble you are trying to keep the population in check therefore keeping future damage down to a degree? Especially if there is a roost nearby

I am just repeating myself. 

Last response in this because I can't really say any more. 

The GL states that you must, when challenged by an officer of NE or the police be able to provide evidence of "Serious Damage" the licence defines what constitutes proof and it defines serious damage. 

It also states that you must be able to prove that you have taken steps to avoid lethal measure. It outlines several non-lethal methods. 

 

If you think you can meet both of the above great. 

 

If you can't you are breaking the law. 

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On 15/09/2020 at 19:21, ClemFandango said:

If you don't have permission to shoot pigeons where they are landing or feeding you aren't protecting any crops and therefore aren't complying with the terms of the General Licence.

 

Shooting pigeons in these circumstances would be against the law. 

Sorry, but I disagree with this. How would anyone ever know where a pigeon is going to feed? 

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19 hours ago, ClemFandango said:

I am just repeating myself. 

Last response in this because I can't really say any more. 

The GL states that you must, when challenged by an officer of NE or the police be able to provide evidence of "Serious Damage" the licence defines what constitutes proof and it defines serious damage. 

It also states that you must be able to prove that you have taken steps to avoid lethal measure. It outlines several non-lethal methods. 

 

If you think you can meet both of the above great. 

 

If you can't you are breaking the law. 

You are wrong. Non lethal methods do not have to have been tried.

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Is Carlos Fandango a Pseudonym for Chris Packham?

I reckon we are covered by this statement from GL31:

The licence allows action to prevent damage which means the licence can be used if serious damaging is occurring or if there is a strong likelihood that it will occur in the absence of licensed action.

Every pigeon I shoot has a strong likelihood to cause serious damage

 

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2 hours ago, motty said:

You are wrong. Non lethal methods do not have to have been tried.

I had said that I wasn't going to post anymore but as one of the few members on here who I respect I will try to do you the service of a reply. 

This is what the GL31 says regarding non lethal methods. 

b) Before using the licence reasonable endeavours must have been
made to resolve the problem using the lawful methods identified in 
Annex 1 below (unless their use would be impractical, without effect 
or disproportionate in the circumstances) and any other lawful 
methods that may be appropriate in the circumstances. 
c) Reasonable endeavours must continue to be made to resolve the 
problem using such appropriate lawful methods alongside use of the 
licence.

 

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On 16/09/2020 at 08:11, ClemFandango said:

In the wording of the GL it clearly states that you do have to provide proof of Serious Damage. 

"Relevant evidence will include examples of actual losses in the
present year or in recent years"

Again. 

If the OP does not have access to the land the pigeons are feeding on and has to make a serious effort as they have asked in their first post to pull them in as they are going somewhere else he CANNOT provide evidence of actual losses. 

Nor can he provide evidence that preventative measures have been taken. 

The GL doesn't just say "damage" it says "serious damage."  

It goes to the lengths of defining what serious damage means and it describes what methods you must have had in place to reduce such damage. 

Admittedly it doesn't say that you have to cull where the damage is happening but I still think that if you were challenged shooting pigeons in your back garden a mile away from the farm you were protecting crops on you would have no defence when challenged on either of these issues. You cannot prove what crop the birds you are shooting are feeding on and therefore you cannot prove that the damage is serious nor can you prove you have tried to deter them. 

No defence a mile away from the farm?

simplest defence ever. How far will pigeons fly for food from their roosting spot? Over a mile. Done.

He gets the proof of serious damage and attempts to deter them from the farm he shoots for. Simples.

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Hi to shearwater re advice on flighting pigeon . Before you shoot woodpigeon you should read and understand the general licence gl31 if you are using it in England. If you have any questions there is a contact email address on the licence. Please be aware it is illegal, with penalties, to kill or disturb woodpigeon. The only persons allowed to use the license to be exempt from prosecution are the person growing the crops , that are detailed on the license , and persons acting on their behalf. Please be aware if you act on someone’s behalf they are responsible in varying Degrees for your actions. General licence has been used for 25 years . The gl 31 licence gives you all the conditions and instructors how to use it. Their is nothing relating to killing a bird because it’s going eat a crop somewhere or their are two many of them ect. Please be aware of who this license is for it’s the business person who grows the crop . I hope this helps you. I do shoot woodpigeon, l came to this forum for reloading section never been on a internet site before this took me a while to type so please look into the license 

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ClemFandango. Is correct you need to read the licence, and not put your own ideas on it. And if you do end up in court. They will prosecute to the letter of the Law. Your ideas do not matter. The Law is the Law. If you want to change it you need to petition the government.

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