Dougy Posted September 24, 2020 Report Share Posted September 24, 2020 I had a call earlier about the fuel meters needed changing to smart meters. Scare tactics used telling me the ones I have are unsafe, and unsuitable. The caller kept pushing telling me I had to have these meters. I told them basically its codswallop and not a legal requirement, and if they insist on these selling tactics I will change provider. Has anyone else had these calls from their fuel provider ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matone Posted September 24, 2020 Report Share Posted September 24, 2020 My provider has gone from a bombardment by letter to an email campaign lol ,they can take a running jump as far as I`m concerned.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B725 Posted September 24, 2020 Report Share Posted September 24, 2020 I have said it before as it's been asked a couple of times at some point you will end up with a smart meter it belongs to the supplier and in the end they will fit them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
derbyduck Posted September 24, 2020 Report Share Posted September 24, 2020 2 minutes ago, Dougy said: I had a call earlier about the fuel meters needed changing to smart meters. Scare tactics used telling me the ones I have are unsafe, and unsuitable. The caller kept pushing telling me I had to have these meters. I told them basically its codswallop and not a legal requirement, and if they insist on these selling tactics I will change provider. Has anyone else had these calls from their fuel provider ? I had a new boiler fitted by British Gas two yrs ago and the salesman that priced everything up told me we needed to have smart meters by law , whilst speaking to someone about it he gave them his paycode number well I asked if got paid for signing up new customers no he said ,two weeks later a bloke comes to fit the meters and says he didn't have them because he flitted about to get the best deals from the energy companies , he said the sales man got £15 for each meter the lying scroat , so the fitter that also worked for British Gas put the meters back in his van and had an early breakfast . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Velocette Posted September 24, 2020 Report Share Posted September 24, 2020 4 minutes ago, B725 said: I have said it before as it's been asked a couple of times at some point you will end up with a smart meter it belongs to the supplier and in the end they will fit them. Not if you tell them that there is a very poor phone signal in the vicinity of the meter which would inhibit the transmission of meter data. This is in fact true but they were happy to accept my declaration that it is the case. No meter for me ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stonepark Posted September 24, 2020 Report Share Posted September 24, 2020 (edited) Just had a new 'reconditioned' meter to replace the curent one which was 20 years old. Energy supplier had been sending letters for months trying to get a smart meter fitted but I insisted would only accept another dumb meter. Finaly arranged a meter refit on condition of amother dumb meter. New 'reconditioned' meter was from early 2010 and started on 250010 (so I would think reused rather than reconditioned & reset). Edited September 24, 2020 by Stonepark Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Medic1281 Posted September 24, 2020 Report Share Posted September 24, 2020 Had my smart meter fitted today. It means I get cheaper rates to charge my car at night. On these rates it’s costing about 2.5pence per mile to run my car. I can live with a smart meter for that! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Heron Posted September 24, 2020 Report Share Posted September 24, 2020 1 hour ago, Dougy said: I had a call earlier about the fuel meters needed changing to smart meters. Scare tactics used telling me the ones I have are unsafe, and unsuitable. The caller kept pushing telling me I had to have these meters. I told them basically its codswallop and not a legal requirement, and if they insist on these selling tactics I will change provider. Has anyone else had these calls from their fuel provider ? Dougy you are absolutely correct as Martin Lewis says on his program you can not be forced to change. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mossy835 Posted September 24, 2020 Report Share Posted September 24, 2020 they cant make you have one, tell them go and jump Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrPhantom Posted September 24, 2020 Report Share Posted September 24, 2020 Am I missing something here? I thought having a smart meter installed was a good thing. No more reading meters and a potentially cheaper tariff. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
enfieldspares Posted September 24, 2020 Report Share Posted September 24, 2020 No not a good thing as it is going to be used like they sell train tickets. Peak times = higher prices. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnfromUK Posted September 25, 2020 Report Share Posted September 25, 2020 10 hours ago, Velocette said: Not if you tell them that there is a very poor phone signal in the vicinity of the meter which would inhibit the transmission of meter data. SMETS 2 (the meters now being installed) do not use the mobile phone network. They have a dedicated network (that has its own different issues and so called 'not spots') that is different to mobile phones. https://www.telegraph.co.uk/property/smart-living/why-you-dont-need-mobile-signal/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnfromUK Posted September 25, 2020 Report Share Posted September 25, 2020 There are (like so many things), both good points and bad points. I see them (for SMETS 2 - SMETS 1 is obsolete and was poor) like this; Bad Reliability of 'smart' part questionable for reasons of both radio signal variation to SMETS network and to in house display It has the capability to remotely 'switch you off' - though this is not likely to be used, it could be hacked/operated in error, or by a rogue company/employee Not all gas meters (e.g. the older large capacity U16) have smart replacements There are issues with flats etc where meters may be at a distance from the consumer If you are interested in saving energy, the relevant information is already available (slightly less conveniently) from existing sources Tariffs will favour those who have smart - and penalise those who don't (as with the old coin or token meters where you paid more) Good Will have favourable tarriffs In theory - more accurate billing A very few people may reduce consumption as a result of using 'smart' display For my own case, I feel fairly 'neutral'. My electricity is a very consistent circa 10 KWh per day - summer and winter. I will learn little My gas varies wildly from very low in the summer to over 100, occasionally even 200 KWh per day on a cold windy winter day. Seeing how that varies in more detail would be mildly informative, but I believe my gas supply is of a type with no smart replacement planned (U16). This is for historical reasons (now removed gas Aga) - but it is not clear if I can go back to a standard meter size without additional survey work (at my expense). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpringDon Posted September 25, 2020 Report Share Posted September 25, 2020 I actually wanted a smart meter so the export from the panels could be optimised. There was a good signal according the installer but it didn’t work. After a few months of calling I gave up. They blamed the “data centre”. Still not working after 2 years. One of the support people claimed that up to 2/3 don’t work properly. If true, that’s another outrageous waste of tax money. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AVB Posted September 25, 2020 Report Share Posted September 25, 2020 The benefit I see is not having to read the meter. I think the downsides that people quote are theoretical. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ehb102 Posted September 25, 2020 Report Share Posted September 25, 2020 16 hours ago, Dougy said: I had a call earlier about the fuel meters needed changing to smart meters. Scare tactics used telling me the ones I have are unsafe, and unsuitable. The caller kept pushing telling me I had to have these meters. I told them basically its codswallop and not a legal requirement, and if they insist on these selling tactics I will change provider. Has anyone else had these calls from their fuel provider ? Ours pushed it until we gave in and said if you must, some threat of not having the same tariff. No space on the board for it 😁 I'm not rewiring the house fot their benefit. I saw a good piece talking about how smart metres could act as a throttle on your power draw at times of national shortage. Interesting thought. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnfromUK Posted September 25, 2020 Report Share Posted September 25, 2020 (edited) 40 minutes ago, ehb102 said: I saw a good piece talking about how smart metres could act as a throttle on your power draw at times of national shortage. There is a long way to go before that is possible - because it would have to selectively turn off 'non essentials'. For example fridges and freezers can be turned off for short periods with no overall detriment, as can many car charging operations (which will be BIG power users). The present generation smart meters have the capability to turn off and on - but there are huge safety issues; Someone for whom power is critical (e,g. medical application) Power off - then user switches on a ring/heater - which doesn't come on - and leaves something flammable nearby - power comes back on remotely - and a fire ensues Gas cannot be safely switched off then on again as there is a risk of air getting in when the pressure is removed. Older gas appliances don't shut off gas when it temporarily stops The idea that when there are lots of electric cars to charge - you tell 'a management system' when you need the car next, so that charging can be fitted into slack periods before then is a sound idea - and load management like that will be needed to prevent massive power demand surges when everyone gets home in the evening - on a windless evening at dusk when there is no wind and solar power - and puts their car on charge and starts cooking dinner, has a shower/bath etc. The present grid and local distribution network is already in many places near maximum capacity, and taking the huge heating and motor fuel away from oil and gas to electricity will need a HUGE increase in transmission and distribution capacity. It is not clear how this is intended to be achieved in the timescales that have been proposed for 'zero carbon' emissions. Edited September 25, 2020 by JohnfromUK Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AVB Posted September 25, 2020 Report Share Posted September 25, 2020 8 minutes ago, JohnfromUK said: The present grid and local distribution network is already in many places near maximum capacity, and taking the huge heating and motor fuel away from oil and gas to electricity will need a HUGE increase in transmission and distribution capacity. It is not clear how this is intended to be achieved in the timescales that have been proposed for 'zero carbon' emissions. That’s not what the national Grid say. Quote “Even if the impossible happened and we all switched to EVs overnight, we think demand would only increase by around 10 per cent. So we’d still be using less power as a nation than we did in 2002 and this is well within the range of manageable load fluctuation.” https://www.nationalgrid.com/stories/journey-to-net-zero/5-myths-about-electric-vehicles-busted Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnfromUK Posted September 25, 2020 Report Share Posted September 25, 2020 9 minutes ago, AVB said: That’s not what the national Grid say. Let me quote my own house. My supply maximum capacity is 80A, or about 16 KW. That is the 'master fuse' rating. Current typical peak demand is about half that with oven, hob, some water heating etc. No electric space heating. A current type car charger is about 7KW, which gives about 30 'miles worth of charge' per hour. So I could have a 7KW car charger and still use my present oven, kettle etc. ....... just. However - IF I had to use electricity for space heating (rather than gas, which currently has about 60 KW max capacity) - and I assume a steady state requirement of about 10 KW, I am in trouble. I would have to turn off the heating when cooking or charging the car. To be sensible with some flexibility, I would need maybe 20- 25 KW total capacity as a minimum. My understanding is that the local network where a substation may support a street or two works on a basis of 'average' where it cannot support every connected house drawing full power all at once - hence the thoughts about 'smart' throttling back. Every gallon of petrol/diesel/heating oil you use is about 30 KWh equivalent of electricity, so if we used no oil or gas based fuels locally, 30 KWhr would need to be available instead of each gallon saved. I am dubious of the grids figures because every winter we hear that there is a risk the grid may have to 'throttle back' large industrial users - and indeed I believe it has occasionally done so - known as 'load shedding'. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
London Best Posted September 25, 2020 Report Share Posted September 25, 2020 Simple, we must all boycott electric vehicles. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TIGHTCHOKE Posted September 25, 2020 Report Share Posted September 25, 2020 17 hours ago, Dougy said: I had a call earlier about the fuel meters needed changing to smart meters. Scare tactics used telling me the ones I have are unsafe, and unsuitable. The caller kept pushing telling me I had to have these meters. I told them basically its codswallop and not a legal requirement, and if they insist on these selling tactics I will change provider. Has anyone else had these calls from their fuel provider ? Utter codswallop! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
udderlyoffroad Posted September 25, 2020 Report Share Posted September 25, 2020 1 hour ago, JohnfromUK said: I would have to turn off the heating when cooking or charging the car. You have that backwards, you would turn off the car charging when heating. See video. Note the device advert-orial-ised below can be fitted regardless of whether you have a smart meter. Further, government grants available for EV charging points require fitting of a 'connected' charging point. 1 hour ago, JohnfromUK said: That is the 'master fuse' rating. It's called a cut-out or service head fuse. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Medic1281 Posted September 25, 2020 Report Share Posted September 25, 2020 Some vehicle charging systems are actually being used to power the grid now. Due to the huge storage capacity of the batteries in these cars it’s possible to power the grid when the car isn’t needed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
discobob Posted September 25, 2020 Report Share Posted September 25, 2020 3 minutes ago, Medic1281 said: Some vehicle charging systems are actually being used to power the grid now. Due to the huge storage capacity of the batteries in these cars it’s possible to power the grid when the car isn’t needed. they are even developing air batteries - so solar power runs compressors to put into a big container and then at night, the compressed air is used to drive turbines to power the grid Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Westward Posted September 25, 2020 Report Share Posted September 25, 2020 1 hour ago, London Best said: Simple, we must all boycott electric vehicles. Excellent idea. And let's lock up all the carbon hysterics at the same time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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