pinch training collar

[darren m]

Does any one know where i can get a pinch training collar from, here in the UK .

thanks

Darren .

[eugene molloy]

Darren,

 

Pinch collars are pretty ugly bits of kit.

 

Do you have a training problem? If so, it might be easier to try a different approach. Let us all know what's bugging you...maybe we can help.

 

Regards

Eug

[new to the flock]

Eugene:

 

A pinch collar looks nasty and mean, however the oppisite is the truth. A properly fitted pinch does no more than lift the skin around the dogs neck and give it a light pinch. Used correctly they are a very responsive collar that trains in a very humane way. On a dog that you are having problems handling in a traditional slip lead or training collar, (choke chain), instead of reefing on the dog possibly, collapsing a wind pipe or dislocating neck disks the pinch cues the dog with a fraction of the force.

The pinch is not a bad bit of kit, but there has been many a bad user. Fitted correctly, and used properly this is a very gentle collar.

Dont let looks decieve.

[Guest Mr Pieman]

NT,

any idea where I can get one for Mrs Pieman

 

PP :thumbs:

[Columbus Polumbus]

Mr P your days are numbered I just emailed this thread to your missus :thumbs:

[Eric Begbie]

Darren,

 

Just like your enquiry about e-collars, the answers to your question about pinch collars are likely to be quite polarised.

 

Basically you have to ask yourself a simple question. Are you happy about using any degree (even small) of pain or discomfort (to Jack, not to yourself!) in your dog training regime?

 

If "properly" used, pinch collars, like e-collars, do work. They are one way of training a dog. I put "properly" in quotation marks because, personally, I do not think it is "proper" to use negative methods of training.

 

If you have got Jack to one year old and to a fairly advanced stage of training without inflicting shocks or pinches, I can see no reason why you should have to change your training philosophy now. What's Jack going to think if the nice guy who praised, treated and petted him for the past year suddenly starts using torture?

 

I fear you could end up with a very mixed up and neurotic dog.

 

Good Luck.

[Fisherman Mike]

If "properly" used, pinch collars, like e-collars, do work. They are one way of training a dog. I put "properly" in quotation marks because, personally, I do not think it is "proper" to use negative methods of training.

I couldnt agree more Eric my thoughts entirely. I am sure some members use them properly with success.

 

The trouble is we are all looking for uptmost perfection in obedience from our dogs and have watched too much of the obedience classes at cruffs.

 

At the end of the day a dog is a dog not a human and will undoubtably want to do at some stage in the field do what dogs want to do. I wouldnt train one of my kids using a pinch collar or e collar and personally I dislike them.

 

I would like to think that any of my dogs obeyed my comannds out of love, loyalty and respect rather than knowing it was going to get a jolt or a buzz or a pinch however severe, if it puts a paw out of line.

 

FM.

[darren m]

fair comments chaps -- i agree that they could inflict pain , no doubt about that , but only if applied with too much pressure.

BUT- i have found that its working for me , i have been using one know on jack for a week and a half and it as cured his pulling and he is walking to heal very well ( while still on lead).

i'm keeping him on lead for a while know until he is perfect , then i will try the transition from lead to no lead , i understand what you mean about dogs knowing when the collar is on or not , i only put it on when working , and use a normal slip lead at excercise/ playtime , i,m quite happy with the results of the pinch collar so far. But do you think it could cause a prob in the collar on/off situation???, as per mentioned in in the electic collar post.

Darren .

[new to the flock]

If "properly" used, pinch collars, like e-collars, do work. They are one way of training a dog. I put "properly" in quotation marks because, personally, I do not think it is "proper" to use negative methods of training.

 

 

 

I would like to think that any of my dogs obeyed my comannds out of love, loyalty and respect rather than knowing it was going to get a jolt or a buzz or a pinch however severe, if it puts a paw out of line.

 

FM.

Eric / FM

 

I have to disagree with the both of you.

 

First off on the pinch collar, did you know that a choke chain or a slip lead is a harsher collar than a properly fitted pinch collar? Also did you know that if your choke collar or slip lead are positioned incorrectly on your dogs neck you can dislocate vertibrae or collapse the animals wind pipe. Pinch collars were not designed to train by pain, or negative reinforcement. They were designed to train with an even pressure delived around the neck of the dog during a correction. My personal dogs see a collar and start bouncing up and down, wagging their tail as they know that they are going to get my undivided attention, and that they are going out to work. They are very happy and have not been trained in any negative way.

 

Secondly e-collars, are not meant to be used as a punishment. They are meant to be used as a signal, the same as a clicker, whistle or a tap on the head for sending. Many of them have an audible signal only button on them for the dog. This is known as a praise button. I hate this argument, for e-collars have a bad reputation in general, this was created by people that did not know or understand what they were doing, and by inferiour units that were on the market years ago.

 

I would like you to consider a dog that was trained 2 years ago. This was a 9 month old lab bitch that was completely deaf. She had lost her hearing due to an accident. How do you take a dog that has no hearing and fabulous potential and turn her into a working retriever? By correctly using an electronic collar to que the dog. The collar stimulation, which is not meant to be painful, was used to que the dog the same as your whistle ques your dog. Consider the stimulation to by like a poke by a finger, a light poke will gain your attention with no pain. After gaining special permission from the governing body for the perticular working dog titles the owner was after, ( collars are not permitted in any trial ), this dog went on to earn her working retriever certificate and her upland certificate. She is also a first class working dog in the marsh and the uplands. In a not so distant past this dog would have been destroyed. Or destined to a non working life.

 

Please dont get me wrong, I am not saying that every dog should be trained using one of these two collars. I have many that have been trained on a flat collar only, however these are options for trainers and dogs when one method or another is not connecting with the animal. All children learn differantly, the same holds true for dogs. USED CORRECTLY these are not negative training tools.

 

It is true that we run with collars on our dogs overhere. Many of us will run with an e-collar, beeper collar, or tracking collar. I would like to see if I can clarify this some.

 

Tracking collars: used primarily on hounds.

We use hounds for rabbits, raccoons, coyottees, mountain lions,wild boar, and bears. On a rabbit you may loose your dog by a mile or so, not to hard to relocate. A coon you may run 2 to 4 miles with the wind blowing the wrong way or rough terrain, difficult to relocate. Many a coon hound has been lost this way, Running bears or cats you may run the same animal for an hour or 6 days. The longest recorded chase is by a Plott hound that ran a black bear for 5 days over 650 miles. Tracking collars save animals lives.

 

Beeper collars: used primarily on pointing dogs.

Last year I dropped one of my English Pointers down without putting his collar on. Did a bad thing, took my eyes off him for a couple of minutes while I watered the little boys tree. You guessed it he was on point, but with no beeper I did not know where. It took me 45 minutes to locate him. The farthest he was away from me at any given time during that 45 minutes was 65 yards. Beeper collars keep dogs from being left behind, or lost.

 

E-collars: used on all types of hunting dogs.

Join me out west for a horseback bird hunt on the plains, or for ptarmagin on the east coast in the barrens, and you will think that you are hunting the deaf lab disscussed earlier. Our dogs are allowed to run BIG. This is best explained by telling you we use binoculars alot. The dogs cannot hear you, but if you have to handle them you can. It is not uncommon to allow your dog out a mile to a mile and a half. If you want to locate birds in these areas you have to run big.

 

I hope this helps to explain what proper use means, and to let you see that when USED CORRECTLY these two collars are very useful training tools designed to help your dog not punish it.

[Fisherman Mike]

Well put nttf, Who could argue with that..

 

Each to his own. By the way I dont use choke chains or slip leads and will never use ecollar or pinch collars.

 

All of the dogs I have trained (8) have been trained with a flat collar.

 

Thankfully I dont need to send my dogs out a mile and a half to flush game and I cant shoot that far anyway :(

 

I cant quite see how a tracking collar could save a hounds life. If a 3/4 tonne black bear decided to stand its ground the dog would be minced meat!

 

I think what you mean is it stops them from getting lost and dying of starvation or being ripped apart by some marauding mountain lion or wolf pack.

 

As you know the scale of things here in good old blighty is a little smaller than you grain growers and generally our dogs are within earshot! (and eyesight)

 

Regards,

 

FM.